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View Full Version : Trion's Recent Fixes: Too Little Too Late?



Dark3nd Av3ng3r
10-15-2013, 05:39 PM
Y'know, Trion is trying to fix Defiance's issues and they have really hit a few of them on target recently (patch's 1.104 and 1.105), however, too little too late for those that have been playing for 6-7 months now and are looking at these fixes and going "Gee, would have been nice a while ago"

I may be speaking for a minority, I may be speaking for a majority, I do not presume to know, however, I speak the truth as I see it, nothing more.

Defiance has been fun, despite the ups and downs that have had even myself close to quitting at times, but these recent fixes just seem to be coming too late for me. I used to get excited for the fixes. Now, I just read through it and go "Yeah, if you're a newer player, that's great for you", but for the old hands, it's like a slap in the face that it took this long. I have long defended Trion against chronic complainers who claim that the game is unplayable, lacking in fun, or just not worth bothering with, but now I'm tired.

Maybe taking a break and coming back in a few weeks will help, but I doubt it. I'm picking up GTA V Friday and likely won't be seeing much of Paradise for a long while. Maybe not ever again.

Anyway, having nothing else better to do, let me know what you guys think of the more recent fixes and whether or not you feel they're coming just too late for you.

crasher
10-15-2013, 05:53 PM
Y'know, Trion is trying to fix Defiance's issues and they have really hit a few of them on target recently (patch's 1.104 and 1.105), however, too little too late for those that have been playing for 6-7 months now and are looking at these fixes and going "Gee, would have been nice a while ago"

I may be speaking for a minority, I may be speaking for a majority, I do not presume to know, however, I speak the truth as I see it, nothing more.

Defiance has been fun, despite the ups and downs that have had even myself close to quitting at times, but these recent fixes just seem to be coming too late for me. I used to get excited for the fixes. Now, I just read through it and go "Yeah, if you're a newer player, that's great for you", but for the old hands, it's like a slap in the face that it took this long. I have long defended Trion against chronic complainers who claim that the game is unplayable, lacking in fun, or just not worth bothering with, but now I'm tired.

Maybe taking a break and coming back in a few weeks will help, but I doubt it. I'm picking up GTA V Friday and likely won't be seeing much of Paradise for a long while. Maybe not ever again.

Anyway, having nothing else better to do, let me know what you guys think of the more recent fixes and whether or not you feel they're coming just too late for you.

1.) "Gee, would have been nice a while ago"
** Makes me feel like I'm virtually starting the game over with XP and little else.
Sure, I have weapons, but I also got b1tchslapped, and now I have an attitude and a bad taste in my mouth.

2.) "Maybe taking a break and coming back in a few weeks will help, but I doubt it."
** I'll bet that most ppl who 'take a break for a few weeks' find something to do in that few weeks that keeps them moving away. If/when they have to take a break from THAT game - they keep moving on. When's the last time you wanted to play DooM again?

The fixes are for the new players. Nothing in here about retention. Nothing in here to lure back players who are 'Taking a break', once they see that their weapons caches have devalued to shtako.

See tag line for disclaimer.

Dark3nd Av3ng3r
10-15-2013, 06:01 PM
1.) "Gee, would have been nice a while ago"
** Makes me feel like I'm virtually starting the game over with XP and little else.
Sure, I have weapons, but I also got b1tchslapped, and now I have an attitude and a bad taste in my mouth.

2.) "Maybe taking a break and coming back in a few weeks will help, but I doubt it."
** I'll bet that most ppl who 'take a break for a few weeks' find something to do in that few weeks that keeps them moving away. If/when they have to take a break from THAT game - they keep moving on. When's the last time you wanted to play DooM again?

The fixes are for the new players. Nothing in here about retention. Nothing in here to lure back players who are 'Taking a break', once they see that their weapons caches have devalued to shtako.

See tag line for disclaimer.


More blunt than I would have been, but this is a fairly good summary. I forgot to mention that nearly every current weapon will have next to zero value with this most recent patch. Even good Legendary's will lack the automatic damage bonus from rarity. It's a ****ty deal for long time players. They're pushing us away.

BarrySciFi
10-15-2013, 06:49 PM
I very much understand your feelings. I'm just not quite ready to move on, but there is just so much that is annoying about this game and it doesn't have to be that way. It's a shame

Azubaz
10-15-2013, 08:49 PM
Would have been nice back in April, as I have complained about useless stats for that long only to be called a whiner.

Thearl
10-16-2013, 05:27 AM
Maybe I'm insane, but giving me a reason to wring out my inventory and start collecting again is actually going to bring me back to gaming for more than a half hour at a time.

Moogletime
10-16-2013, 05:41 AM
1.) "Gee, would have been nice a while ago"
** Makes me feel like I'm virtually starting the game over with XP and little else.
Sure, I have weapons, but I also got b1tchslapped, and now I have an attitude and a bad taste in my mouth.

2.) "Maybe taking a break and coming back in a few weeks will help, but I doubt it."
** I'll bet that most ppl who 'take a break for a few weeks' find something to do in that few weeks that keeps them moving away. If/when they have to take a break from THAT game - they keep moving on. When's the last time you wanted to play DooM again?

The fixes are for the new players. Nothing in here about retention. Nothing in here to lure back players who are 'Taking a break', once they see that their weapons caches have devalued to shtako.

See tag line for disclaimer.


Damn man, I could not agree more.


If they did this within the first month back in April? Sure, that would have been great!

Now? 7 months later? AND to boot, your making my current legendarys useless with this new mastery crap?

AND no compensation? So what I scrap my SMG I spent $15.00 on? Since its just a purple pretty much now?>

Moogletime
10-16-2013, 05:45 AM
Even good Legendary's will lack the automatic damage bonus from rarity. It's a ****ty deal for long time players. They're pushing us away.

WHAT?

I thought it was just the 4 rolled legendarys that were getting screwed.....even my GOOD ONES too?

Im not kidding, at all, when I say I am done with this game/company now....holy **** I am so done.


Trion, if you ever make a game again....please don't slap the players that have been with you since day 1....that's just stupid and ignorant.



God I would love to be in one of those employee meetings to see what the hell the path of logic that is taken. HOW are some of these choices made?

N3gativeCr33p
10-16-2013, 05:45 AM
Maybe I'm insane, but giving me a reason to wring out my inventory and start collecting again is actually going to bring me back to gaming for more than a half hour at a time.

Then both of us might be a little insane, because I'm thinking of doing the same thing.

Zugo
10-16-2013, 07:32 AM
More blunt than I would have been, but this is a fairly good summary. I forgot to mention that nearly every current weapon will have next to zero value with this most recent patch. Even good Legendary's will lack the automatic damage bonus from rarity. It's a ****ty deal for long time players. They're pushing us away.

Actually, our old purple, and orange weapons WILL receive the damage bonus. I was able to dig a comment out of that thread stating that.

alienstookmybeer
10-16-2013, 07:43 AM
Maybe I'm insane, but giving me a reason to wring out my inventory and start collecting again is actually going to bring me back to gaming for more than a half hour at a time.

And sadly this could be the very reason they aren't fixing current weapons.

Donnyrides
10-16-2013, 07:58 AM
They are making an attempt and they are trying. Whoever it was that said the changes are for the new players is correct. Us old vets don't really get too excited over rolls since we already have piles of guns we love already.

Personally, all I want is for more content. I don't care about perk stacking tricks and reload stacking tricks that are deemed OP or roll tweaks. I'd like to spend our magical development pixie dust on new content and let the other tweak stuff go.

As for the changes that are coming down, at least they are showing that there is still some life on the dev side of this game.

Azubaz
10-16-2013, 08:16 AM
God I would love to be in one of those employee meetings to see what the hell the path of logic that is taken. HOW are some of these choices made?

It involves a spinning dart board, a blindfold, and a gallon of tequila.

Thearl
10-16-2013, 08:42 AM
And sadly this could be the very reason they aren't fixing current weapons.

Probably so, and I really don't mind.
If I was EGO 5K, I wouldn't care because I'm not trying to level up weapons anymore and I'd already have old favorites that don't need fixin.
If I'm still grinding weapon levels, then extra bonuses make for faster grinding, and I just vendor all those purps sitting in my inventory that were in line for grindage.

Now, if the dev's feel guilty about it after the fact, I wouldn't turn down 2 or 3 tier 4 caches as a veteran/loyalty reward to go with my Daredevil title. Free beer is free beer even if its Natty lite or Beast.

Dark3nd Av3ng3r
10-16-2013, 08:44 AM
Actually, our old purple, and orange weapons WILL receive the damage bonus. I was able to dig a comment out of that thread stating that.

You are correct, I discovered last night just before I logged off that this particular aspect of the patch is retroactive, meaning old weapons will receive their rarity damage bonus. Which IMO, is great. I have an OJ VBI AR and an OJ VOT Surge Bolter, both rolled decently well, neither one carrying a Nano, that will now get a damage bonus, so I am a tad excited for that.

Honestly, the only aspect of this that has me even mildly excited is the fact that there is next to no chance of rolling a terrible OJ ever again. On the flip side, I've never been one of the lucky few who pull 2-3 OJ's every day, so the point is moot. If I was, I probably would be on the game grinding away key codes the moment the patch is done and the servers are live.

Deunan
10-16-2013, 09:11 AM
....Even good Legendary's will lack the automatic damage bonus from rarity...Damage bonus from rarity is retroactive:


Hey guys, one little update. For this change:

"All Uncommon+ weapons now gain a boost to their base damage. This scales based on the rarity of the weapon."

The effect is retroactive for your current weapons.



...making my current legendarys useless with this new mastery crap?....There's little loss in utility of current weapons. They will kill mobs as efficiently as they did before the patch, actually more so since their base damage is now increased based on rarity. The big loss is in trade value. There won't be a market for trading them or selling them anymore. Arguably there may be some loss in utility for PvP but based on what other players have observed and relayed regarding their experiences in PvP it doesn't seem like that will be a significant issue given all the other more substantive issues regarding PvP.

It's unfortunate that everything is not being applied retroactively but the flip side is that going forward you won't be getting useless rolls on weapons, damage will scale with rarity, and you'll get an addiotional white bonus for all weapons.

Zugo
10-16-2013, 09:13 AM
You are correct, I discovered last night just before I logged off that this particular aspect of the patch is retroactive, meaning old weapons will receive their rarity damage bonus. Which IMO, is great. I have an OJ VBI AR and an OJ VOT Surge Bolter, both rolled decently well, neither one carrying a Nano, that will now get a damage bonus, so I am a tad excited for that.

Honestly, the only aspect of this that has me even mildly excited is the fact that there is next to no chance of rolling a terrible OJ ever again. On the flip side, I've never been one of the lucky few who pull 2-3 OJ's every day, so the point is moot. If I was, I probably would be on the game grinding away key codes the moment the patch is done and the servers are live.

I have a OJ Vot Surge Bolter with decent rolls as well. I've long since maxed the skill, but I'm going to pull that bad boy out again to pop some heads. Mine ended up with Assassin, +8 mag, crit, and the XP roll was +8% EGO on crit kill. Can't wait to see the additional damage on it.

Bolgor_TheHound
10-16-2013, 09:39 AM
Anyone thats not majorly upset by this patch doesnt have amazing orange gear thats about to become second rate junk...simple as that

crasher
10-16-2013, 10:08 AM
Maybe I'm insane, but giving me a reason to wring out my inventory and start collecting again is actually going to bring me back to gaming for more than a half hour at a time.
Just like we tell the guys who say that A-falls should be insanely hard: You can solo an A-fall at any time with a magnum and no perks. Why don't you?

You could sell/give/crush all your current inventory at any time you wanted. Making me do it at the same time you decide to isn't what some of us consider a good deal.

** I dont think any of us whiners have said the change is a bad idea, and I never meant to convey that myself. What we've been saying is that if you make changes - make them across the board.
This change is similar to announcing a new trade currency in the game starting today. Everyone in the game who has any of the 'old scrip' now has a devaluation of 50%. New Scrip starting today is 100% of yesterdays scrip value, plus 25% because we made it better. The more old scrip you have, the bigger the hit you take.

It's not just a question of normal inflation. Changing the new weapons to better rolls devalues the old weapons with the crummy, and fewer, rolls as far as being able to trade up using the old weapons as partial payment price. The game economy is semi-borked to begin with, the new change just shot a bunch of us vet players in the leg, too as a consequence of having amassed the stuff we needed to play the game
.
That's why we were pushing for our stuff being augmented, or trade-in kiosks made available to users.

The newer guys in general have less/little invested, so they think we're whiners. Nupe. We're the guys who kept the company afloat long enough to make the changes that benefited you and penalized us.


** We asked for the change/fix. We didn't ask to be kicked to the curb. Thats why we were 'whining' during the whole discussion for the last several weeks/months. We didn't want to be left out while Trion caters to the new crowd. 'Wait and see what happens, before you complain' is getting us a system of 'It's too late now'. And we're not happy being treated with disregard for having been patrons who took the chance at the full price game, the DLC of promises that are being dragged out and watered down, and buying all those bits for inventory slots for modded weapons we can't see the syn on, or General Steve's 'Uniform of the Day' no matter which outfit you PAID for.

N3gativeCr33p
10-16-2013, 10:34 AM
And we're not happy being treated with disregard for having been patrons who took the chance at the full price game, the DLC of promises that are being dragged out and watered down, and buying all those bits for inventory slots for modded weapons we can't see the syn on, or General Steve's 'Uniform of the Day' no matter which outfit you PAID for.

And this is pretty much why I will NEVER pay a ridiculous price they're asking for in the costume section of the store...

crasher
10-16-2013, 10:53 AM
And this is pretty much why I will NEVER pay a ridiculous price they're asking for in the costume section of the store...
Understood...
And since thats one of the few revenue streams they use to keep the lights on, it's just a matter of time before they can't anymore.

The company couldn't afford to (chose not to? That's a wise investment decision) send Daha and O/UT to the trade show. Those two had to go on their own dime.

Shadow Andreas
10-16-2013, 11:01 AM
Does this help???

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?137718-OverloadUT-Patch-1.105-coming-tomorrow!

3rdpig
10-16-2013, 11:26 AM
Been playing since day one and the fixes aren't too late for me. Nothing new that I really want has come out yet for the PC and proven itself worthy of taking all my playing time away from other games. And I doubt that will happen, at least for me, until Elder Scrolls Online or Mass Effect 4. Right now I'm playing ME2 and ME3 about as much as I'm playing Defiance. I'm not into games like GTA or straight shooters (specially zombie shooters) , I'm more into traditional RPG and SciFi (notice I did NOT say "SyFy"!) action games.

So for me, I'm still here, I'm disappointed that my existing crap orange weapons won't be getting the new and improved rolls, but it will be rather cleansing to get rid of them and start collecting the new ones.

And I'm going to hang out long enough at least to see if Trion will really blow my socks off with DLC2.

3rdpig
10-16-2013, 11:29 AM
Does this help???

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?137718-OverloadUT-Patch-1.105-coming-tomorrow!

Not really, since those increases are across the board, old weapons and new. The gap between older orange weapons and newer ones will be just as large. It's a shame, but I can see that fixing the older ones is a lose/lose in Trion's mind. It would go a long way to improving their reputation with this community, but it's not going to happen so there's no use continuing to complain about it.

Shogo_Yahagi
10-16-2013, 11:33 AM
Anyone thats not majorly upset by this patch doesnt have amazing orange gear thats about to become second rate junk...simple as that

And they're most likely a $10 Ark Hunter.

Nefarious
10-16-2013, 11:41 AM
And they're most likely a $10 Ark Hunter.

This is the new insult to call noob players.

Your nuthin' but a cheap ten dollah Ark Hunter!

N3gativeCr33p
10-16-2013, 12:31 PM
Understood...
And since thats one of the few revenue streams they use to keep the lights on, it's just a matter of time before they can't anymore.

They need to think about a sales increase by having a sale on these overpriced outfits, I think. Asking more than $5 for a simple cosmetic change (that isn't even seen by others 100% of the time) just isn't good enough. IMHO, of course.

Shadow Andreas
10-16-2013, 12:42 PM
They need to think about a sales increase by having a sale on these overpriced outfits, I think. Asking more than $5 for a simple cosmetic change (that isn't even seen by others 100% of the time) just isn't good enough. IMHO, of course.

I think there is only a couple outfits I would buy if they were less expensive.

IMO there just is no reason to buy re-colored outfits that don't do anything. Trick said on the live stream, the outfits don't do anything because he doesn't want people running around with an outfit because of its benefits. He wants us to express our individualism with our choices....but honestly, you get almost all of the outfits for free if you do the pursuits (just a different color) and we all look like "General Steve" when we are all together anyways. So why bother?

crasher
10-16-2013, 01:09 PM
They need to think about a sales increase by having a sale on these overpriced outfits, I think. Asking more than $5 for a simple cosmetic change (that isn't even seen by others 100% of the time) just isn't good enough. IMHO, of course.
We share many opinions.
This is just one of them.


I think there is only a couple outfits I would buy if they were less expensive.

IMO there just is no reason to buy re-colored outfits that don't do anything. Trick said on the live stream, the outfits don't do anything because he doesn't want people running around with an outfit because of its benefits. He wants us to express our individualism with our choices....but honestly, you get almost all of the outfits for free if you do the pursuits (just a different color) and we all look like "General Steve" when we are all together anyways. So why bother?

Cavadus had a great suggestion (paraphrasing, probably badly) about armour being functional through 'insertable' shielding, so the look was by users preference, and the function was scalable.

As far as your 'Why Bother?' comment: Yep, exactly.

Moogletime
10-16-2013, 01:18 PM
Just like we tell the guys who say that A-falls should be insanely hard: You can solo an A-fall at any time with a magnum and no perks. Why don't you?

You could sell/give/crush all your current inventory at any time you wanted. Making me do it at the same time you decide to isn't what some of us consider a good deal.

** I dont think any of us whiners have said the change is a bad idea, and I never meant to convey that myself. What we've been saying is that if you make changes - make them across the board.
This change is similar to announcing a new trade currency in the game starting today. Everyone in the game who has any of the 'old scrip' now has a devaluation of 50%. New Scrip starting today is 100% of yesterdays scrip value, plus 25% because we made it better. The more old scrip you have, the bigger the hit you take.

It's not just a question of normal inflation. Changing the new weapons to better rolls devalues the old weapons with the crummy, and fewer, rolls as far as being able to trade up using the old weapons as partial payment price. The game economy is semi-borked to begin with, the new change just shot a bunch of us vet players in the leg, too as a consequence of having amassed the stuff we needed to play the game
.
That's why we were pushing for our stuff being augmented, or trade-in kiosks made available to users.

The newer guys in general have less/little invested, so they think we're whiners. Nupe. We're the guys who kept the company afloat long enough to make the changes that benefited you and penalized us.


** We asked for the change/fix. We didn't ask to be kicked to the curb. Thats why we were 'whining' during the whole discussion for the last several weeks/months. We didn't want to be left out while Trion caters to the new crowd. 'Wait and see what happens, before you complain' is getting us a system of 'It's too late now'. And we're not happy being treated with disregard for having been patrons who took the chance at the full price game, the DLC of promises that are being dragged out and watered down, and buying all those bits for inventory slots for modded weapons we can't see the syn on, or General Steve's 'Uniform of the Day' no matter which outfit you PAID for.

As trhere is not a horrible amount of us left (day 1 players) I want to say thank you on behalf of our fallen brothers (left the game, banhammer, etc) because if all these new noolbets knew how long, and how much we have asked for these things...

I mean, its insulting enough that they are making the change only NOW, but to not even include our guns?

Really?

For realz?

I cant....and will not, support this company anymore. Im done with BITS, and will bite the bullet for having 130 INV slots, paying full price, and DLC.


I have my pride Trion, and you have slapped my face red and raw with your continuous insults and ignorance.

How dare you? You are making all 53 of my legendaries useless now...my 7 months of grinding, useless, my 3 days straight at Sutro during loot boosts, useless, my time and money, useless.

Yea, you have NO respect for the players that kept your *** afloat during the NON STOP, server problems, horrible lying staff (legendaries have a 5% to drop from all enemies...remember that one?) and everything else.

I cant be quite as nice as crasher here, and I don't know how he can still be so calm and collected with you.

85-95% of your beginning player base is gone, and then you do this....? Say bye to the last 5%

Magickats242
10-16-2013, 02:05 PM
And they're most likely a $10 Ark Hunter.

Actually, no. I payed 24$ for the deluxe version. :P

Atticus Batman
10-16-2013, 02:34 PM
They are making an attempt and they are trying. Whoever it was that said the changes are for the new players is correct. Us old vets don't really get too excited over rolls since we already have piles of guns we love already.

Personally, all I want is for more content. I don't care about perk stacking tricks and reload stacking tricks that are deemed OP or roll tweaks. I'd like to spend our magical development pixie dust on new content and let the other tweak stuff go.

As for the changes that are coming down, at least they are showing that there is still some life on the dev side of this game.

I agree there.

Bonehead
10-16-2013, 10:25 PM
I will go with "little and late" but not "too little and too late".

Reverend Blood
10-17-2013, 09:07 AM
http://i.imgur.com/ZwISLth.gif