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vinceram
12-24-2013, 12:14 AM
I was finally able to get in a major arkfall (I usually get kicked off the server) when about 4 -5 of us were at the startup (when warmaster is bound). are we supposed to wait until at least 10+ arkhunters show before we attempt to unlock the warmaster?

Folly
12-24-2013, 12:18 AM
Arkbreak, not Arkfall.
And it really doesn't matter. You're not going to come close to killing him without an organized party of coordinated and well geared players. So when you're pugging it, just start him whenever you want.

Nilxain
12-24-2013, 12:34 AM
Arkbreak, not Arkfall.
And it really doesn't matter. You're not going to come close to killing him without an organized party of coordinated and well geared players. So when you're pugging it, just start him whenever you want.

Ignore the quoted post. Yes you should wait. By having the attitude of the quoted player you will do nothing but hurt your chances, and everyone elses, of killing the WM. Wait for 20 players; the instances are pooled together so it will fill completely before another one fills.

For more information read my guide (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?142543-Warmaster-Guide).

twitch reflex
12-24-2013, 12:44 AM
Yeah Nix is right wait till its full. It sucks that there's no way to chat inside the arkfall to tell others to wait. I normally shoot or melee at a person who is trying to start it early, some people get the hint some don't.

Bentu
12-24-2013, 03:01 AM
It's not chat but you can use your emote to say stop or no.

samuelsinn
12-24-2013, 03:29 AM
do all of the above but what the second poster said.

the point of the major is to win. to win you need numbers. good gear. and well orginised teamates that are willing and able to do everything in there power to push the match though to a win.

waiting insures that you may get a pug full of clans .

and if you EVER see a CORE member and theres only 4 of you in the major wating. sit it out untill you start seeing dots appearing around you.

where there is one core. all cores will follow well for the most part unless we have burnt our selfs out on arkbrakes that night hehe.

over all the ediqut on it is to wait and to alow others to join . if you want something to do while wating . try climbing the wall inside the room or danceing

Arran
12-24-2013, 04:04 AM
Ark legion elite on over 100 war master kills now & we ALWAYS WAIT FOR A FULL TEAM.
It's a dirty trick but I have invited a few randoms to group who were ruining it 4 every1 then when u kick them from group they get kicked from ark break to. (Plz only use as last resort tho)

Bentu
12-24-2013, 04:38 AM
Ark legion elite on over 100 war master kills now & we ALWAYS WAIT FOR A FULL TEAM.
It's a dirty trick but I have invited a few randoms to group who were ruining it 4 every1 then when u kick them from group they get kicked from ark break to.(Plz only use as last resort tho)

Kind of says it all, don't you ever think that these "randoms" may have actually paid for the game/dlc and are entitled to play it. They then go and blame the game because you've been an a s s.

samuelsinn
12-24-2013, 04:45 AM
Kind of says it all, don't you ever think that these "randoms" may have actually paid for the game/dlc and are entitled to play it. They then go and blame the game because you've been an a s s.

i have to agree a little. on that one. but at the same time.

if it keeps someone from opaning the locks befor EVERY ONE is there i could see it as a semi good reason to use such a thing. but then agine.

core has a way of stoping people. some times it works. sometimes it dont but most of the time.

grouping around them and trying to hit them. makes them get the hint.

Arran
12-24-2013, 05:50 AM
Like I said it's a last option & if only done twice because was four of us in there & the nub starts breaking locks. We had already explained to wait 4 all those who got d/c. Even a group of ppl meleeing an idiot shooting only seems work some times. If they insist on greifing the every1 else I will do what needs to be done. I play to win not fail.

Aaricane
12-24-2013, 06:08 AM
Who the hell cares, start it whenever you want.

crasher
12-24-2013, 06:51 AM
Who the hell cares, start it whenever you want.
Pretty much everyone who plays the game to 'win' the Break, instead of grief, or just does poorly out of unfamiliarity with the facts?

Probably the several people in these threads who make multi-million point scores and are trying to share knowledge and technique with people who WANT to make multi-million point scores but aren't able to, yet?

Just a few guesses.....

GridSufer
12-24-2013, 06:54 AM
Pretty much everyone who plays the game to 'win' the Break, instead of grief, or just does poorly out of unfamiliarity with the facts?

Probably the several people in these threads who make multi-million point scores and are trying to share knowledge and technique with people who WANT to make multi-million point scores but aren't able to, yet?

Just a few guesses.....

And those who payed for the DLC and are fed up of free-loaders that don't care?
Just adding another to the list...

Noobshank
12-24-2013, 07:15 AM
If you have nothing constructive to say GTF0. So many of you tough guys behind keyboards now-a-days.

To the OP - Please wait until you see about ~15 people in the instance and then SLOWLY break the crystals, allowing those still rendering to see the Warmaster and find their positioning.

I personally appreciate you asking this question bud, it's rare to see game etiquette so +1. Personally, I never touch the crystals. I plant 5 clusterbombs at the right arm and wait until the rude ones pop the crystals early while posted up behind the WM (Sucker Punch). You should definitely check out Nilxain's guide if you haven't done so already.

Again, if you're not constructive on threads please don't waste anyone's time. Your misinformation is only hurting a dying community as-is.

melkathi
12-24-2013, 07:22 AM
Went to a major Arkbreak the other day. There were only three of us. Then the other two broke the seals. I think it was completly stupid, true. But honestly? At least one of the two people being stupid had put down the spikes to call the thing down. If they want to waste their spikes, they have every right to do so :)

GridSufer
12-24-2013, 07:25 AM
I was in one breaker with four people total, two were waiting by the ammo cache, the other started shooting one of the locks, so I stood infront of him, shoot my gun at him to get attention then started a private convo, explained that we had no chance and to wait...

Some four minutes later and a huge stream of people flooded down the hole!

And the big monkey died to the effects of a nano and vanished into a black nothingness!

crasher
12-24-2013, 07:30 AM
Went to a major Arkbreak the other day. There were only three of us. Then the other two broke the seals. I think it was completly stupid, true. But honestly? At least one of the two people being stupid had put down the spikes to call the thing down. If they want to waste their spikes, they have every right to do so :)
I'm sure that when the first two guys put down the spikes, and THE 3rd guy comes in and breaks the locks - when there is no 4th guy yet....
You see where I'm going?
In your example, it begs the obvious question of why they proceeded early. And what you say is true in your example.

But the majority of these cases don't involve just 3 or 5 guys, they involve ALMOST enough people to carry it off if many/most are good, and not enough people if they're an unorganized PUG.

I'm thinking SOME of the problem can be averted by gathering as many people at a site before spiking, but I know that's not easy or efficient either.

I've gotten inside with my share of teams of losers.
I can walk away from a siege with teams of losers making it pointless.
I have to quit the game to get out of a Break that exceeds the loser quotient.

http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/ab326/kaos_crasher/images.jpg

Alexri
12-24-2013, 07:33 AM
Kind of says it all, don't you ever think that these "randoms" may have actually paid for the game/dlc and are entitled to play it. They then go and blame the game because you've been an a s s.

Similar logic to:
Don't you ever think the people talking loudly on a cellphone during a movie at a movie theatre may have actually paid for the ticket/snacks and are entitled to be there.

There are 24 slots in a WM arkbreak, and no single person has the right to ruin it for 23 others.

The biggest problem with Defiance is that it's lacking mechanics that are time tested to be paramount to the success of an MMO. Things like vote kick (from WMs), raid groups, and minimum skill requirements to enter. In this game we have to say things like "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks", and then people get pissed, even if it's exactly the same logic that automatically prevents you from joining raids/instance groups in other MMOs, and no one has a problem with that.

GridSufer
12-24-2013, 07:39 AM
Alexri, despite my distaste for you as a person, I 'mostly' agree with you, the only thing I will say is, 1mil minimum is a hit excessive, a full group with a average hitter of 600k has beaten him... Even 500k aimed at the right spot makes a difference.

Otherwise yes you're right, we need kick mechanics to boot out the AFKers and others who intentionally ruin it for the rest.

crasher
12-24-2013, 07:39 AM
Similar logic to:
Don't you ever think the people talking loudly on a cellphone during a movie at a movie theatre may have actually paid for the ticket/snacks and are entitled to be there.

There are 24 slots in a WM arkbreak, and no single person has the right to ruin it for 23 others.

The biggest problem with Defiance is that it's lacking mechanics that are time tested to be paramount to the success of an MMO. Things like vote kick (from WMs), raid groups, and minimum skill requirements to enter. In this game we have to say things like "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks", and then people get pissed, even if it's exactly the same logic that automatically prevents you from joining raids/instance groups in other MMOs, and no one has a problem with that.

Considering how many Break sites go unused at any given time, it's foolish that there isn't some mechanism to do a team roster of people who want to all go in together, and crush one on occasion. Sure, this one can be 'abused' too, just like any game mechanic, but it's no different than going into a coop with a chosen group, just bigger groups are involved.

ETA: I understand the idea of a 'kick mechanic', but in the limited amount of time during a WM fete, is there really a possibility that it'll be useful THAT often considering the number of people you have to distract and coordinate to make it happen in any way that's marginally fair?

And in Survivor, they frequently vote-kick the best players anyway. :)

http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/ab326/kaos_crasher/images.jpg

Tallon
12-24-2013, 09:30 AM
Vote kicking has always been abused in every game it is in.

Maybe if they added a minimum player amount before you can start? - It'll never happen but makes sense.

crasher
12-24-2013, 09:37 AM
Vote kicking has always been abused in every game it is in.

Maybe if they added a minimum player amount before you can start? - It'll never happen but makes sense.
It'd have to scale with server population, and it'd have to be logrithmic, else you'd have 40 people on the server, 31 in other places wandering around, talking, crushing inventory, or just camping, and never the critical mass to start an instance.

Squall Leonhart
12-24-2013, 09:43 AM
Arkbreak, not Arkfall.
And it really doesn't matter. You're not going to come close to killing him without an organized party of coordinated and well geared players. So when you're pugging it, just start him whenever you want.

Ignore that.

Yes wait for 16 players to enter, and then start on the locks and hammer on that right hand. If you can bring in friends/clanmates, then even better (a chance to organize your own raid party)

Squall Leonhart
12-24-2013, 09:53 AM
Who the hell cares, start it whenever you want.

Please everyone ignore this...

(No offense sorry)

If we all start doing this, kiss any chance with randoms goodbye....

Nalai
12-24-2013, 10:10 AM
The decision is rather simple. If you don't wait, there is no way you will complete it. If you do wait, there is at least a chance you'll finish it.

TASHINKA
12-24-2013, 11:20 AM
Arkbreak, not Arkfall.
And it really doesn't matter. You're not going to come close to killing him without an organized party of coordinated and well geared players. So when you're pugging it, just start him whenever you want.Your correction of the term is correct, but I disagree with your advice. You should not start "whenever you want" or you will have no chance in hell & wasted the opportunity. Wait for 24-26 (ps3 - don't know other systems max) players, well geared or not, is the only way you have a chance to kill him, shoot right arm, extract when dead, etc its been said repeatedly in many other threads

Bentu
12-24-2013, 11:34 AM
Similar logic to:
Don't you ever think the people talking loudly on a cellphone during a movie at a movie theatre may have actually paid for the ticket/snacks and are entitled to be there.

There are 24 slots in a WM arkbreak, and no single person has the right to ruin it for 23 others.

The biggest problem with Defiance is that it's lacking mechanics that are time tested to be paramount to the success of an MMO. Things like vote kick (from WMs), raid groups, and minimum skill requirements to enter. In this game we have to say things like "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks", and then people get pissed, even if it's exactly the same logic that automatically prevents you from joining raids/instance groups in other MMOs, and no one has a problem with that.

What the hell are you on about, you and others who think the same have no authority to kick another player from the game and to suggest the need for a kick button/option is ludicrous.

What you should be demanding is the group option so you and your buddies can play together.

OKuratool
12-24-2013, 11:45 AM
I'm sure that when the first two guys put down the spikes, and THE 3rd guy comes in and breaks the locks - when there is no 4th guy yet....
You see where I'm going?
In your example, it begs the obvious question of why they proceeded early. And what you say is true in your example.

But the majority of these cases don't involve just 3 or 5 guys, they involve ALMOST enough people to carry it off if many/most are good, and not enough people if they're an unorganized PUG.

I'm thinking SOME of the problem can be averted by gathering as many people at a site before spiking, but I know that's not easy or efficient either.

I've gotten inside with my share of teams of losers.
I can walk away from a siege with teams of losers making it pointless.
I have to quit the game to get out of a Break that exceeds the loser quotient.

http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/ab326/kaos_crasher/images.jpg

I get you, I have read Nix's guide, but don't have the gear or EGO perks yet. Please note that while my EGO is below 400, I have contributed a spike and have gone into the arkbreak to watch, shoot, dodge and hope to get better. I am a season pass holder, so want to do everything I paid for. Knowing this, and reading the OP, I will take my shoes off and count past 10 before hiting the locks on the WM.
BTW thanks to all that have posted guides on WM, weapons, pursuits, and PvE/PvP. You all have helped fill in the gaps in the "Wonderful Documentation" that was provided.

OKuratool
12-24-2013, 11:52 AM
Similar logic to:
Don't you ever think the people talking loudly on a cellphone during a movie at a movie theatre may have actually paid for the ticket/snacks and are entitled to be there.

There are 24 slots in a WM arkbreak, and no single person has the right to ruin it for 23 others.

The biggest problem with Defiance is that it's lacking mechanics that are time tested to be paramount to the success of an MMO. Things like vote kick (from WMs), raid groups, and minimum skill requirements to enter. In this game we have to say things like "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks", and then people get pissed, even if it's exactly the same logic that automatically prevents you from joining raids/instance groups in other MMOs, and no one has a problem with that.

So that I understand your logic, If I can't do a million damage I should not play the content I paid for(Season Pass)? Some of us at lower EGO's benefit for waching and trying out combinations with our meger gear and perks. So I will not take your advice to stay away till I can score over 1 Mil. damage. But I will not break seals early on the WM, and will not wait for revive. We cool now?

Nilxain
12-24-2013, 12:03 PM
So that I understand your logic, If I can't do a million damage I should not play the content I paid for(Season Pass)? Some of us at lower EGO's benefit for waching and trying out combinations with our meger gear and perks. So I will not take your advice to stay away till I can score over 1 Mil. damage. But I will not break seals early on the WM, and will not wait for revive. We cool now?

Saying that "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks," is going too far. I hope that what he actually means is, "if you're not [trying to do] a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks." If you don't join and try, then you won't break a million, so you have to join - and people should join. I think you have the right attitude and can only hope the others have the same.

inox2980
12-24-2013, 12:11 PM
Saying that "if you're not doing a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks," is going too far. I hope that what he actually means is, "if you're not [trying to do] a million damage you shouldn't join arkbreaks." If you don't join and try, then you won't break a million, so you have to join - and people should join. I think you have the right attitude and can only hope the others have the same.

Nail. On. The. Head.

I think people who join a Warmaster instance should be there to win as well as experience the content. If you are not there to "win it" by putting in max effort then why enter into such a challenging fight?

OKuratool
12-24-2013, 12:16 PM
Thank You Nilxain and inox2980,

I will keep plugging away till I have the guns and perks to make it to the 1 Mill club. Keep passing on the advice, warnings, and drop a old weapon to a noob once in a while. It is Christmas, ya'll.

inox2980
12-24-2013, 12:18 PM
Thank You Nilxain and inox2980,

I will keep plugging away till I have the guns and perks to make it to the 1 Mill club. Keep passing on the advice, warnings, and drop a old weapon to a noob once in a while. It is Christmas, ya'll.

Thanks for the understanding - if you ever need help in-game, let me know. I'd be happy to help with perks and/or weapon advice.

plebeian27
12-24-2013, 12:22 PM
You can also use the 'Join Friend' option instead of entering the arkbreak the regular way. That way you can group up with your friends and fill almost full breaks instead of being thrown in with randoms.

I usually whisper a bunch of friends when we are getting ready to start a major; helps to load it with peeps who know what they're doing!!

samuelsinn
12-24-2013, 12:44 PM
You can also use the 'Join Friend' option instead of entering the arkbreak the regular way. That way you can group up with your friends and fill almost full breaks instead of being thrown in with randoms.

I usually whisper a bunch of friends when we are getting ready to start a major; helps to load it with peeps who know what they're doing!!

this is how alot of clans also get WMs to them selfs by useing Team speak or Raid call on PC we can cordinate our clan mates and tell them what one is empty and what ones are full and drop into the ones that are empty. if we see we are in one that has WAY to few and the locks have allready been poped we will drop out and jump to the person that has the " empty " one and fill it up and get a win.

saying that makeing 1 mill is a must is rude disrespectfull and a FAILER at gameing. it shows the miturity level and the greed that some people have. in all the ark brakes i have done i lag out and have to wait for the war master to appear. i lose 1-2 mins of DPS time becuse of this. and then even after he appears i have to do as much damage as i can as fast as i can in order to help out my clan mates . while this is going on though i am droping damage spiks unloading my ammo into the right arm. and over all doing the guide.

but do to all this lag witch i only get in ark brakes where i have to render 20 other people. i still do my damndest to do as much damage to the WM as i can. even if i will never brake 1million ill be damed if i dont brake 200k or 500k the lowest i get on a bad lag day is 100K and i try and stay above that as much as i can. but in a PUG match its hard to do when your blind becuse you cant see the arm. OR becuse hes desided his arm suddenly can do a full 360 twist and is now faceing the wall.

so no. NO ONE HAS or NEEDS to make 1 mill inorder to enter an arkbrake major with war master. the only thing thay HAVE to do and NEED to do , is play the game as best thay can.

also to the guy that is low ego. if i gave you any loot . u couldnt use it :( i dont have anything that low of ego. BUT if you can grind out to nearly ego 1900 i think i can hook you up with a few ojs after all. passing on the wealth is a good thing. hopefuly your on PC NA also if not :( i cant give you anything

JaygunJesile
12-24-2013, 01:00 PM
I understand that people want to win, but if I put down all 4 spikes I'll start when I want. if you want to join me I'll be happy to have you. Will I win solo, nope. But I'm having fun. Besides, the set stats on the Orange weapons are pretty bad.

Nilxain
12-24-2013, 01:11 PM
I understand that people want to win, but if I put down all 4 spikes I'll start when I want. if you want to join me I'll be happy to have you. Will I win solo, nope. But I'm having fun. Besides, the set stats on the Orange weapons are pretty bad.

That would be fine if people had a choice not to join you, but they don't.

samuelsinn
12-24-2013, 01:15 PM
ya sadly we CANT pick and choose 100% of the time whos going to be in the ark fall with us.. but wait there is a light at the end of that tunnel.

we can leave your ark fall let you do what you want and move on to one with friends in it :: shrugs ::

have a marry Xmas. im got 6 and a helf hours befor i have to make an appearince online today for my Xmas party .

Nilxain
12-24-2013, 01:33 PM
ya sadly we CANT pick and choose 100% of the time whos going to be in the ark fall with us.. but wait there is a light at the end of that tunnel.

we can leave your ark fall let you do what you want and move on to one with friends in it :: shrugs ::


Someone is going to get put in that Arkbreak with him, and I'm sure they would prefer he not put down the spikes if that also means he won't screw everyone over by starting the Arkbreak early.

GridSufer
12-24-2013, 01:49 PM
Someone is going to get put in that Arkbreak with him, and I'm sure they would prefer he not put down the spikes if that also means he won't screw everyone over by starting the Arkbreak early.

One of the most accurate hammers on these forums you are Nilx, the nail has been hit again.

Just because you put the spikes down does not mean its -your- instance, in fact more often than not people are being thrown into someone else's break (normally with 2 - 3 minutes left before finish.)

If we had an easy way to choose (like server options on games such as COD for example.)
Then I firmly believe no one would choose to join your breaker if you don't want us there to win.