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Escyos
07-21-2012, 07:57 PM
This is a thread for the Castithan language.

Heres what we got so far (will add as more become available):
Skaháraya (Sha-kar-a-ya) = Cheers - Listen (http://dedalvs.com/dl/skaharaya.mp3)

Kalbuir
07-23-2012, 08:35 AM
Nice idea, i'll keep a lookout for more :)

Resvrgam
07-24-2012, 11:56 PM
We actually have a hardcore philologist/linguist that developed the votan languages of Defiance (from what I hear, he created the spoken language of a certain other epic series involving a game of a different sort). This means that the actors on the show and in the game speaking these alien languages aren't just spouting gibberish. :)

After looking through the menus and wall imagery from my stint at Cafe Defiance, during Comic-Con 2012, I was pleasantly surprised to learn that the strange, hexa-glyphic writing beneath the menu items were actual votan translations (it's in "Indojisnen" according to the introduction on page one of the menu).

Medenor
07-25-2012, 02:41 AM
https://p.twimg.com/AxjeLxeCMAAPtko.jpg

Escyos
07-25-2012, 06:27 AM
Heres a vid: http://watch.accesshollywood.com/video/tony-curran-jaime-murray-talks-new-syfy-show-defiance-comic-con-2012/1745592422001 with some more languge

What Tony Curran says: (words probably not correctly spelled, but phonetically spelled out)
"Zarabaidang gogola goka" (Zara-bai-dang go-go-la go-ka) - some sort of expletive

Aaronjin
07-31-2012, 01:04 PM
a "real" language in teh game? sounds promising

Arkamenitas
08-11-2012, 10:23 PM
I am intrigued by this thread and find it relevant to my interests.

Jenbuu
08-12-2012, 01:01 AM
http://blip.tv/cbr/cbr-tv-cci-defiance-6297691

THis interview has a fair amount of language in it.

Arkamenitas
08-12-2012, 02:06 PM
i shall continue to monitor developments in this area...

Escyos
08-12-2012, 05:35 PM
Ok After some trouble I managed to get down what Jaime Murray was saying:
"Ajixa Helenickaka elenja fanolah meliverai maguxwai fingulashai" (A-Jix-a Helenick-a-ka elen-ja fan-o-lah me-liver-ay ma-goox-way fing-ula-shay) - what it means, well I don't know but its a major spoiler.

Arkamenitas
08-12-2012, 07:06 PM
i wouldnt put too much credence behind that video (in terms of what they've said the things mean), if only because they seem like they might be enjoying an inside joke, so to speak :P

Escyos
10-18-2012, 11:15 AM
I've been working on deciphering the written Castithan language. Got a few letters and phonetic symbols down but still some gaps. Most of what we've been shown appears to be directly translatable into english rather than into Castithan spoken language, which may just be to make production a little easier, I doubt that they want to go running to Peterson for every little piece of language.

Night Hawke
10-19-2012, 04:26 PM
i wouldnt put too much credence behind that video (in terms of what they've said the things mean), if only because they seem like they might be enjoying an inside joke, so to speak :P

The inside joke is that they are going to do sorta what firefly did with chinese in the show, mostly it will be used to swear and get away with it. At least thats what i understand it to be for. So more than likely the words do actually mean something and they will be used properly to replace things they cant say on tv.

I also hope they have the aliens also only speak in this language.

Jenbuu
10-19-2012, 07:04 PM
The guys at Defiance central got a little present from David Paterson today, its the website name in Castithan

http://a.yfrog.com/img576/1992/efzd.png

doesnt it look pretty :-)

Jenbuu
10-19-2012, 07:05 PM
If you havent already heres a presentation from the syfy tour on the defiance languages


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLYZHquaDtg&feature=g-hist

By the looks of it its going to be all over the place :D

Escyos
10-20-2012, 01:36 AM
The guys at Defiance central got a little present from David Paterson today, its the website name in Castithan

http://a.yfrog.com/img576/1992/efzd.png

doesnt it look pretty :-)

Did you happen to get told what the second word was. The first says Defiance but the secondmust actually be in Castithan.

The first letter in a Z and it ends in a U.

For anyone that wants to know the Defiance word is broken up into sounds (The first symbols is De, 2nd Fa, 3rd Y, 4th N, 5th C, 6th E - DeFaYNCE)

Jenbuu
10-20-2012, 02:08 AM
Did you happen to get told what the second word was. The first says Defiance but the secondmust actually be in Castithan.

The first letter in a Z and it ends in a U.

For anyone that wants to know the Defiance word is broken up into sounds (The first symbols is De, 2nd Fa, 3rd Y, 4th N, 5th C, 6th E - DeFaYNCE)

as far as i was aware its central.

only got the piccy and this " Difayantso Zwago "

Escyos
10-20-2012, 03:51 AM
as far as i was aware its central.

only got the piccy and this " Difayantso Zwago "

Zwago must mean central then. I'll add it to the list.

Jenbuu
10-20-2012, 07:20 AM
Zwago must mean central then. I'll add it to the list.

i remember when i spoke to him about it last time he was saying that parts of central or the idea of central was used alot in the language, so the central bit was the difficult bit. ( dont quote me on that tho it was a while ago)

Britton
10-29-2012, 06:16 PM
The guys at Defiance central got a little present from David Paterson today, its the website name in Castithan

http://a.yfrog.com/img576/1992/efzd.png

doesnt it look pretty :-)


Yes it does. It's very evocative of a Thai, Burmese, Khmer mashup, but of course not derivative. The syllable formation process also seems somewhat reminiscent of the Fidel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amharic_language#Fidel_signs) of Ethiopic. Nice! :cool:

Britton
10-29-2012, 06:36 PM
My main question is “Will competency in any of the non-Earth languages provide an competitive advantage in gameplay?” If it will, then this franchise might be truly revolutionary. ;)

Escyos
10-30-2012, 01:37 AM
My main question is “Will competency in any of the non-Earth languages provide an competitive advantage in gameplay?” If it will, then this franchise might be truly revolutionary. ;)

I doubt it will. There may be some signs posted around that lead you to some hidden missions/caches, so maybe.

Shadinaxx
11-01-2012, 03:51 PM
I doubt it will. There may be some signs posted around that lead you to some hidden missions/caches, so maybe.

This. I fully support this idea, and would love to see it used. Perhaps even puzzle box locked caches that test your comprehension in the language (along the lines of the various puzzle challenges in Rift).

Nikolak Tarr
11-05-2012, 10:47 PM
There are a some mistakes with the transcripts, some extra syllables that are not there. I would like to help a little bit here, let's start with the first one:


This is a thread for the Castithan language.

Heres what we got so far (will add as more become available):
Skaháraya (Sha-kar-a-ya) = Cheers - Listen (http://dedalvs.com/dl/skaharaya.mp3)

Well, the transcript was right on, but then the "phonology" is completely messed up. If you want to transcript the "English" phonology of it, I would say it's more like ska-HARA-ya. In IPA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPA) I would say: [ska'haraja] but never [ʃakaraja] as is written there.

I concede that the "expletive" was transcripted rather well and it is correctly written in the wiki, but the sentence Jaime Murray says is totally distorted I think. Now we have 3 different videos where she says the same phrase, so one can take the 3 and draw conclusions.

The 3 videos are:
http://watch.accesshollywood.com/video/tony-curran-jaime-murray-talks-new-syfy-show-defiance-comic-con-2012/1745592422001
http://blip.tv/cbr/cbr-tv-cci-defiance-6297691
http://www.gamespot.com/defiance/videos/defiance-panel-comic-con-2012-6387130/

You have:


Ok After some trouble I managed to get down what Jaime Murray was saying:
"Ajixa Helenickaka elenja fanolah meliverai maguxwai fingulashai" (A-Jix-a Helenick-a-ka elen-ja fan-o-lah me-liver-ay ma-goox-way fing-ula-shay) - what it means, well I don't know but its a major spoiler.

Clearly from the other 2 videos we can hear that it's "jixa" not "ajixa", and also "helenika" not "helenikaka", in fact, she even goes as far as marking that "helenika" seems to be a word in itself because of the pause she makes in video 3.

My guess about her "spoiler" is something like:

Shiksa helenika elisha fenola me libere me gukse me fin sheleshe

Of course it's a blind guess not knowing where one word ends and the other begins, but that's what I hear. She certainly seems to say "shiksa" and not "ashiksa" and certainly ends "helenika" in that syllable and doesn't repeat another "ka". The rest is pure speculation.

I would suggest someone correct the wiki and in the future we can compare how far off we were from the real thing.

Escyos
11-07-2012, 04:24 AM
There are a some mistakes with the transcripts, some extra syllables that are not there. I would like to help a little bit here, let's start with the first one:

Well, the transcript was right on, but then the "phonology" is completely messed up. If you want to transcript the "English" phonology of it, I would say it's more like ska-HARA-ya. In IPA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPA) I would say: [ska'haraja] but never [ʃakaraja] as is written there.

That was taken directly from Peterson's Twitter post, so its right.


I concede that the "expletive" was transcripted rather well and it is correctly written in the wiki, but the sentence Jaime Murray says is totally distorted I think. Now we have 3 different videos where she says the same phrase, so one can take the 3 and draw conclusions.

The 3 videos are:
http://watch.accesshollywood.com/video/tony-curran-jaime-murray-talks-new-syfy-show-defiance-comic-con-2012/1745592422001
http://blip.tv/cbr/cbr-tv-cci-defiance-6297691
http://www.gamespot.com/defiance/videos/defiance-panel-comic-con-2012-6387130/

You have:

Clearly from the other 2 videos we can hear that it's "jixa" not "ajixa", and also "helenika" not "helenikaka", in fact, she even goes as far as marking that "helenika" seems to be a word in itself because of the pause she makes in video 3.

My guess about her "spoiler" is something like:

Shiksa helenika elisha fenola me libere me gukse me fin sheleshe

Of course it's a blind guess not knowing where one word ends and the other begins, but that's what I hear. She certainly seems to say "shiksa" and not "ashiksa" and certainly ends "helenika" in that syllable and doesn't repeat another "ka". The rest is pure speculation.

I would suggest someone correct the wiki and in the future we can compare how far off we were from the real thing.

Id rather just leave it as its close enough and allows people to say it right without knowing phonetics etc. Plus as recent info has told us, written and spoken is VERY different - Vajuvano is spelt Vaadiubanu but spoken as Vaadiu-ban.

Nikolak Tarr
11-07-2012, 01:10 PM
That was taken directly from Peterson's Twitter post, so its right.



Id rather just leave it as its close enough and allows people to say it right without knowing phonetics etc. Plus as recent info has told us, written and spoken is VERY different - Vajuvano is spelt Vaadiubanu but spoken as Vaadiu-ban.

If that is so, where's that twitter post? I follow David and I don't remember it, could you please point towards it? Because I very much doubt that he said "ska" is pronounced "sha" when in the listening he clearly says "ska-ha-raya". Do you really hear this word begins with "sha-ka" as in "Shaquille O'Neal"?

Also he never said that vajuvano is "spoken" as "vaadiu-ban" he just showed how vajuvano is actually written "vaa-diu-ba-nu" and that it comes from a proto *vaadiu-ban as rejo comes from a proto *raidi, that's why he used an asterisk, an asterisk in linguistics means an unattested form. I bet that as "rai-diu" becomes "rejo" (pronounced ['redʒo]) then certainly "vaa-diu-ba-nu" becomes "vajuvano" (IPA: [vadʒuvano] or similar).

The problem is you get confused with the writing but think of it as similar to Japanese, where you write "jyuu-kyuu" but say "jûkyû", or for example "tiyoujin" but say "chôjin", this is very similar to that. ;)

Also... how is "helenickaka" similar to the correct "helenika"? You are adding a syllable. Plus "ajixa" has an extra a there which is not part of the word, listen carefully to the different videos. Being a linguist who loves languages I just want to help out the community, please don't take it the wrong way.

Escyos
11-07-2012, 11:14 PM
If that is so, where's that twitter post? I follow David and I don't remember it, could you please point towards it? Because I very much doubt that he said "ska" is pronounced "sha" when in the listening he clearly says "ska-ha-raya". Do you really hear this word begins with "sha-ka" as in "Shaquille O'Neal"?

Also he never said that vajuvano is "spoken" as "vaadiu-ban" he just showed how vajuvano is actually written "vaa-diu-ba-nu" and that it comes from a proto *vaadiu-ban as rejo comes from a proto *raidi, that's why he used an asterisk, an asterisk in linguistics means an unattested form. I bet that as "rai-diu" becomes "rejo" (pronounced ['redʒo]) then certainly "vaa-diu-ba-nu" becomes "vajuvano" (IPA: [vadʒuvano] or similar).

The problem is you get confused with the writing but think of it as similar to Japanese, where you write "jyuu-kyuu" but say "jûkyû", or for example "tiyoujin" but say "chôjin", this is very similar to that. ;)

Also... how is "helenickaka" similar to the correct "helenika"? You are adding a syllable. Plus "ajixa" has an extra a there which is not part of the word, listen carefully to the different videos. Being a linguist who loves languages I just want to help out the community, please don't take it the wrong way.

I looked over my work and realized that when i added it to the wiki i did add a few extra letters. So I changed it. If you truly have a better understanding of it, please sign up and help out.

Nikolak Tarr
11-08-2012, 01:33 AM
I looked over my work and realized that when i added it to the wiki i did add a few extra letters. So I changed it. If you truly have a better understanding of it, please sign up and help out.

Well, I would totally love to! In fact I think I did but even then I couldn't edit the wiki entry because I didn't have permits or something like that. But I would love to help, this is something I do for a living and I love doing it. I've been studying every bit of Castithan I could find, and that's little enough, but some things seems pretty clear for me. Also I studied languages my whole life, and I've already done attempts of transcripting different weird alien dialogues. I'm not saying my opinion is the law, but I would love to help, plus I love David's languages such as Dothraki and been a follower since I heard about them.

In fact I would like to correct my previous transcription, with what I know now I would say it is:

Shiksa helenika elija fenola me livere me gukse me finje leje

Of course I have doubts about "ks" because it doesn't seem to appear anywhere else. All the rest of the language seems to be very syllabic, almost mimicking Japanese (think, for example, of "Difayantso", in Japanese it would probably be "Difayansu", they both use a final vowel). I wish we could get our hand on that chart for all the Castithan syllabary, we could learn a lot from it.

So, how can I help further?

Javel_Remois
11-08-2012, 12:13 PM
Ok After some trouble I managed to get down what Jaime Murray was saying:
"Ajixa Helenickaka elenja fanolah meliverai maguxwai fingulashai" (A-Jix-a Helenick-a-ka elen-ja fan-o-lah me-liver-ay ma-goox-way fing-ula-shay) - what it means, well I don't know but its a major spoiler.

The question is can you say it and sound like a Thai hooker like Ms Jaime Murray?;)

Rowan
11-08-2012, 12:42 PM
Someday I imagine being at a convention and hearing two people speaking Castithan fluently next to me.
I'm pretty sure if I tried I'd butcher it some though...may still try anyway.

Nikolak Tarr
11-18-2012, 12:27 PM
We now have more material on it! The 2 sentences translated!
http://bit.ly/QPfncY

I see here that the original phrase seems to be closer to what was originally transcripted. That's another thing we have to bear in mind at these early stages, actors can misremember and can pronounce a little different, here the actress playing Stahma says something like:

elinja fenola me livere me gukswe finjeleje

Or something like that quite closer to what was transcripted before, but if you listen closely to all the other videos he kinda says it differently afterwards. I don't know which came before or what the changes are, but it's exciting as we piece this out. We now know the meanings of the 2 most well-known phrases up to now and we can start conjecturing about the meanings involved. I would think "me" probably means "you" as it is repeated 2 times as is the pronoun. What do you think?

Smitch
12-23-2012, 02:24 AM
This I am most interested in. Is there a site ore repository that has everything gathered thus far?

Escyos
02-02-2013, 07:46 AM
New word: "Fizhigwo", means Welcome.

Phaius
02-02-2013, 08:46 PM
I've been working on deciphering the written Castithan language. Got a few letters and phonetic symbols down but still some gaps. Most of what we've been shown appears to be directly translatable into english rather than into Castithan spoken language, which may just be to make production a little easier, I doubt that they want to go running to Peterson for every little piece of language.

Keep in mind, Castithan is an abugida (Works like Devanagari), and most of the promotional material appears to be using the script in a way that is *not intended*. Also, why hire a linguist if they aren't going to ask him to translate anything they want to say in the language? That sounds implausible for the level of detail this show is going for.

Escyos
02-02-2013, 09:07 PM
Keep in mind, Castithan is an abugida (Works like Devanagari), and most of the promotional material appears to be using the script in a way that is *not intended*. Also, why hire a linguist if they aren't going to ask him to translate anything they want to say in the language? That sounds implausible for the level of detail this show is going for.

Yes but I imagine that many words in English do not have Castithan counterparts and so have to be translated letter for letter.

Smitch
02-04-2013, 03:38 AM
I asked a question. ^.^ I got an answer! On the writing system for "Kastithanu" >.<

http://dedalvs.tumblr.com/post/42260390783/very-much-enjoying-trying-to-puzzle-out-these-new

Smitch
02-20-2013, 10:47 AM
http://ow.ly/i/1ygcQ - Hello in Castithan & Irathient.

Smitch
02-20-2013, 07:08 PM
http://ow.ly/i/1yyxA More language! "I love you." in both Castithan & Irathient. Would have been appropriate a week ago. >.<

Midniteryu
02-20-2013, 07:11 PM
http://ow.ly/i/1yyxA More language! "I love you." in both Castithan & Irathient. Would have been appropriate a week ago. >.<

maybe they had trouble translating it too, lol.

Duskky
02-20-2013, 07:48 PM
Learn the language then only speak it in-game so the non-forum guys have no idea what's going on.

Price of Ambition
02-20-2013, 08:42 PM
One of the biggest draws for me are the detail they put into the languages alone. I mean such things are rare now-a-days as a pointless money sink.

Though I want it to mean something unlike in other media that has universal translators and other technology. I want to have to puzzle it out. I don't want it in a log/quest menu that just involves clicking a button. Meaningful use of the languages they have made. Like the opening episode of SGU where he was playing a game that involved such technology and had nothing to go on in game. Same thing here. To many games are dumbed down to appeal to a larger audience. I want a special award for finding caches of technology/guns because I took the time to become more proficient.

Smitch
02-21-2013, 02:06 PM
So the two new sentences we have for Castithan are:
Noraka do deta - I love you
Nirizhiwa do yenda - I'm (I am) hungry
Thing to note is that do deta & do yenda have the same spelling in Castithan. From what little we have it would seem that "I am/are/is/be" part of the sentence that change pronunciation for some reason. Want more examples! >.<

Smitch
03-06-2013, 06:21 PM
A fair amount of Castithan in the new "Fans of the Genre" vid on Syfy:
http://www.syfy.com/videos/Defiance/Behind%20The%20Scenes/vid:2629562
Anyone know how to pre-load this vid rather than stream? I'm on the end of the internet and the sound quality is *horrible*. I can't hear what they're saying. :/

4th3ist
04-23-2013, 07:17 AM
Sorry if this is in the wrong thread, couldn't find another talking about Votan languages.

I think David Peterson slipped some Chinese into the language as well as exhibited by the doctor's insistence that Irisa give up the surgical charge blade. "kuài diǎn-ka". Without the added -ka in Chinese it translates to quickly.