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View Full Version : Details on the 15 new perks and how nanos affect shields/health



Nefarious
04-08-2014, 07:37 PM
Thanks to Fuzzle for posting up the 15 new perks and Tekrunner and Deunan for figuring out the numbers of how nano weapons fair against health and shields.

(rank1 & rank3 perks)

Bio:
Virulent: +5/+15% Armor Penetration from Bio attacks
Corrosion: +10/+30% Damage to Armor from Bio attacks
Immunized: -5/-15% Reduced incoming damage from Bio attacks

Electrical:
Live Wire: +5/+15% Damage to shields from your Electric attacks
Electrical Fire: +5/+15% Damage to health from your Electric attacks
Grounded: -5/-15% Reduced incoming damage from Electric attacks

Fire:
Conflaguration: +5/+15% Damage to health from your Incendiary attacks
Flash Point: +5/+15% Damage to shields from your Incendiary attacks
Heath Shield: -5/-15% Reduced incoming damage from Incendiary attacks

Radiation:
Radiation Burns: +5/+15% Damage from your Radiation attacks
Gamma Rays: +7/+25% armor penetration from your Radiation attacks
Lead Lined: -5/-15% Reduced incoming damage from Radiation attacks

Syphon:
Bloodsucker: +2/+6% Health and Shields stolen from syphon attacks
Deadly Apparition: +2/+6% damage from syphon attacks
Strong Soul: -5/-15% Reduced incoming damage from syphon attacks


How Nano weapons fair against shields & health without the buff of the new perks.

Against Shields
Biological: -16%
Electrical: +80%
Incendiary: -40%
Radiation: -10%
Syphon: -25%
No Element: -25% ???


Against Health
Biological: -10%
Electrical: -59.5%
Incendiary: +21.5%
Radiation: -19%
Syphon: -32.5%
No Element: 0% (no change) ???

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 08:00 PM
So if rank 1 is 5%, then rank 2 is 10%, and rank 3 15% for a total of 30%?

Magick
04-08-2014, 08:07 PM
any news on Insult to Injury perk change or what will the cannoneer synergy's last 2 parts be changed to?

Nefarious
04-08-2014, 08:19 PM
So if rank 1 is 5%, then rank 2 is 10%, and rank 3 15% for a total of 30%?

I don't think so. Just like with all perks there's 3 levels. So 5% level 1. 10% level 2. 15% level 3. Each rank grants +5%. But Idk what level 2 is for the perks since Fuzzle typed it off the top of his head and remembered 1 and 3.

I just put this up so ppl can compare the perks to the nanos in terms of effectiveness since only DLC 5 owners will have access to the new 15 perks.

Which is kind of a big deal since the new perks help buffer nano weapons in areas they lack in.

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 08:24 PM
I don't think so. Just like with all perks there's 3 levels. So 5% level 1. 10% level 2. 15% level 3. Each rank grants +5%. But Idk what level 2 is for the perks since Fuzzle typed it off the top of his head and remembered 1 and 3.

I just put this up so ppl can compare the perks to the nanos in terms of effectiveness since only DLC 5 owners will have access to the new 15 perks.

Which is kind of a big deal since the new perks help buffer nano weapons in areas they lack in.

Wishful thinking...

Chump Norris
04-08-2014, 08:25 PM
I wish no nano was 0% for both shields and health. If I am understanding all of this it would make them a decent all around gun for us lazy people who dont wanna switch load outs a bunch.

Nefarious
04-08-2014, 08:30 PM
I wish no nano was 0% for both shields and health. If I am understanding all of this it would make them a decent all around gun for us lazy people who dont wanna switch load outs a bunch.

idk what the numbers are for no-nano since that was part of Tekrunners old calculations until Deunan revised them but didn't do no-nano. That's why I put question marks next to them.

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 08:34 PM
SO it seems:

Fire will get a pretty good with perks with -25% to shields and +37% to health.
Electric will have +75% to shields and -45% to health (ouch - still)

Radiation is curious - it just says Damage - not to health or to shields - if it is both - then this may be the actual "chase" nano.

Nefarious
04-08-2014, 08:41 PM
SO it seems:

Fire will get a pretty good with perks with -25% to shields and +37% to health.
Electric will have +75% to shields and -45% to health (ouch - still)

Radiation is curious - it just says Damage - not to health or to shields - if it is both - then this may be the actual "chase" nano.

Radiation looks good. Says it deals a percentage of damage directly bypassing armor plates.

So it doesn't damage armor plates just bypasses them? So what that comes out to idk. Does Radiation do full DMG and pass armor plates or only a % against their reductions of 10/20/30% magnitudes?

Nefarious
04-08-2014, 08:44 PM
With the way things are being somewhat complicated I hope no-nano weapons are in the middle when compared to everything just to have a go to type weapons to use. If that is indeed the case then it would be nice to have an option to remove nanos from guns to have the choice to not deal with nanos for certain weapons.

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 08:52 PM
Radiation looks good. Says it deals a percentage of damage directly bypassing armor plates.

So it doesn't damage armor plates just bypasses them? So what that comes out to idk. Does Radiation do full DMG and pass armor plates or only a % against their reductions of 10/20/30% magnitudes?

Exactly what I was thinking - good damage against both shields and health (with the perks) AND extra damage to armor. Sounds like we have a wiener...er winner.

Nefarious
04-08-2014, 09:07 PM
Exactly what I was thinking - good damage against both shields and health (with the perks) AND extra damage to armor. Sounds like we have a wiener...er winner.

It doesn't do extra dmg to armor plates. A % of Rad dmg bypasses them. Bio is the one that specializes against armor plates. (edit: I read that Rad ignores 2.5 plates of armor, not so much considering how high armor plates get from shields and Ablative Armor form perks/stims.)

Its all so confusing and as I look at some of my guns the nanos just wont seem to fit right for some of them. Like my high dmg snipers with Shock damage...seems like a waste of a nano on them. I really hope its not out of the realm of possibility to use the salvage matrix to remove nanos from guns.

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 09:37 PM
It doesn't do extra dmg to armor plates. A % of Rad dmg bypasses them. Bio is the one that specializes against armor plates. (edit: I read that Rad ignores 2.5 plates of armor, not so much considering how high armor plates get from shields and Ablative Armor form perks/stims.)

Its all so confusing and as I look at some of my guns the nanos just wont seem to fit right for some of them. Like my high dmg snipers with Shock damage...seems like a waste of a nano on them. I really hope its not out of the realm of possibility to use the salvage matrix to remove nanos from guns.

Ahh, so it bypasses a set 2.5 plates? How many plates do high tier enemies have?

Fuzzle
04-08-2014, 09:51 PM
Some enemies have 10 plates such as the Warmaster, Formidable Bulwarks, and a couple others (100% damage reduction), so you HAVE to use bio or radiation to deal damage to them. Most often the average threat 10 level enemies have around 6 plates from what I've seen. I haven't tried it yet, but from what Trick said radiation should bypass 2.5 plates, but he sounded uncertain of it. It hasn't been tested much as it was not functioning before and has just recently been patched on the test server.

Bio can remove plates very quickly though, so for enemies like that with high #'s of plates it's going to be generally better to use a bio weapon and then switch. Situations where I can see using Radiation still are on sniper rifles, since you are usually engaging enemies that are too far away to pepper with a bio weapon and remove plates, and on boss type enemies with hoards of health such as the Warmaster to proc the 25% bonus damage debuff.

And to answer your question, the perks aren't additive. You get whatever rank you have leveled your perk to, so rank 3 of Virulent gives you 15% Armor Penetration from Bio attacks total.

Bonehead
04-08-2014, 09:55 PM
Ahh, so it bypasses a set 2.5 plates? How many plates do high tier enemies have?

I've seen up to 8 just playing solo with a 150ish toon.
Certain death to engage them though.

Low level bio weapons are pretty bad at dissolving plates in my experience.

Overtkill21
04-08-2014, 10:08 PM
I've seen up to 8 just playing solo with a 150ish toon.
Certain death to engage them though.

Low level bio weapons are pretty bad at dissolving plates in my experience.

I don't understand - so noobs are just going to generally get owned by this patch?

That makes no sense at all.

Bonehead
04-08-2014, 10:16 PM
I don't understand - so noobs are just going to generally get owned by this patch?

That makes no sense at all.

Its the bullet sponge patch Overt.

Gazz
04-08-2014, 11:54 PM
I don't understand - so noobs are just going to generally get owned by this patch?

That makes no sense at all.

Absolutely... I've been trying out a vanilla toon from scratch, using a white AR with fire, can only just hold my own against the mutants. Just done the KTAM radio mission, at about 100 EGO. 3 or more "experienced riflemen" and "experienced cleavers" you go down fast. Even trying a deadbolt sniper with headshots hardly makes a difference.

As Bonehead states, "Bullet Sponges" :D

Of course this may change prior to release.

duction
04-09-2014, 12:05 AM
Aslong as they don't have permanent armour recharge stations in pvp and only have the temp armour while in spikes range in pvp it shouldn't change to much..

duction
04-09-2014, 12:10 AM
Double post, ty iPhone.

Tekrunner
04-09-2014, 01:28 AM
As it is now on alpha, radiation should be fairly good for PvP, sniper rifles and large enemies fought as a team (the WM for example).

duction
04-09-2014, 01:32 AM
Excellent, just picked up a radiation gun for pvp :)

KasperSheitup
04-09-2014, 02:16 AM
Are these new perks going to be useful compared to other perks?

I can see how added damage/less damage can be useful but are they worth sacrificing one (or two?) of your other perks for - like all your defensive perks (I forgot the name of most since I haven't messed with my perks for a long time and I haven't played much in the last months and I quite like my setup for loadouts)
If it's just added protection (or damage) for one type of ammo isn't it better to keep your perks that does general protection? Or have the old perks been messed with as well?

Any ideas for builds?
I know it depends on what nano weapons you are using but the perks for each nano seems pretty comparable.


Hope this makes sense.

Atticus Batman
04-09-2014, 02:22 AM
Are these new perks going to be useful compared to other perks?

I can see how added damage/less damage can be useful but are they worth sacrificing one (or two?) of your other perks for - like all your defensive perks (I forgot the name of most since I haven't messed with my perks for a long time and I haven't played much in the last months and I quite like my setup for loadouts)
If it's just added protection (or damage) for one type of ammo isn't it better to keep your perks that does general protection? Or have the old perks been messed with as well?

Any ideas for builds?
I know it depends on what nano weapons you are using but the perks for each nano seems pretty comparable.


Hope this makes sense. Pretty tired in class, trying to listen and write this at the same time... zzz

Most people never take more than 2 defensive perks anyway. So it would actually be more like deciding if one of the new ones is better than what you already like.

Each nano (ammo type) has a different bonus and weakness, but ultimitely it is your decision. However I do see people taking the new increased bio damage perk on a Warmaster build, and perhaps the electricity protection perk as well. And some may also take the rad increase perk for him as well. Both of those damage increase perks I mentioned, might be wanted in PvP as well.

Nefarious
04-09-2014, 03:11 PM
Are these new perks going to be useful compared to other perks?

I think they are useful just enough to the point to annoy non dlc 5 owners since they wont have access to them...

Considering the perks help buff nanos in weak areas and also help defend against them for PvP...imo they are kinda a big deal.

Why the nano perks are not free content, I have no idea.

Seizan
04-09-2014, 03:26 PM
I think they are useful just enough to the point to annoy non dlc 5 owners since they wont have access to them...

Considering the perks help buff nanos in weak areas and also help defend against them for PvP...imo they are kinda a big deal.

Why the nano perks are not free content, I have no idea.

You've already answered this question yourself :)

It's their way to "encourage" people to get DLC 5.