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Bonehead
04-29-2014, 09:38 PM
I showed up at a darkmatter arkfall and only put maybe no more than 20 rounds into the tachmag drive when it ended and I got # 11 with over 100k score?
Seems a bit flawed.

http://i1375.photobucket.com/albums/ag464/lenzdude/2014-04-29_00001_zps3422918c.jpg

SxB_xPUDDYTATx
04-29-2014, 09:43 PM
not an oddity. you cot there in time for a critical kill, which gives you a 100k point bonus to your score

KasperSheitup
04-29-2014, 10:35 PM
The window for getting the critical kill bonus has been broadened from 0.x seconds (very low) to something like 1.0 or maybe even 2 seconds so it has become a lot easier to get the bonus. At least this is what Tekrunner told me and he usually seems to know his ****. :)

Bonehead
04-29-2014, 10:51 PM
It just seemed odd to spend so little time there, shoot a short burst into the monolith, and end up on the leaderboard at all.

SxB_xPUDDYTATx
04-29-2014, 11:08 PM
well here you can see that showing up for the whole event doesnt help much...

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t312/fighterpilot04/deflb.jpg

Opus
04-29-2014, 11:25 PM
I placed 10th tonight in a dark matter arkfall that just ended. I was there for about 1/2 the major, did no minors, and mostly did damage with a sniper. Only had 3 kills and I placed much higher than those with a couple dozen kills. Odd indeed.

drackiller
04-30-2014, 12:31 AM
C`mon people what`s ODD with this !? Nothing odd about this.

Working as intended.

Iceberg
04-30-2014, 06:29 AM
Remember, they did this new scoring system so that players couldn't tag an ark fall and drive away gaining full rewards. Now all you do is wait till the boss shows up and time a power kill shot and end up with top score. Lets not forget the new scoring system was to also allow players the need to group up and play together, to bad dlp 5 made that point moot and is now better to solo content than grouping.

ConcreteSnake
04-30-2014, 07:18 AM
well here you can see that showing up for the whole event doesnt help much...

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t312/fighterpilot04/deflb.jpg

last night at 3 monoliths in a row I pretty much only got to pump a few rounds into the tachmag drive with overcharge and got the power kill worth about 260,000 points! Keys and arkforge galore!

Zugo
04-30-2014, 08:22 AM
I wish you all would pipe down.

ArkGuardian_MichaelDial
04-30-2014, 09:14 AM
It just seemed odd to spend so little time there, shoot a short burst into the monolith, and end up on the leaderboard at all.

Yes. I will say the same.

Overtkill21
04-30-2014, 09:19 AM
Doesn't seem odd to me in the least.

I've been using this particular game quirk to my advantage for a long time now, even before they expanded the window for landing the kill shot - it is now just way easier to take advantage of.

I don't even find it odd that the new Scoring System was supposed to fix this specific thing and seems to have made it easier to exploit.

I guess I just find it hard to be incredulous with regard to Defiance any more.

Whippy
04-30-2014, 09:42 AM
Is there any reason why it was changed from Damage done? That seems the most viable option when players are trying to team up with the best to get things done. I'm sure the Warmaster leaderboards would change a whole bunch and it would mean showing up for everything...

Iceberg
04-30-2014, 09:50 AM
Is there any reason why it was changed from Damage done? That seems the most viable option when players are trying to team up with the best to get things done. I'm sure the Warmaster leaderboards would change a whole bunch and it would mean showing up for everything...

Because T**** D******

SirServed
04-30-2014, 10:09 AM
I don't care what they throw at me, it won't inspire me to team up and work together. The current scoring system is plainly terrible, so I exploit this "oddity" to stick it to the man. Instead of shooting one guy and leaving, I show up at the end and shoot the main guy to death. Depending on the Arkfall, it usually steals me anywhere from 1st to 5th place.

I can down a T10 Ark Viscera in less than a minute alone. I will only receive points if my nano procs, I use a utility grenade, and when the target dies. Several players can take 3 minutes to kill a different Ark Viscera and get more points than I will simply because they're ganging up on him. You would think making the game more difficult would reward more heroic efforts. /rant off

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 10:14 AM
So much for encouraging team play and cooperation. They screwed this up so badly it now has exactly the OPPOSITE effect and most of us prefer to run alone. I'll be exploiting the crap out of this one any chance I get. This is the worst backfire mess I've seen yet in Defiance.

I have a hard time being surprised by the incredible amount of incompetence clearly displayed in these kinds of decision. And yet...it's kind of amazing.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 10:20 AM
Patch 1.505 (hotfix) - Patch Notes - posted by Morgana

Release Date:
NA PC: 4/30/2014 @ 10:00 AM PDT / 6:00 PM GMT


Put a tighter control on enemy EGO ratings based on threat level, and fixed decreasing threat levels so it more reliably makes the enemies easier.
Many enemies experienced a massive leap in difficulty at threat rating 3, vand this carried on to subsequent threat ratings. This leap has been adjusted in the following groups of enemies:
Raiders


Volge
Dark Matter
Scrappers
Hellbugs
Rogue E-Rep
Mutants

Adjusted scoring values for rewarding arkforge. Arkforge now drops from within arkbreaks at an increased rate. Additionally, arkforge will drop from standard events after achieving a score of 35,000 or more.
Volge Lightning Rifle and Volge Thunderer Pistol can now both have nano effects.
Incursion sieges now properly calculate threat level changes.
Increased the window for the Killing Blow score bonus on bosses.


Wait a sec...see that very last bullet point there in today's 1.505 patch notes? So we ALREADY have a giant killing blow window and now it's going to be even bigger? Good LORD what kind of points will we get when the hotfix is done? Can't WAIT to find out!

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 10:20 AM
Because T**** D******

Go ahead. Say it. :p

3rdpig
04-30-2014, 10:23 AM
I'm with you guys, I'll do one minor, heal some folks then fire a few rounds into the drive of the Monolith and that's all. No way I'm doing the whole major when it takes 30-45 minutes and a gallon of sweat to do one stinking daily at TL 10 with two or three pugs hiding behind rocks the whole time.

Trion, did you think these changes through at all, or were most of them thought up during a Friday afternoon "drunk at work" moment?

3rdpig
04-30-2014, 10:26 AM
Wait a sec...see that very last bullet point there in today's 1.505 patch notes? So we ALREADY have a giant killing blow window and now it's going to be even bigger? Good LORD what kind of points will we get when the hotfix is done? Can't WAIT to find out!

Yea, just think of all the OJ Birdshot Pumps, Rebound Lobbers and Bullrush 45's we'll get!

bigguy
04-30-2014, 10:27 AM
For all the things they take away from us , For all the things we like that they nerf , For all the time we put in for little reward , For all the events we did and got disconnected before the end and lost our rewards you think people would just keep thier mouths closed and enjoy something good.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 10:28 AM
Because T**** D******

http://i1375.photobucket.com/albums/ag464/lenzdude/i-see-what-you-did-there-ceiling-cat-27940-1250313420-23_zps54b73b34.jpg

Overtkill21
04-30-2014, 10:31 AM
I'm with you guys, I'll do one minor, heal some folks then fire a few rounds into the drive of the Monolith and that's all. No way I'm doing the whole major when it takes 30-45 minutes and a gallon of sweat to do one stinking daily at TL 10 with two or three pugs hiding behind rocks the whole time.

Trion, did you think these changes through at all, or were most of them thought up during a Friday afternoon "drunk at work" moment?

Exactly - and why even risk the danged disconnect likely from all your work at the minors.

I've been disconnected from almost EVERY single Incursion that I attempted to do from start to finish since this new Patch. Now if I just go to the Siege at the end - I have a much reduced likelihood of disco. The same applies to Dark Matter Arkfalls.

Got to save our time in game for the hour and a half Daily Contracts - Hellbug Horror is so freakin' funny when there are noobs present.

Overtkill21
04-30-2014, 10:33 AM
For all the things they take away from us , For all the things we like that they nerf , For all the time we put in for little reward , For all the events we did and got disconnected before the end and lost our rewards you think people would just keep thier mouths closed and enjoy something good.

I don't see it as something good though. I see it as a legitimate concern that should have been addressed by a Scoring System change but once again Trion's implementation of seemingly good ideas leaves a lot to be desired.

ConcreteSnake
04-30-2014, 10:38 AM
So much for encouraging team play and cooperation. They screwed this up so badly it now has exactly the OPPOSITE effect and most of us prefer to run alone. I'll be exploiting the crap out of this one any chance I get. This is the worst backfire mess I've seen yet in Defiance.

I have a hard time being surprised by the incredible amount of incompetence clearly displayed in these kinds of decision. And yet...it's kind of amazing.

I totally agree, especially with the threat levels id rather play alone. If someone else even drives by my contract sight I just say eff it and leave, 10 minutes alone or 45 minutes with 2+ players. Also with those monolith kills, I was there for maybe a minute to get the power kill and ended up with 35 keys and 9 arkforge everytime. What's joke the scoring system is now. Less work, more payout.

Overtkill21
04-30-2014, 10:43 AM
... Less work, more payout.

...but only for us High EGO players - poor low EGO guys - good luck getting a killshot with your spitball shooter. LOL

Zugo
04-30-2014, 10:43 AM
Not sure if everyone is missing the point here.

I play the game because I like driving around slaughtering enemies with friends and strangers. I'm not concerned about the people showing up at the end because I still get my points as if they had been there the whole time. There is no detrimental effect to me directly when someone shows up at the end and lands a kill shot so why should I care.

We are all getting more keys, forge, and XP from these things now so.. What's all the hubbub, bub?
http://livingincinema.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/whats-all-the-hubbub.jpg

Deunan
04-30-2014, 10:48 AM
I don't see it as something good though. I see it as a legitimate concern that should have been addressed by a Scoring System change but once again Trion's implementation of seemingly good ideas leaves a lot to be desired.The ironic thing is that the scoring system was supposed to encourage participation in entire events and now it does the exact opposite. We've basically gone 360 degrees back to the mentality under the old system of "let everyone else grind the fragments and I'll just go to the boss fight at the end and do a bit of damage and a bit of healing at the end and get my max keys".

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 10:50 AM
Not sure if everyone is missing the point here.

I play the game because I like driving around slaughtering enemies with friends and strangers. I'm not concerned about the people showing up at the end because I still get my points as if they had been there the whole time. There is no detrimental effect to me directly when someone shows up at the end and lands a kill shot so why should I care.

We are all getting more keys, forge, and XP from these things now so.. What's all the hubbub, bub?

I can't figure out what all the crying's about either.

As far as I can tell, it has to do with people getting an 'undeserved' rank on the score list. Ultimately I'm having a lot more fun with the DLC as a whole, but there must be some aspect about the scoring I'm supposed to be outraged about, but failing to grasp.

bigguy
04-30-2014, 10:53 AM
I agree with zugo we are getting some real rewards and real arkforge which is hard to come by , I dont care who does what as long as everyone is having fun and getting something for thier time played....In my eyes its a win win situation .

Zugo
04-30-2014, 10:53 AM
I can't figure out what all the crying's about either.

As far as I can tell, it has to do with people getting an 'undeserved' rank on the score list. Ultimately I'm having a lot more fun with the DLC as a whole, but there must be some aspect about the scoring I'm supposed to be outraged about, but failing to grasp.

Ah, I see.
Well if those people were helping throughout the whole fight and showed up at the end and landed that same kill shot wouldn't they have an even higher score?

Deunan
04-30-2014, 10:56 AM
Not sure if everyone is missing the point here.Uh no, you're missing the point. One of primary reasons for the scoring system was to reward players based on contribution to the event. Players were complaining or otherwise noting in feedback that there was something broken about a reward system that gave the same max keys to players who tagged Arkfalls while others did the heavy lifting and got nothing extra for their efforts over those other players. When the scoring system was put in, initially the rewards for kill shots were much smaller and the key reward from it wouldn't exceed or even come close to the key rewards for the player who did the whole Major Arkfall but might have missed the killshot. Now because of the ways they've adjusted scoring and killshot points the whole thing is largely broken and in many ways even worse than the way things were before the scoring system existed.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 10:58 AM
Ah, I see.
Well if those people were helping throughout the whole fight and showed up at the end and landed that same kill shot wouldn't they have an even higher score?

Exactly. That's why don't understand why people are upset about it. I think Chevota takes issue with it, so he might be able to explain why it's borked. There have been a couple of goofy times where I've shown up at the last moment, got the killing shot, and placed really high on the score list (undeserved, you could say). But I certainly didn't get all the keys I would have if I had played from the beginning, nor to my knowledge did it 'rob' anyone of keys they were already going to get.

I'm not understanding the outrage.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 11:01 AM
No crying at all from me. I'll take the 50k exp and all the keys I can carry. It was just a surprise is all. My toon was about 380 something when I got there and over 400 when I left. I got a oj shield too.

Zugo
04-30-2014, 11:04 AM
Uh no, you're missing the point. One of primary reasons for the scoring system was to reward players based on contribution to the event. Players were complaining or otherwise noting in feedback that there was something broken about a reward system that gave the same max keys to players who tagged Arkfalls while others did the heavy lifting and got nothing extra for their efforts over those other players. When the scoring system was put in, initially the rewards for kill shots were much smaller and the key reward from it wouldn't exceed or even come close to the key rewards for the player who did the whole Major Arkfall but might have missed the killshot. Now because of the ways they've adjusted scoring and killshot points the whole thing is largely broken and in many ways even worse than the way things were before the scoring system existed.

Probably my point of view then when it comes to playing the game.

I'm getting points for doing everything leading up to the boss fight and if I land a kill shot I'm getting a huge reward.

Who's guaranteed a kill shot? Nobody, whoever is held in the internal list of players who registered damage at the moment the boss dies. Are we saying that if you didn't "work" your way to the boss you shouldn't participate? No that makes zero sense.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 11:05 AM
Uh no, you're missing the point. One of primary reasons for the scoring system was to reward players based on contribution to the event. Players were complaining or otherwise noting in feedback that there was something broken about a reward system that gave the same max keys to players who tagged Arkfalls while others did the heavy lifting and got nothing extra for their efforts over those other players. When the scoring system was put in, initially the rewards for kill shots were much smaller and the key reward from it wouldn't exceed or even come close to the key rewards for the player who did the whole Major Arkfall but might have missed the killshot. Now because of the ways they've adjusted scoring and killshot points the whole thing is largely broken and in many ways even worse than the way things were before the scoring system existed.

Zugo is one of the coolest, most mellow guys I know (Live chat), and you're reading into and reacting with unwarranted irkyness. You're one of my favorite people on the forums. Please don't. It's icky watching two favorite people do that.

Are you saying that landing the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall? Is it possible they just haven't adjusted it from the 1 key for 5k scale?

Shadow Andreas
04-30-2014, 11:05 AM
What most people don't seem to realize is that you get more points for shooting something that others are already shooting.....it's the "teamwork" bonus (this is sometimes why people with a lot of kills do not have a high score). If you are the only person shooting an enemy and kill it....you don't get many points added to your score...this is why your score goes up by a minimum of 30K when shooting the Tac-Mag drive (EVERYONE is shooting it at the same time).

Deunan
04-30-2014, 11:06 AM
There have been a couple of goofy times where I've shown up at the last moment, got the killing shot, and placed really high on the score list (undeserved, you could say). But I certainly didn't get all the keys I would have if I had played from the beginning.It's not that you didn't get the same amount of keys you would have if you had done the Arkfall from the beginning. It's that you got more keys the player who did do the entire Arkfall and invested far more time and effort than you to get their inferior rewards. There's no rage directed at you. It's an issue with the scoring system and how f**ked up and dysfunctional it is, not some kind of trivial epeen rage about where you appear on the end card score list.

Zugo
04-30-2014, 11:09 AM
Exactly. That's why don't understand why people are upset about it. I think Chevota takes issue with it, so he might be able to explain why it's borked. There have been a couple of goofy times where I've shown up at the last moment, got the killing shot, and placed really high on the score list (undeserved, you could say). But I certainly didn't get all the keys I would have if I had played from the beginning, nor to my knowledge did it 'rob' anyone of keys they were already going to get.

I'm not understanding the outrage.

I kinda get it, but the guy who lands the kill shot would still have landed that kill shot. Trion boosted the HE+2(L) out of the kill bonus. It used to be somewhere in the 40-50k range and now it's 100-200k range(I think).

What's all the hubbub bub? We are getting more stuff so who cares if it's not your turn at point jackpot.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 11:13 AM
I'm still not getting this. Somebody please answer this straight-forward question:

Due to the new key cap (it's no longer 5 thousand points = 1 key), does the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall?

bigguy
04-30-2014, 11:14 AM
There has been a bonus for landing the kill shot on all arkfalls since this game began its just a different scoring system now

Deunan
04-30-2014, 11:17 AM
Zugo is one of the coolest, most mellow guys I know (Live chat), and you're reading into and reacting with unwarranted irkyness.I have no issue with Zugo and like a lot of his posts, but he was the one saying we're not "getting it" which is a bit ironic.

Are you saying that landing the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall? Is it possible they just haven't adjusted it from the 1 key for 5k scale?Yup. It depends on a number of variables but I have gotten killshot rewards that exceeded my score up until that point in the Arkfall, sometimes by as much as 50,000 points or more. Even in Arkfalls where a player only does a half of the fragments they shouldn't receive a lesser reward than the player that drives into the last 20 seconds of the boss fight and gets a kill shot, but that's what can happen when the other player doesn't get a kill shot reward.

The bottom line is kill shots shouldn't afford that many points. They don't merit that kind of a reward. In a mass event like an Arkfall where the boss death is inevitable 99% of the time, it's an absurdly disproportionate reward.

Zugo
04-30-2014, 11:22 AM
It's not that you didn't get the same amount of keys you would have if you had done the Arkfall from the beginning. It's that you got more keys the player who did do the entire Arkfall and invested far more time and effort than you to get their inferior rewards. There's no rage directed at you. It's an issue with the scoring system and how f**ked up and dysfunctional it is, not some kind of trivial epeen rage about where you appear on the end card score list.

The way I have it worked out in my head is like this, please correct where wrong.

Lets take a DM major fall.

Player1 (Overall Score = 100k) + (Boss Score = 60k Assist) 160K

Player2 (Overall Score = 2k) + (Boss Score = 200k Kill) 202K

Player3 (Overall Score = 200k) + (Boss Score = 60k Assist) 260K

You can see that Player1 played the whole fight but missed the kill shot on the boss. He still has more than what he would have had prior to this new scoring system.

Player2 rolled up in his duni, plowed through some DM troops and got lucky with a kill shot jackpot, lucky him. If he had been there through the whole fight he would have still been at the same arkfall, using the same weapons, and getting the registered kill.

Player3 is where I'm usually at, I don't get kill shots often but I have a decent overall score. I'm getting more rewards and like the change.

Zugo
04-30-2014, 11:32 AM
I have no issue with Zugo and like a lot of his posts, but he was the one saying we're not "getting it" which is a bit ironic.
Yup. It depends on a number of variables but I have gotten killshot rewards that exceeded my score up until that point in the Arkfall, sometimes by as much as 50,000 points or more. Even in Arkfalls where a player only does a half of the fragments they shouldn't receive a lesser reward than the player that drives into the last 20 seconds of the boss fight and gets a kill shot, but that's what can happen when the other player doesn't get a kill shot reward.

The bottom line is kill shots shouldn't afford that many points. They don't merit that kind of a reward. In a mass event like an Arkfall where the boss death is inevitable 99% of the time, it's an absurdly disproportionate reward.

They also increased the assist reward so everyone is getting more rewards overall no matter what you're doing at the event.

I understand where you're coming from Deunan. I just don't have that kind of outlook on other people prize. What's theres is theres and what's mine is mine.

Other People Prize
You down with O- P- P ya you know me. You down with O- P- P ya you know me. Who's down with O- P- P- ?

bigguy
04-30-2014, 11:46 AM
I think the real problem lies in the fact that the way they have changed things it takes too long to do contracts and if you have a limited amount of play time then you are trying to do both contracts and arkfalls or events and end up coming in at the end not because you are avoiding it altogether but because you are trying to do alot of things in a small amount of time.

Unfortunatly once again we are talking about something that isnt as important as say server stability which is always a problem or broken incursions or disappearing cars , arent there bigger problems than this.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 11:58 AM
I'm still not getting this. Somebody please answer this straight-forward question:

Due to the new key cap (it's no longer 5 thousand points = 1 key), does the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall?

I think the answer here is that you get almost as much or more rewards for popping in at the end of arkfalls, which is the opposite of Trion's intent that they have stated in the past. It's simply a discussion, not a who's right or wrong kind of situation so I'm not sure why everyone is complaining about everyone else complaining. As if we all should agree all of a sudden?

It's just a discussion thread, nothing more. "an oddity" as the OP called it.

Deunan
04-30-2014, 12:00 PM
I understand where you're coming from Deunan. I just don't have that kind of outlook on other people prize. What's theres is theres and what's mine is mine.It's not about looking at other people's rewards. It's about poor game design. Reward should be reflective of effort/contribution and kill shot bonus scores as they exist are irreconcilable with that. This game has many poorly designed and/or poorly implemented elements to it and this is just one more, but it's all the more telling because it literally does the exact opposite of part of what it was meant to do.

Magick
04-30-2014, 12:07 PM
The system was always like this, even when it was based on DMG. I could come to the boss fight and put up my massive dps get kill shot and bam placing in top tier. This is what seperates low ego players from the high ego players.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:08 PM
It's not about looking at other people's rewards. It's about poor game design. Reward should be reflective of effort/contribution and kill shot bonus scores as they exist are irreconcilable with that. This game has many poorly designed and/or poorly implemented elements to it and this is just one more, but it's all the more telling because it literally does the exact opposite of part of what it was meant to do.

Yes that. ^
Personally, I really don't care where I end up on the scoreboard, I just want my keys/salvage and other rewards. I'm not above an exploit such as this. If people are mad when I pop in at the end, in my view I wonder why they aren't doing the same thing? On the other hand, I don't mind running the entire arkfall from the first crystal to the end - making sure I got a friend around so when I DC I can get back there. And I really don't notice if others are popping in at the end letting me do all the work either. I run it both ways I guess. And I pretty much quit looking at scores a long time ago...knowing how little sense it makes and how it's going to change with every patch anyway.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:09 PM
The system was always like this, even when it was based on DMG. I could come to the boss fight and put up my massive dps get kill shot and bam placing in top tier. This is what seperates low ego players from the high ego players.

But, Trion tried to change it to keep that from happening. They were trying to get us to work cooperatively and this thread is trying to point out that it's actually had the opposite effect. It's made us all much more soloists than ever before.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:12 PM
I don't think this thread was meant to create a war of words, it's simply an observation. Everyone calm down. It would be better to just read the thoughts here, not try to argue every little thing just to make "points".

Perhaps this will help:

http://www.ehow.com/about_6593485_definition-reading-comprehension.html

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:13 PM
not an oddity. you cot there in time for a critical kill, which gives you a 100k point bonus to your score

In fact, this. ^

I wonder if it's different with 1.505 patch. Any observations for us?

Zugo
04-30-2014, 12:16 PM
It's not about looking at other people's rewards. It's about poor game design. Reward should be reflective of effort/contribution and kill shot bonus scores as they exist are irreconcilable with that. This game has many poorly designed and/or poorly implemented elements to it and this is just one more, but it's all the more telling because it literally does the exact opposite of part of what it was meant to do.

If I'm following the complaint correctly then a quick fix would be to reduce the kill shot and assist scores down to what there were previously and reduce the number of people who are granted kill shot rewards to what it once was(1 person?).

Zugo doesn't like this because more is better to Zugo who has taken up talking in 3rd person.

Deunan
04-30-2014, 12:21 PM
I'm still not getting this. Somebody please answer this straight-forward question:

Due to the new key cap (it's no longer 5 thousand points = 1 key), does the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall?You get 1 key per 5k score up to 20k and then 1 key per 10k score after that. It's definitely possible.

Overtkill21
04-30-2014, 12:22 PM
...Who's guaranteed a kill shot? ....

I am. I have gotten 10/10 of the last ten arkfall killshots I have gone for. :) I have a method. It has proven...valuable; especially on PS3 where the more time at any given event = higher the chance for disconnect and nothing for you. (Oh and since you just have to land damage in the now much larger window - c'mon it's just a matter of timing that overcharge.)


...Are you saying that landing the killing shot gets you more keys than is possible to earn playing through the entire Fall? Is it possible they just haven't adjusted it from the 1 key for 5k scale?

I have definitely experienced that just landing the killshot grants me more score and higher place on the leaderboard - thusly more reward as those are based on that score - than 90% of the players who were likely there for the entire time. I especially find it funny all the times I am first place with one kill and second place has over three hundred kills...

Zugo
04-30-2014, 12:28 PM
I got an easy fix.

Give us decent sized point rewards for completing each minor leading up to the boss fight and reduce the boss kill shot reward to half of what it is now.

Each minor should grant something like 20k points so that if you are there from the beginning you will have more than 100k at the start of the boss fight.

Irteip Zeugirdor
04-30-2014, 12:29 PM
Well to me the whole thing is totally unfair and screwed up. Last night. I did 3 Dm Arkfalls, scored more than 350k points each and I finished dead last on all 3 of them. One of them I even got like 60 kills and still ended up dead last. When I looked at the one who got 1st place. No kills, 3 downs and scored almost half a million points. I'm sorry but the numbers doesn't add up. This killing blow exploit/glitch/bug has to be fixed. Ohhh abd btw.. I played all 3 of them from the beginning.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:29 PM
If I'm following the complaint correctly then a quick fix would be to reduce the kill shot and assist scores down to what there were previously and reduce the number of people who are granted kill shot rewards to what it once was(1 person?).

Zugo doesn't like this because more is better to Zugo who has taken up talking in 3rd person.

Zugo like, eh? =D MORE!

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:30 PM
Well to me the whole thing is totally unfair and screwed up. Last night. I did 3 Dm Arkfalls, scored more than 350k points each and I finished dead last on all 3 of them. One of them I even got like 60 kills and still ended up dead last. When I looked at the one who got 1st place. No kills, 3 downs and scored almost half a million points. I'm sorry but the numbers doesn't add up. This killing blow exploit/glitch/bug has to be fixed. Ohhh abd btw.. I played all 3 of them from the beginning.

Yup. But the thing about Defiance is, ya gotta go with the flow and play the exploits to get ahead.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 12:38 PM
I think the answer here is that you get almost as much or more rewards for popping in at the end of arkfalls, which is the opposite of Trion's intent that they have stated in the past. It's simply a discussion, not a who's right or wrong kind of situation so I'm not sure why everyone is complaining about everyone else complaining. As if we all should agree all of a sudden?

It's just a discussion thread, nothing more. "an oddity" as the OP called it.

Uhh....I know?

I wasn't 'complaining' about people 'complaining', only stating my confusion. I also never stated somebody was 'right or wrong'. I also didn't state that people needed to 'agree'.

Please stop making inferences where none exist.

Zugo
04-30-2014, 12:50 PM
I'm just confused as to why people want less rewards across the board to deal with people getting credit for a boss kill shot.

If someone has been there since the start and gets the kill shot they are going to get a huge reward and I like that option. I even like it enough to put up with other people getting it when I'm not lucky enough to get it.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:53 PM
I can't figure out what all the crying's about either.

As far as I can tell, it has to do with people getting an 'undeserved' rank on the score list. Ultimately I'm having a lot more fun with the DLC as a whole, but there must be some aspect about the scoring I'm supposed to be outraged about, but failing to grasp.

Guess this was what made me feel you were handing out undue criticism of other people's opinions. That crying comment. I didn't see anyone crying, just watching this thread descend into an argument as opposed to a discussion.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 12:54 PM
Uhh....I know?

I wasn't 'complaining' about people 'complaining', only stating my confusion. I also never stated somebody was 'right or wrong'. I also didn't state that people needed to 'agree'.

Please stop making inferences where none exist.

Tense, aren't we?

Deunan
04-30-2014, 12:56 PM
If I'm following the complaint correctly then a quick fix would be to reduce the kill shot and assist scores down to what there were previously and reduce the number of people who are granted kill shot rewards to what it once was(1 person?).I'm not a fan of the term quick fix or any kind of change which deserves that term. Quick fixes often lack foresight and more often than not simply trade one set of problems for another set of problems. Case in point:

Zugo doesn't like this because more is better to Zugo who has taken up talking in 3rd personIt's problematic making a change that also removes a huge chunk of potential reward for an event. It probably should have never been there in the first place but once you give something to players it's understandably unpopular and not the best idea to simply take it away from them.

I can think of one way they can reduce the amount of the bonus score while keeping the reward pool relatively intact but I don't think they'll do it if for no other reason than their pseudo-justification for reducing key rewards never made any sense to begin with. They supposedly reduced key rewards because of the addition of Arkforge rewards and the ability to otherwise get a lot more keys due to scaling but that makes so little sense on so many levels (e.g. the fact that Arkforge caps at 9 at 200k and the fact that so much of the key rewards comes from the broken mechanic of boss kill shot bonus or assist bonus).

Still, in theory they could reduce the kill shot and assist bonuses for the boss for open world events only and rollback the key reward scoring system to 1 key per 5k score for all events. That way for instanced events like expert co-op maps, players could also make up for the loss of being able to get keys and Arkforge from an Arkfall boss kill shot because they were doing a co-op map that kept them from doing most of an Arkfall. However, I don't think they would ever do this because....grenades. :rolleyes:

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 01:01 PM
Zugo doesn't like this because more is better to Zugo who has taken up talking in 3rd person.

Bonehead thinks we should have 3rd person day here on the forum sometime.

Deunan
04-30-2014, 01:02 PM
Deunan thinks that's a silly idea and won't participate....

Shadow Andreas
04-30-2014, 01:04 PM
What if they handed out a key and/or ArkForge for each of the minors (within a Major) that you were at the "END" of....that way you couldn't just tag each of the minors. Then if they did something with the scoring at the end to balance (like some of the examples from above). That way the people that did the minors would get additional bonus reward compaired to the people just showing up at the end?

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 01:13 PM
Deunan thinks that's a silly idea and won't participate....

Okay that was the camel that broke the keyboard's back.
It can only take so much root beer you know.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 01:26 PM
Guess this was what made me feel you were handing out undue criticism of other people's opinions. That crying comment. I didn't see anyone crying, just watching this thread descend into an argument as opposed to a discussion.

Oh, I see. Collective misinterpretation. I've seen nothing but complaining everywhere about the scoring system, met with others who have no problem with it. This thread is only a small fraction of this non-debate.

No, I'm not tense at all. But given that you've made it clear in countless threads that you completely dislike the DLC, and I've now stated my opinion as liking it, I have no doubt that there will be many people to come looking to pick an argument, any way they can.

You're kind of needlessly inserting yourself where it isn't necessary. If I felt that it was becoming non-constructive with Deunan, I'd simply PM him. I'm pretty fond of several people on the forums, including him, and have been known to do that.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 01:32 PM
What if they handed out a key and/or ArkForge for each of the minors (within a Major) that you were at the "END" of....that way you couldn't just tag each of the minors. Then if they did something with the scoring at the end to balance (like some of the examples from above). That way the people that did the minors would get additional bonus reward compaired to the people just showing up at the end?

I wasn't aware that it was that severely lop-sided, like Deunan pointed out. That kind of grates at my sense of OCD by way of scaled balance. Rather than removing the point bonus completely, relocating it to the fragments somehow would be the way I would prefer them to go.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 01:35 PM
I'm pretty fond of several people on the forums

Meee Toooo!

Shadow Andreas
04-30-2014, 01:36 PM
I wasn't aware that it was that severely lop-sided, like Deunan pointed out. That kind of grates at my sense of OCD by way of scaled balance. Rather than removing the point bonus completely, relocating it to the fragments somehow would be the way I would prefer them to go.

Honestly....It doesn't bother me....guess I'm like Zugo (as long as I get mine I'm good). I am just trying to put some ideas out there that might make others happier with the events. :)

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 01:40 PM
For the record I did not intend to start an argument. Also, truth be told, I liked getting the points and the swag. It just struck me as odd.

Shadow Andreas
04-30-2014, 01:44 PM
For the record I did not intend to start an argument. Also, truth be told, I liked getting the points and the swag. It just struck me as odd.

Sure you didn't Bonehead :)

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 01:48 PM
For the record I did not intend to start an argument. Also, truth be told, I liked getting the points and the swag. It just struck me as odd.

Yeah I tried to clarify that earlier...instead was accused of "inserting myself" etc. and not quite sure but seem to have awakened someone's loathing of me. NO not you!

I also like quite a few people on these forums.

What we need now is one of your silly GIF files.

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 01:52 PM
Oh, I see. Collective misinterpretation. I've seen nothing but complaining everywhere about the scoring system, met with others who have no problem with it. This thread is only a small fraction of this non-debate.

No, I'm not tense at all. But given that you've made it clear in countless threads that you completely dislike the DLC, and I've now stated my opinion as liking it, I have no doubt that there will be many people to come looking to pick an argument, any way they can.

You're kind of needlessly inserting yourself where it isn't necessary. If I felt that it was becoming non-constructive with Deunan, I'd simply PM him. I'm pretty fond of several people on the forums, including him, and have been known to do that.

You're entitled to your opinion but I seem to feel hostility from you. If that is not intended, good and fine. If it is, oh well, too bad. I'll live.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 02:11 PM
Yeah I tried to clarify that earlier...instead was accused of "inserting myself" etc. and not quite sure but seem to have awakened someone's loathing of me. NO not you!

I also like quite a few people on these forums.

What we need now is one of your silly GIF files.

This one is about the silliest I have.

http://i1375.photobucket.com/albums/ag464/lenzdude/Drop-the-bass_zpse933d248.gif

dramaQkarri
04-30-2014, 02:15 PM
This one is about the silliest I have.

http://i1375.photobucket.com/albums/ag464/lenzdude/Drop-the-bass_zpse933d248.gif

LOL that works thanks!

N3gativeCr33p
04-30-2014, 02:31 PM
Rather than removing the point bonus completely, relocating it to the fragments somehow would be the way I would prefer them to go.

Creep likes this idea.

Irteip Zeugirdor
04-30-2014, 03:17 PM
Yup. But the thing about Defiance is, ya gotta go with the flaws and play the exploits to get ahead.


There ya go.. fixed for ya.

Magick
04-30-2014, 03:27 PM
Well here check this , I have a Mutant mayhem crystal down to 5% and then some lvl 300 or 5000 shows up wow it gets full health they keep goin down then extracting coming back back guess what crytal back to 100% infinite health glitch thank you. Verdent ridge lets solo that? so many broken things...

TrickDempsey
04-30-2014, 03:27 PM
Thought I'd hop in real quick to confirm a couple things.

The kill value in the end screen does not line up with the kill credit from points. (Yeah, this is now being fixed. It'll be in a future update. We feel pretty silly.) It's counting last hits only, while score is concerned with dealing damage in a window near the kill.

Magick
04-30-2014, 03:30 PM
Thought I'd hop in real quick to confirm a couple things.

The kill value in the end screen does not line up with the kill credit from points. (Yeah, this is now being fixed. It'll be in a future update. We feel pretty silly.) It's counting last hits only, while score is concerned with dealing damage in a window near the kill.

Trick sorry we probably posted at the same time but please try to solo verdent ridge and see how rediculous it is even at any ego.

TrickDempsey
04-30-2014, 03:59 PM
Trick sorry we probably posted at the same time but please try to solo verdent ridge and see how rediculous it is even at any ego.

Oh no. That sounds terrifying. I'll give it a try.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 05:37 PM
Ahma have to give that a try too.

Hellbug horror was a bad one too for threat balance.

Oh well, baby steps.

Magick
04-30-2014, 05:55 PM
Oh no. That sounds terrifying. I'll give it a try.

I satarted with TL6 and was insane then 80% done friend spawned on me making it TL 10 then he left lol still finsihed it 12 deaths in all but still fun I dare you.

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 05:58 PM
Thought I'd hop in real quick to confirm a couple things.

The kill value in the end screen does not line up with the kill credit from points. (Yeah, this is now being fixed. It'll be in a future update. We feel pretty silly.) It's counting last hits only, while score is concerned with dealing damage in a window near the kill.

So it waaaas an oddity after all!

Jet1337
04-30-2014, 06:21 PM
They should keep this system in. I got to a dark matter major in the last minute and ended up getting over 225k. That's over 120k xp, 20 arkforge, and a lot of keycodes for me!

Bonehead
04-30-2014, 06:36 PM
They should keep this system in. I got to a dark matter major in the last minute and ended up getting over 225k. That's over 120k xp, 20 arkforge, and a lot of keycodes for me!

I know right?
I should have kept my silence.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 10:57 PM
Meee Toooo!

I like you, Bonehead. The only argument that exists is in someone's mind.

That fish gif cracks me up.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 10:59 PM
You're entitled to your opinion but I seem to feel hostility from you.

That's curious, because the feeling is mutual from you as well. And equally indifferent, as I couldn't care less either.

Lillith Valerian
04-30-2014, 11:02 PM
Honestly....It doesn't bother me....guess I'm like Zugo (as long as I get mine I'm good). I am just trying to put some ideas out there that might make others happier with the events. :)

I'm thinking about blackmailing you somehow, using a picture that may or may not have been taken today, of a player who may or may not be shadowy in persuasion, who may or may not have achieved 4 trillion points and the number 1 spot with only 9 kills...

:D

Chump Norris
04-30-2014, 11:03 PM
Thought I'd hop in real quick to confirm a couple things.

The kill value in the end screen does not line up with the kill credit from points. (Yeah, this is now being fixed. It'll be in a future update. We feel pretty silly.) It's counting last hits only, while score is concerned with dealing damage in a window near the kill.

Speaking of that feeling: http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?157512-another-shields-problem-typos-wont-explain-this

Please tell me you are working on this as well.

Shadow Andreas
05-01-2014, 07:59 AM
I'm thinking about blackmailing you somehow, using a picture that may or may not have been taken today, of a player who may or may not be shadowy in persuasion, who may or may not have achieved 4 trillion points and the number 1 spot with only 9 kills...

:D

Well......if that would have happened.....I think the person would have been in the ArkFall for the whole thing.....got 7 kills and might have scored 456,737.

What I have noticed is what I said earlier......it's not the kills that matter.....it's getting the "teamwork" bonus from the damage you do to things that others are shooting (It does help to get one of the kill shots though). I noticed that there were MANY people with under 10 kills and scores over 400K.