PDA

View Full Version : Best DPS question



077
06-18-2014, 01:35 AM
I've seen post saying the Saw,or Thunder LMG, and the SMG with 25 fire rate r the best,but most of those post are from last year.So i was wondering is this still true, and if so what r the best mods to have on these weapons as well as the best nano?

crazyged
06-18-2014, 02:36 AM
I'm not an expert on the LMG dps, but I use the SMG Tachmag Pulser. That thing does some savage damage really quickly.

Atticus Batman
06-18-2014, 02:43 AM
I'm not an expert on the LMG dps, but I use the SMG Tachmag Pulser. That thing does some savage damage really quickly.

The vot pulser does more damage but has a slower firerate than the tachmag, but do to higher firerat people use the tachmag. I also use a tachmag. Btw no-nano weapons do the most raw damage.

crazyged
06-18-2014, 02:47 AM
Btw no-nano weapons do the most raw damage.

Yeah? I'm going to try that out!

Atticus Batman
06-18-2014, 02:55 AM
Yeah? I'm going to try that out!

It's easy to check. Get a no-nano gun and look at it's damage then put a rad mod on it and the damage changes to match the nano. Look at that damage, then switch to the fire mod. You will see the differences. Remember though that is sheer damage. The damage numbers on the cards are affected by the nano, but don't list the nano's effects or take it's modifiers into account. Check this page to see for yourself. Of course I am a hands on learner. So I still had to mod guns and find identical ones with different nanos to see the damage differences on card for myself. It is still a great page, even though it appears to be getting reno'ed again.

http://www.defiancedata.com/page.php?id=15

crazyged
06-18-2014, 03:12 AM
Yeah, I'm still finding my way around the nanos. My Tachmag is syphon, which has it's perks, but I'm looking for a bio, just to see what the difference is. I normally opt for Increased capacity mags, but I'll tinker around with a throwaway gun to see what's what!

Logain
06-18-2014, 03:17 AM
I've seen post saying the Saw,or Thunder LMG, and the SMG with 25 fire rate r the best,but most of those post are from last year.So i was wondering is this still true, and if so what r the best mods to have on these weapons as well as the best nano?

To compare your individual guns DPS you can download a DPS Calculator (http://www.bit.ly/DuxDPScalc) and input the numbers from your own guns.

Edit: fixed link. Oops

Atticus Batman
06-18-2014, 03:21 AM
To compare your individual guns DPS you can download a DPS Calculator (http:// www.bit.ly /DuxDPScalc) and input the numbers from your own guns.

Thank you Logain! I knew if I kept this thread alive long enough, you or somebody else would be along to post that or some other helpful advice! :)

Telemachus
06-18-2014, 04:07 AM
The vot pulser does more damage but has a slower firerate than the tachmag, but do to higher firerat people use the tachmag. I also use a tachmag. Btw no-nano weapons do the most raw damage.

.




A saw is nice , in the past. Though the tachmag and the pulser you can hip fire with and slot skills to benefit that type of play

squidgod2000
06-18-2014, 05:24 AM
Pulser and Tachmag will give you higher scores due to their high ROF and are convenient to use because (for some messed up reason that was never made clear to me) they have near-perfect hip-fire aim and very little bloom/recoil, but they're not the best in terms of DPS.

Logain
06-18-2014, 06:20 AM
Pulser and Tachmag will give you higher scores due to their high ROF and are convenient to use because (for some messed up reason that was never made clear to me) they have near-perfect hip-fire aim and very little bloom/recoil, but they're not the best in terms of DPS.

Actually according to Tekrunner's Weapon Tables (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?153129-Weapon-Tables) the Pulser and the Tachmag are the two highest DPS weapons in the game (with all other things being equal: i.e. rolls, bonuses, EGO level etc.).

The top 5 DPS guns in the game (with all else being equal i.e. rolls, bonuses, EGO level etc.) are:
1. VOT Pulser (and variants, i.e. Votan Pulser, Castithan Springer etc.)
2. VOT Tachmag (and variants, i.e. Needler, Hog Leg etc. )
3. LM-43 Thunder (and variants)
4. Heavy FRC Assault Rifle (Tekrunner has the fire rate at 6 when the base fire rate is 9 which after the correction sneaks the heavy FRC into the top 5)
5. VBI Tacc Assault Rifle
6. FRC Sub Carbine (falls just outside the top 5 but is really close).

On the other hand if crit shots are important to you, the top 5 Crit DPS guns in the game are:
1. VBI S-22 Ranger
2. VBI HP-6 Wolfhound (and variants i.e. Wildcat)
... huge drop off (~10%)
3. VBI Semi-Auto Sniper Rifle
4. FRC Quick Repeater
5. VBI Tacc Autopistol (about 74% of the leaders)
6. VOT Pulser (comes in at 6th but only at 66% of the leader as unlike just DPS there is a steep drop off).

Kibblehouse
06-18-2014, 06:47 AM
I asked this in another thread and got no response, I'll give it a try here. Does anyone know if ROF is effected by lag? Specificly I am wondering if High ROF weapons are more sensitive to Lag then lower ROF ones. This comes from personal non-scientific observation. In MY hands a Tachmag pulser never reaches the level of awesome that many others have reported. Now there can be many reasons for this most of which are due to ME, but the reason I ask about lag is this: There are times I can hold down the trigger on a tachmag and watch the ROF fluctuate as it fires, ranging from something approximating a fast AR, up to Buzzsaw ROF the tachmag is supposed to have. I am judgeing this by the sound, and watching the damage numbers popping up. In MY hands I can most of the time do more damage with a good AR than a Tachmag (consider both at close range to exclude falloff effects). Now I know I could be seeing a "Display issue" meaning I am causing the damage I am supposed to but just not seeing the numbers pop on screen, but it does seem like I have an easier time "making them dead" with an AR or lower ROF SMG than the tachmag.

Note I only really notice this with the highest ROF weapons.
Also Note I am not blaming anyone for this lag is most likely my end, and its really not an issue that effects my play, just something I noticed and I was wondering if it was real.

crazyged
06-18-2014, 06:53 AM
Note I only really notice this with the highest ROF weapons.
Also Note I am not blaming anyone for this lag is most likely my end, and its really not an issue that effects my play, just something I noticed and I was wondering if it was real.

Actually, Ive noticed this as well - thought it was my imagination!

There's been the odd time when my tachmag seems to sputter a bit... hmmm...

Tekrunner
06-18-2014, 07:48 AM
(Tekrunner has the fire rate at 6 when the base fire rate is 9 which after the correction sneaks the heavy FRC into the top 5)

The reason I have it at 6 is that it's what I have measured. And reaching that value requires really going to town on your mouse, which is not good for accuracy.

However, these stats are for unmodded weapons. I've always meant to do a version of these tables with the various possible mag mods, because some weapons perform quite differently when modded (including HAC...). But... I've never found the motivation to do it.


I asked this in another thread and got no response, I'll give it a try here. Does anyone know if ROF is effected by lag?

It's possible that if your connection is choppy then dropped packets could cause some bullets to be ignored and become "blanks", though I think that enough stuff is managed client-side that it shouldn't happen.

But having low FPS does affect high fire rate weapons. This is why I prefer using a castithan springer rather than a needler on the Warmaster armor. While needlers have slightly more raw DPS, having all these people in this small space often causes my FPS to drop low enough that I'm not actually getting a 25+ fire rate with them. In many shooters fire rates are limited to one bullet per frame at most. I don't know if it's the same here, but it certainly seems possible. Could explain why blast rifles have a fire rate of 15 and fire 3 pellets for each bullet, instead of just having a fire rate of 45.

Logain
06-18-2014, 07:58 AM
The reason I have it at 6 is that it's what I have measured. And reaching that value requires really going to town on your mouse, which is not good for accuracy.

<snip> But... I've never found the motivation to do it.

I have been able to get around 9 ROF for the heavy but it can be dependent on so many things. As far as the modding goes there are just too many and with each patch these effects can vary greatly. So I don't think there is a need.



<snip> Could explain why blast rifles have a fire rate of 15 and fire 3 pellets for each bullet, instead of just having a fire rate of 45.

Interesting... never thought of that before.

On a side note your Weapons Table is one of my favorite threads that I keep going back to take another look. I appreciate the work you and Mavrent (and probably others) put into it and encourage people to take a look.

Kibblehouse
06-18-2014, 08:00 AM
Tekrunner, I like what you said there about low FPS, it matches up with what see. The more lag I see the worse the effect on the ROF. Cool, nice to know I'm not going crazy...at least about this :)

077
06-18-2014, 02:49 PM
thx for all the replies

Deunan
06-18-2014, 03:36 PM
To compare your individual guns DPS you can download a DPS Calculator (http://www.bit.ly/DuxDPScalc) and input the numbers from your own guns.

Edit: fixed link. OopsWhile this gives some valuable numbers there are other factors that come into play in live situations including environmental ones to assess long term DPS for a weapon. These include recoil, bloom, falloff damage range, ammo pool size (very relevant for semi-automatic sniper rifles or dual loadouts that share the same ammo pool), the rate of ammo consumption (the same value as rate of fire but with a negative effect on DPS), the availability of ammo boxes and the availability of ammo drops from mobs.

For example players with a SAW will often fire it in bursts to keep bloom and recoil under control because it will net better damage if it allows them to stay on target on a mobs's crit spot, but that means that the normal rate of fire is less meaningful in determining actual DPS in that kind of situation. A player with a Tachmag Pulser at Bug Basin won't have access to an ammo box and can easily deplete their ammo pool which means having to rely upon an ammo spike instead of a damage spike.

Warhorse500
06-18-2014, 05:17 PM
It wouldn't hurt to look at your perks and the rest of your loadout too. I've discovered that I can "stack" damage by using my Assassin-syn purp Wolfhound, with Overcharge, simultaneously with a Damage spike. When everything's lined up right, I plant the spike, hit OC...and "laze and blaze". Last night with the new Nolan run-thru I burned down the Biomen in 4-5 shots off the Wolfie.

Make sure that the smaller perks are in sync with your main perk. I've learned the hard way that I still had perks that lined up right with Decoy (the first perk/whatever that I started out with), but did nothing for me with Overcharge. (Yeah, I know...somebody out there right now is saying "DUUUUHHHHH, Warhorse..." Gimme a break, nobody's mentoring me in this thing.) Now that my EGO's over 3000, I've started re-aligning my perks to fit the main skill. It helps, believe me.

Kyn
06-18-2014, 06:10 PM
Where can i find Castithan Springer ?

drackiller
06-18-2014, 11:41 PM
Where can i find Castithan Springer ?

In your dreams :)
Kidding, you need to play the Warmaster and you need to have that particylar DLC or else you can`t use dlc weapons.

Tekrunner
06-19-2014, 01:07 AM
In your dreams :)
Kidding, you need to play the Warmaster and you need to have that particylar DLC or else you can`t use dlc weapons.

They can also be found in minor arkbreaks.

@Logain: I'm glad you like the weapon tables. I wish I could add the missing weapons and stats (most notably the paradise and chimera legendaries), but without knowing the formula used for EGO scaling I can't calculate base damage values. I hope that one day Trion will give us that formula...

I assume that you use some kind of "help" to get a fire rate of 9 with a HAC, because I'm not sure it's physically possible to click your mouse 9+ times per second while holding it in any sort of normal way.

drackiller
06-19-2014, 02:10 AM
They can also be found in minor arkbreaks...
Yup, forgot that. Should have said that it is Arkbreaker stuff dlc related.

maverick07
06-19-2014, 02:36 AM
@Logain: I'm glad you like the weapon tables. I wish I could add the missing weapons and stats (most notably the paradise and chimera legendaries), but without knowing the formula used for EGO scaling I can't calculate base damage values. I hope that one day Trion will give us that formula...

I think the only modifier to Paradise and Chimera weapons is a 10% DMG boost (like the other Faction bonuses that have them). I don't think there are other bonuses besides the 10% DMG buff. I compared several variations of weapons with F8ng to determine that they both have a 10% DMG boost. I didn't notice any other stats acting different in my testing (with fully modded Perforator and Typhon).

On a related note. It's pretty lame that both the Pulser and Disruptor varients in the Chimera vendor have 1.15 Mag rolls for the orange bonus instead of 1.25 Mag like they should.

I've given up on that EGO scaling formula at this point :(. I have a feeling we are going to have to dump more of our own Arkforge to get some data on the updated scale for EGO 4000 to 5500 now :rolleyes:.

Logain
06-19-2014, 05:21 AM
While this gives some valuable numbers there are other factors that come into play in live situations including environmental ones to assess long term DPS for a weapon. These include recoil, bloom, falloff damage range, ammo pool size (very relevant for semi-automatic sniper rifles or dual loadouts that share the same ammo pool), the rate of ammo consumption (the same value as rate of fire but with a negative effect on DPS), the availability of ammo boxes and the availability of ammo drops from mobs.

For example players with a SAW will often fire it in bursts to keep bloom and recoil under control because it will net better damage if it allows them to stay on target on a mobs's crit spot, but that means that the normal rate of fire is less meaningful in determining actual DPS in that kind of situation. A player with a Tachmag Pulser at Bug Basin won't have access to an ammo box and can easily deplete their ammo pool which means having to rely upon an ammo spike instead of a damage spike.

All true and people should keep in mind that these are just numbers. Also if you as a player don't use a weapon well (myself with snipers) there is no way you will be able to max out any kind of damage. I still can't hit anything with a Volge Lightning rifle to save my life.

Combo Breaker
06-19-2014, 05:28 AM
Anyone else notice that Castithan Springers rarely drop from Warmaster these days.

On Topic:

I have said for a long time now that Castithan Springers were the best gun in the game. They are Pulsers on crack in my opinion. Great thing about them is they tend to be cheap too. I have one in every nano.

Logain
06-19-2014, 05:37 AM
I hope that one day Trion will give us that formula...

I am not holding my breathe on that. How do the Paradise weapons compare to their normal variants? Is there anyway to back calculate based on that? (For example: the Perforator versus the VBI Assualt Rifle?)


I assume that you use some kind of "help" to get a fire rate of 9 with a HAC, because I'm not sure it's physically possible to click your mouse 9+ times per second while holding it in any sort of normal way.

No help at all. Surprised me as well. I timed it by emptying a 28 mag HAC a couple different times by pressing as fast as I could and keeping track of time with a stop watch. Averaged ~3.2 seconds to empty the mag. I assumed any difference is rounding error or delays from me clicking my stop watch.

I feel that it is not possible to click a mouse 9 times a second but the shots "speed up" some where in the middle of the magazine. I feel like I see this "speed up" effect is seen with several other semi-auto weapons. For example the Wolfhound and VBI TACC Autopistol. I am also not sure if the Tachmag really can shoot 25+ shots per second either. But I figure Trion used some method in determining ROF so I just leave it alone and use it as a guide to compare between guns.

Infinity Eagle
06-19-2014, 05:46 AM
Nobody like the needler? It is my favorite, and yes it uses a LOT of ammo.
http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh222/infinityeagle/Defiance2014-06-1006-10-32-51_zps17efe6a3.png

Kibblehouse
06-19-2014, 06:16 AM
I used to have a springer and a needler, Loved them both. For me they both performed better than my tachmags. However I think I scrapped them both. They were both about 1000pts behind my ego and at the time I thought they were too expensive to bring them up to my current level.

Tekrunner
06-19-2014, 09:54 AM
But I figure Trion used some method in determining ROF so I just leave it alone and use it as a guide to compare between guns.

The way I've always understood it is that:
For single shot weapons, the displayed fire rate is the inverse of the minimum delay between two shots.
For burst weapons, it's the fire rate during a burst, but bears no relationship with the delay between bursts (as evidenced by the fact that fire rate bonuses don't seem to visibly decrease that delay).


I could be wrong, but this makes sense to me. But if I'm right, then it's almost impossible to reach the displayed fire rate on single shot weapons: if you click your mouse too slow, then obviously you won't get the maximum fire rate; but if you click your mouse too fast, you won't either. If you click once, then again just a small fraction of a second too fast for the weapon to fire again, then by the time you click again, the delay between your first and third clicks is likely greater than the minimum delay between two shots. Getting the card fire rate would require clicking at the exact required pace, which is pretty much impossible.

Ah, and I've timed multiple full auto weapons before, including tachmags, and they always seemed to fire at their advertised rate, as long as my FPS were high enough. As discussed in another recent thread, low FPS causes high fire rate weapons to fire slower.

Tekrunner
06-19-2014, 11:30 AM
Just timed myself with a HAC again, averaged 3.1 sec to fire a 20-bullet magazine. Didn't really manage to do better than that no matter how hard I was clicking. Apparently I'm not a very good clicker.

Etaew
06-19-2014, 11:47 AM
To compare your individual guns DPS you can download a DPS Calculator (http://www.bit.ly/DuxDPScalc) and input the numbers from your own guns.

Edit: fixed link. Oops

Do you think anyone would slap me if I added a version to DD based on this? :o

SirServed
06-19-2014, 11:56 AM
Do you think anyone would slap me if I added a version to DD based on this? :o

I think you should do it immediately, if not sooner. Just give credit where it's due at the end of the day.

Logain
06-19-2014, 12:11 PM
Do you think anyone would slap me if I added a version to DD based on this? :o

In small print at the bottom is "Feel free to download and distribute but do not sell and give credit where credit is due. Happy Warmaster Hunting!"

So nope feel free to add. :)

Edit: And credit Tekrunner as well. We both developed similar systems at about the same time and I doubled check my numbers against his.

Tekrunner
06-20-2014, 05:04 AM
Do you think anyone would slap me if I added a version to DD based on this? :o

You know what would be the most awesome feature in the world on DD (well, at least for me)? Connect the weapon builder to your bonus roll database, so that only the right rolls show in the builder's dropdown list. Also connect it to the weapon database, so that it can pull the base stats of each weapon. Then add a bunch of formulas to the mix, and display all kinds of stats for the weapon you just build (like the ones that are on my weapon tables, except in a prettier format). Then give people an easy way of comparing the stats of the different weapons they have built.

I'm sure this would require quite a bit of work, but that would pretty much be the ultimate weapon builder and DPS / stat calculator. I think I suggested something like this many months ago already, but back then you didn't have as many of the required building blocks as you do now. My suggestion seems a little less unrealistic now...

Etaew
06-20-2014, 05:32 AM
You know what would be the most awesome feature in the world on DD (well, at least for me)? Connect the weapon builder to your bonus roll database, so that only the right rolls show in the builder's dropdown list. Also connect it to the weapon database, so that it can pull the base stats of each weapon. Then add a bunch of formulas to the mix, and display all kinds of stats for the weapon you just build (like the ones that are on my weapon tables, except in a prettier format). Then give people an easy way of comparing the stats of the different weapons they have built.

I'm sure this would require quite a bit of work, but that would pretty much be the ultimate weapon builder and DPS / stat calculator. I think I suggested something like this many months ago already, but back then you didn't have as many of the required building blocks as you do now. My suggestion seems a little less unrealistic now...

Not actually that much work.

I've tied the Bonus Rolls and Mods list to the weapon type pages for Assault Rifles as a test: http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?t=1

Also tied the bonus rolls into the weapons builder for Assault Rifles (it already filters mods):
http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?m=179&weaponsbuilder

konstantinov
06-20-2014, 05:35 AM
Not actually that much work.

I've tied the Bonus Rolls and Mods list to the weapon type pages for Assault Rifles as a test: http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?t=1

Also tied the bonus rolls into the weapons builder for Assault Rifles (it already filters mods):
http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?m=179&weaponsbuilder

Etaew, how hard would it be to have the stats on your gun builder update as rolls are applied?

Etaew
06-20-2014, 05:55 AM
Etaew, how hard would it be to have the stats on your gun builder update as rolls are applied?

It used to do that, but I removed it after they added rating scaling as I don't have a formula for it yet :(

konstantinov
06-20-2014, 06:01 AM
It used to do that, but I removed it after they added rating scaling as I don't have a formula for it yet :(

I can imagine the amount of coding and difficulty it would take for something like that.

Dukhat
06-20-2014, 06:11 AM
Pulser and Tachmag will give you higher scores due to their high ROF and are convenient to use because (for some messed up reason that was never made clear to me) they have near-perfect hip-fire aim and very little bloom/recoil, but they're not the best in terms of DPS.

Exactly. I use the VBI SMG, which does considerable more damage (Although you need to aim with it, but it is hardly a problem). It also can have a large mag, ROF etc

drackiller
06-20-2014, 07:14 AM
Exactly. I use the VBI SMG, which does considerable more damage (Although you need to aim with it, but it is hardly a problem). It also can have a large mag, ROF etc

Vot Pulser have larger mags than VBI SMG`s and they also have higher damage i think.

Vot Pulsers are better than VBI SMG`s.

Tekrunner
06-20-2014, 08:20 AM
Not actually that much work.

I've tied the Bonus Rolls and Mods list to the weapon type pages for Assault Rifles as a test: http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?t=1

Also tied the bonus rolls into the weapons builder for Assault Rifles (it already filters mods):
http://www.defiancedata.com/weapons.php?m=179&weaponsbuilder

Looking fairly good. There seems to be an issue with mag rolls: the x1.05 common, x1.10 common, x1.15 uncommon and x1.25 legendary rolls don't appear in the weapon builder. The -0.20 recoil uncommon roll doesn't appear either.

Masteries don't appear to be tied yet in the builder. The entire list is still displayed.

So basically the only thing that stands between me and my dream weapon builder is the fact that we don't know the EGO scaling formula?

Etaew
06-20-2014, 08:43 AM
Looking fairly good. There seems to be an issue with mag rolls: the x1.05 common, x1.10 common, x1.15 uncommon and x1.25 legendary rolls don't appear in the weapon builder. The -0.20 recoil uncommon roll doesn't appear either.

Masteries don't appear to be tied yet in the builder. The entire list is still displayed.

So basically the only thing that stands between me and my dream weapon builder is the fact that we don't know the EGO scaling formula?

That should be sorted now.

And yeah pretty much, we can try and summon another dev but my messages haven't had a response lately. Maybe we have to test it ourselves, cry.

Deunan
06-20-2014, 08:54 AM
Vot Pulser have larger mags than VBI SMS`s and they also have higher damage i think.

Vot Pulsers are better than VBI SMG`s.VOT Pulsers have the same bullet damage and rate of fire as VBI SMG's. However VOT Pulsers are more accurate for hip firing and therefore are better for a run and gun style.

ironcladtrash
06-20-2014, 08:59 AM
VOT Pulsers have the same bullet damage and rate of fire as VBI SMG's. However VOT Pulsers are more accurate for hip firing and therefore are better for a run and gun style.

Other then the gunslinger version that can give you blur I have never found a reason to use a VBI SMG.

Tekrunner
06-20-2014, 09:25 AM
VOT Pulsers have the same bullet damage and rate of fire as VBI SMG's. However VOT Pulsers are more accurate for hip firing and therefore are better for a run and gun style.

Don't forget about the significantly smaller magazine of the VBI. As iron says, there's very little reason to use one.

Deunan
06-20-2014, 10:17 AM
Don't forget about the significantly smaller magazine of the VBI. As iron says, there's very little reason to use one.I don't put a lot of weight on that factor. Looking at the SMG's in isolation it does matter. However because the base reload times are so fast, if you're build is for a longer duration and shorter recharge time for the Overcharge EGO power, then having a smaller mag capacity combined with the Fast Action Reloader and the Pumped Up and Time Out perks can result in higher DPS (especially if you have any reload rarity bonuses). My VOT Pulsers reload so fast that if you blink you'll miss the reload animation.

Z0mb1E
06-20-2014, 12:05 PM
Other then the gunslinger version that can give you blur I have never found a reason to use a VBI SMG.

Use the 7th legion model (don't know the name here at work) with Legion Fury Syn on it. Better yet have 2x of them with at least 2x reload bonuses, run pumped up, time out, overload.

SirServed
06-20-2014, 12:14 PM
I don't put a lot of weight on that factor. Looking at the SMG's in isolation it does matter. However because the base reload times are so fast, if you're build is for a longer duration and shorter recharge time for the Overcharge EGO power, then having a smaller mag capacity combined with the Fast Action Reloader and the Pumped Up and Time Out perks can result in higher DPS (especially if you have any reload rarity bonuses). My VOT Pulsers reload so fast that if you blink you'll miss the reload animation.
Except, smaller clips cause you to reload more often. Total time spent reloading also affects your dps over time. I will leave out reloading under fire which causes you to flinch and reset your reload timer. Time Out can only trigger once every 15 seconds. With a small clip, you will trigger Time Out once on a quick reload, then have several seconds worth of dps time wasted on subsequent reloads.

My standard dps loadout uses Time Out, Pumped Up and Killing Spree. My 117 mag Springer will continuously fire for 6.76 seconds before I have to spend 1.2 on a reload. I spend as little time possible reloading my weapon while Overcharge is active. As for EGO recharge, the Springer has Stalker synergy and comes with 10% EGO power recharge on reload. Even without the synergy boosting it I usually have my power back after 2 full fire and reload cycles.

Don't take my word for it, go ahead and toss your numbers into a dps calculator.

ironcladtrash
06-20-2014, 12:26 PM
Use the 7th legion model (don't know the name here at work) with Legion Fury Syn on it. Better yet have 2x of them with at least 2x reload bonuses, run pumped up, time out, overload.

I actually have a legendary bio one and compare that to a springer or pulsers and it is not as good at all. Has the same damage and fire rate as pulsers but is extremely inaccurate when firing from the hip and you loose too much mobility.

Z0mb1E
06-20-2014, 12:51 PM
I actually have a legendary bio one and compare that to a springer or pulsers and it is not as good at all. Has the same damage and fire rate as pulsers but is extremely inaccurate when firing from the hip and you loose too much mobility.

Sorry you have accuracy issues with anything other than a pulser/springer, that's not really the weapon's problem.

ironcladtrash
06-20-2014, 01:07 PM
Sorry you have accuracy issues with anything other than a pulser/springer, that's not really the weapon's problem.

I am stating facts not insults. The gun isn't as accurate or as good as has been pointed out by others as well besides just me. There is no advantage of a VBI SMG

Deunan
06-20-2014, 05:41 PM
Except, smaller clips cause you to reload more often. Total time spent reloading also affects your dps over time. I will leave out reloading under fire which causes you to flinch and reset your reload timer. Time Out can only trigger once every 15 seconds. With a small clip, you will trigger Time Out once on a quick reload, then have several seconds worth of dps time wasted on subsequent reloads.

My standard dps loadout uses Time Out, Pumped Up and Killing Spree. My 117 mag Springer will continuously fire for 6.76 seconds before I have to spend 1.2 on a reload. I spend as little time possible reloading my weapon while Overcharge is active. As for EGO recharge, the Springer has Stalker synergy and comes with 10% EGO power recharge on reload. Even without the synergy boosting it I usually have my power back after 2 full fire and reload cycles.

Don't take my word for it, go ahead and toss your numbers into a dps calculator.You're right. I did some testing timing how much shorter the recharge time is on a Pulser with a Tier 3 Rapid Reloader (~2 seconds) and how long it takes to fire 500 rounds with a Pulser with a Tier 3 High Capacity Magazine (~38 seconds). Even though I got to pop Overcharge towards the very end for the Pulser with the Rapid Reloader for the same ~38 second time period I still had 25 bullets. The ~2 extra seconds of Overcharge would only result in the equivalent of ~9 more bullets so I ended up trailing in damage by ~16 bullets. It might be a bit more or less than that but it's still more damage regardless.

That being said I would never put anything other than a High Capacity Magazine mod in a Castithan Springer because of it's rarity bonuses.

drackiller
06-21-2014, 12:34 AM
There are advantages in one or another, i think the VBI SMG reloads faster than the Pulser but all in all i prefer the Vot Pulser.
To me it`s the best gun in the game because it`s very well balanced.

Ps: sorry , they reload the same time, just checked, about the damage can`t really say for sure because i don`t have any at the same level and rarity.

Deunan
06-21-2014, 01:14 PM
There are advantages in one or another, i think the VBI SMG reloads faster than the Pulser but all in all i prefer the Vot Pulser.
To me it`s the best gun in the game because it`s very well balanced.

Ps: sorry , they reload the same time, just checked, about the damage can`t really say for sure because i don`t have any at the same level and rarity.The damage is the same as the VOT Pulser. All the card stats are except the mag capacity. The VOT Pulser is far more accurate firing from the hip and it has a larger mag capacity. The VBI SMG has a tighter reticle when aiming down sight but given the SMG's effective range for full damage that really doesn't make for a compelling reason to use it over either VOT SMG's.