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fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 12:38 AM
To establish that an advertisement is false, a plaintiff must prove five things: (1) a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity; (2) the statement either deceives or has the potential to deceive a substantial portion of its targeted audience; (3) the deception is also likely to affect the purchasing decisions of its audience; (4) the advertising involves goods or services in interstate commerce; and (5) the deception has either resulted in or is likely to result in injury to the plaintiff. The most heavily weighed factor is the advertisement's potential to injure a customer. The injury is usually attributed to money the consumer lost through a purchase that would not have been made had the advertisement not been misleading. False statements can be defined in two ways: those that are false on their face and those that are implicitly false.

1. during commercials in the television show defiance, there is an add that says the game is free to play. it does not specify pc, ps3, or xbox. it only says free to play. the game is available on 3 platforms, but only free to play on one. as of now, this satisfies item one.

2. because console players have the potential to know about defiance before watching the show, and could be lead to believe that it is a free to play game according to the lack of information in the television commercial, it has the potential to decieve target audiences, satisfying item two

3. because viewers of the show believe it is free to play, someone may choose to purchase a playstation 3, or xbox 360, in order to play this game, based on their love of the show, under false pretense. that satisfies item 3

4. the show is broadcast in multiple cities, states, and even countries, so the deception takes place across many state lines. since it is carried by syfy, which is carried by service providers based in multiple areas, and trions defiance team itself is based in texas and california, this satisfies item 4

5. this is my favorite. have you read the newspaper, watched the news, or surfed the internet lately? do you know what it takes to receive a judgement based on weather or not you have been injured? a robber breaks into your house, trips over a box in your garage, and sues you for unseen hazards... and wins a settlement!!! a good attorney would put a jury of gamers in the courtroom. it wouldnt be hard since the gaming age range is from 4 to 90 nowadays. he would ask how many times youve gotten mad at this game, couldnt sleep because of a disconnect, broke a controller over lost rewards, posted a thread on the forum in anger over a crappy patch or update or dlc. have you been mentally injured by this game? item five is easy to satisfy.

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 12:46 AM
You might be able to argue about the first one. By this I mean they aren't lying about the game being free, it IS free on PC; that could be a sort of loophole because they aren't lying they simply haven't specified.

Amack
08-09-2014, 12:46 AM
based on weather

Like hurricanes and shiz like that? I'm in Flriduh man, weather here is no joke!

Ozz
08-09-2014, 12:50 AM
This is quite funny: In the last week I was only just pondering over this thought. In Australia, people get sued for creating emotional distress and damage. Something here is ringing a very loud bell :)

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 12:50 AM
Like hurricanes and shiz like that? I'm in Flriduh man, weather here is no joke!

haha, sorry amack. stupid phone fills in most common used words.

and griffix, the commercial doesnt say free to play on pc. the commercial says free to play, period. there is nothing to tell either console player "dont get your hopes up, we dont know when you get this". it states specifically free to play, period.

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 01:19 AM
Its still free to play, they simply don't specify a platform.

Smeejo
08-09-2014, 01:22 AM
I don't see the first one working like that. Just because the sticker on the window says $599 doesn't mean you can walk in with $599 and expect to own the car then sue the lot when you realize that was just the down payment... or could you? *pushes evil thoughts aside for a moment*

The rest of it, while not something I would normally think of, would probably work out very easily lol.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 01:29 AM
Its still free to play, they simply don't specify a platform.

maybe you should take just a moment to actually read the definition i posted. the first prerequisite is that a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity. defiance is a commercial activity. trion states, according to their television commercial, that it is free to play. that is a false statement. i personally went to gamestop two nights ago. i paid off my preorder of The Division on ps4. i talked to the store manager about the push back of the Evolve release date. i also saw new copies of defiance for sale for around 8 dollars. but having checked my playstation store as i type this, defiance is $9.99. its not free. it costs money. im pretty certain that it costs money to play on xbox also, but not having an xbox at the moment i have to rely on the word of others.

Jet1337
08-09-2014, 01:36 AM
How 'bout you guys take the money you spend on bits and other useless crap in the defiance store and hire an attorney!

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 01:37 AM
I don't see the first one working like that. Just because the sticker on the window says $599 doesn't mean you can walk in with $599 and expect to own the car then sue the lot when you realize that was just the down payment... or could you? *pushes evil thoughts aside for a moment*

The rest of it, while not something I would normally think of, would probably work out very easily lol.

depends smeejo. what did the sticker in the window say? did it say 599 down? or did it say 599 total? its all in the wording, and how it affects you. in the case, the wording is simple. the commercial says "free to play". thats it. the game is commonly advertised on 3 different platforms, and it is also commonly advertised (every thursday night during the show) as free to play. however, at no time does trion, nor syfy, make an effort to differentiate that the advertised free to play is not available on the advertised 3 platforms.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 01:38 AM
How 'bout you guys take the money you spend on bits and other useless crap in the defiance store and hire an attorney!

better call saul!!!

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 01:46 AM
"First prerequisite is that a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity"
Defiance IS free...On PC. They haven't made a false statement about that. THAT is the technicality a lawyer could argue, the game IS technically free but they simply haven't stated which platform it is so by all intents and purposes the reasons for point 1 wouldn't really work, especially once the game does go F2P on consoles.

Finding loopholes and technicalities are what tends to get the suit.

DeadEye68
08-09-2014, 01:46 AM
And what exactly would you achieve ?

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 01:56 AM
"First prerequisite is that a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity"
Defiance IS free...On PC. They haven't made a false statement about that. THAT is the technicality a lawyer could argue, the game IS technically free but they simply haven't stated which platform it is so by all intents and purposes the reasons for point 1 wouldn't really work, especially once the game does go F2P on consoles.

Finding loopholes and technicalities are what tends to get the suit.

sorry dude, i just noticed your information. your on xbox. i play on ps3, and its not F2P for us yet, so its probably not a valid conversation for us to be having. since xbox and pc have the F2P option, then this isnt really an issue for you guys. for those of us on ps3, its really ridiculous to see it in the commercials

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:12 AM
Xbox is F2P? Since when?

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:14 AM
And what exactly would you achieve ?

hmmmm, let me think about this question...

okay, hypothetical situation:

my name is jim. i have a wife and 3 kids. i live in a small town call big piney, wyoming. its a tiny littel oilfield town in western wyoming, population around 1500. i have direct tv and watch defiance every thursday night. i love the show, and ive always wanted to try the game. i make decent money, but dont have a lot of extra cash laying around.

my birthday is coming up in a couple of days, and my wife asks what i want. well, i tell her that i would really like a playstation 3. she asks why, and i tell her that ive been watching this show, and now the game is free (according to the commercial i see every week). shes been saving a little, and agrees to get it for me.

so we get in the car saturday morning to go get my new ps3. im really excited, but its a 100 mile drive to rock springs wyoming, which is where i can find the closest gamestop. on the way there, a small group of antelope cross the road unexpectedly. we swerve to miss them, but i lose control of the car and end up crashing into a small ravine. my wife is okay, but my leg is broken. now i have to call into work because i cant make it for a while. when my boss asks why, i have to explain to him that i was driving to rock springs to get a console to play a video game. to him, that is inexcusable. that video game, advertised as free to play, led me to the decision to make a 100 mile trip to purchase a gaming console. now i have no console, no game, no car, and no income. all this because something i didnt couldnt afford was now advertised as free.

so, with that hypothetical situation, i can honestly support every single prerequisite of the legal definition of false advertising. with a good lawyer, i can get a judgement in my favor, and in this day and age, i dont need to worry about working anymore.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:16 AM
Xbox is F2P? Since when?

the commercial on tv says free to play. it must mean pc and xbox, because its not free on ps3

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:16 AM
That situation is a bit biased around your views....

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:17 AM
the commercial on tv says free to play. it must mean pc and xbox, because its not free on ps3
It's not free on Xbox either. PC is the only one that it's free on. However, PlayStation will be going free on the 12th if the devs actually go through with it.

The commercial says it's free but it doesn't specify which system. The technicality is that is IS free.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:21 AM
It's not free on Xbox either. PC is the only one that it's free on. However, PlayStation will be going free on the 12th if the devs actually go through with it.

wait a minute. its not free on xbox either??? but the commercial says the game is free to play!!! so, forgive me if im wrong, but if a television commercial broadcast to hundreds of thousands of viewers says something is free, but two out of three people who have access to that particular item have to pay for it, isnt that a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity?

dynikus
08-09-2014, 02:21 AM
Are you going to argue that a game isn't free to play because you have to pay for an internet connection as well? That you have to pay for the console/pc? electricity? food and water to sustain yourself while playing it?

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:24 AM
That situation is a bit biased around your views....

bias doesnt matter. give me 12 jurors made up of old wyoming ranchers who think video games are a waste of time, a good lawyer, and a lawsuit filed before the 12th of september when you say ps3 gets F2P (which is 3 days after destiny launches making it a futile attempt to get new players lol) and i have a pretty good case.

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:24 AM
wait a minute. its not free on xbox either??? but the commercial says the game is free to play!!! so, forgive me if im wrong, but if a television commercial broadcast to hundreds of thousands of viewers says something is free, but two out of three people who have access to that particular item have to pay for it, isnt that a false statement of fact has been made about the advertiser's own or another person's goods, services, or commercial activity?
You'd only be able to catch them if they explicitly stated "free on all platforms" or something along those lines then turn out it wasn't. That isn't the case here. The case here is that the game is free to play, it IS but they just don't say which platform. As far as I know they don't really tell you what platforms they are even really ON unless you look it up.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:26 AM
Are you going to argue that a game isn't free to play because you have to pay for an internet connection as well? That you have to pay for the console/pc? electricity? food and water to sustain yourself while playing it?

the commercial doesnt say "defiance, now with a free console, internet, tv, electricity, blah blah blah". the commercial says the game is free to play. thats it, and thats all im saying. the commercial says a game is free, that i have to pay if i want to play

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:27 AM
bias doesnt matter. give me 12 jurors made up of old wyoming ranchers who think video games are a waste of time, a good lawyer, and a lawsuit filed before the 12th of september when you say ps3 gets F2P (which is 3 days after destiny launches making it a futile attempt to get new players lol) and i have a pretty good case.
It's the 12th of August by the way....
Bias does matter.

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:28 AM
the commercial doesnt say "defiance, now with a free console, internet, tv, electricity, blah blah blah". the commercial says the game is free to play. thats it, and thats all im saying. the commercial says a game is free, that i have to pay if i want to play
Again the loophole being that it is free it's just free on PC until the 12th then it should be free for PC and PS3. The game is still free.

dynikus
08-09-2014, 02:28 AM
that i have to pay
But that's wrong. I'm playing the game, and I didn't pay a dime towards it. Unless they explicitly state that it's free on xbox and ps3, there's no false advertising.

Amack
08-09-2014, 02:29 AM
http://i61.tinypic.com/28ml8o6.jpg

Derek Sharper
08-09-2014, 02:30 AM
hmmmm, let me think about this question...

okay, hypothetical situation:

[I]my name is jim. i have a wife and 3 kids. i live in a small town call big piney, wyoming. its a tiny littel oilfield town in western wyoming, population around 1500. i have direct tv and watch defiance every thursday night. i love the show, and ive always wanted to try the game. i make decent money, but dont have a lot of extra cash laying around.

my birthday is coming up in a couple of days, and my wife asks what i want. well, i tell her that i would really like a playstation 3. she asks why, and i tell her that ive been watching this show, and now the game is free (according to the commercial i see every week). shes been saving a little, and agrees to get it for me.

[snip]

so, with that hypothetical situation, i can honestly support every single prerequisite of the legal definition of false advertising. with a good lawyer, i can get a judgement in my favor, and in this day and age, i dont need to worry about working anymore.


No you don't support ANY prerequisites. They never said anything about any platform.

Show anything stating Free-to-Play on PS3. Or for that matter Free-to-Play on ANYTHING. If you choose to make a purchase based on non-existing information, I hate to say it, but that's on you.

Answer these 2 simple question (No if, and, or but. Just yes or no.):

Is the game available on PC,Xbox or PS?
Is the game Free-to-Play?

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:33 AM
You'd only be able to catch them if they explicitly stated "free on all platforms" or something along those lines then turn out it wasn't. That isn't the case here. The case here is that the game is free to play, it IS but they just don't say which platform. As far as I know they don't really tell you what platforms they are even really ON unless you look it up.

in all fairness, and out of respect to you griffix, i will point out that the same commercial that says the game is free to play also says you can download the game for free at defiance.com, which in itself would lead one to believe that is is pc exclusive, since you cannot download the game on ps3 or xbox from defiance.com. but then again, if i watch the commercial, and own a console, and there is any kind of advertisement that says its available on 3 platforms, then the commercial again is lying to me because i cant download it from defiance,com if i am a console player

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:34 AM
No you don't support ANY prerequisites. They never said anything about any platform.

Show anything stating Free-to-Play on PS3. Or for that matter Free-to-Play on ANYTHING. If you choose to make a purchase based on non-existing information, I hate to say it, but that's on you.

Answer these 2 simple question (No if, and, or but. Just yes or no.):

Is the game available on PC,Xbox or PS?
Is the game Free-to-Play?

Is the game available on PC,Xbox or PS? yes
Is the game Free-to-Play? no

dynikus
08-09-2014, 02:35 AM
Wanna explain how so many people are playing the game for free if it's not free to play?

Derek Sharper
08-09-2014, 02:36 AM
Is the game available on PC,Xbox or PS? yes
Is the game Free-to-Play? no


Seriously? That's your answer?

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:38 AM
in all fairness, and out of respect to you griffix, i will point out that the same commercial that says the game is free to play also says you can download the game for free at defiance.com, which in itself would lead one to believe that is is pc exclusive, since you cannot download the game on ps3 or xbox from defiance.com. but then again, if i watch the commercial, and own a console, and there is any kind of advertisement that says its available on 3 platforms, then the commercial again is lying to me because i cant download it from defiance,com if i am a console player
Problem here is that you're going on an "if". As it is the commercial states it's free to play and you can download it therefore it is free to play on PC. It doesn't make mention of being on other consoles and also does not mention being free to play there either. They are technically telling the truth because the game is free on PC.

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:42 AM
Is the game available on PC,Xbox or PS? yes
Is the game Free-to-Play? noSeriously? That's your answer?
Derek technically has a point on that. The game is available on all three platforms and it is free to play. That's all that'll matter. Unless the second question is SPECIFICALLY worded to apply a certain platform the answer would be yes. Cause it is free.

Derek Sharper
08-09-2014, 02:42 AM
If I ever have to go to court, I hope they believe like you fighterpilot04.
(and please tell us you're not an actual pilot)

-------------------------

OMG!! I'm defending Trion! WTH!

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:42 AM
Seriously? That's your answer?

sure.

i own a ps3. the game is available one ps3. i saw a commercial that said the game was free to play, it also said i could download it from defiance.com. i tried the download, but it wasnt available for ps3. so i tried the playstation store, the game was $9.99. so i went to gamestop. a new copy was $7.99. a used copy was $2.99. ive looked everywhere, but i cannot find the game for free, as the commercial states

Griffix8
08-09-2014, 02:44 AM
sure.

i own a ps3. the game is available one ps3. i saw a commercial that said the game was free to play, it also said i could download it from defiance.com. i tried the download, but it wasnt available for ps3. so i tried the playstation store, the game was $9.99. so i went to gamestop. a new copy was $7.99. a used copy was $2.99. ive looked everywhere, but i cannot find the game for free, as the commercial states
Did the commercial state it was free for PlayStation 3?

dynikus
08-09-2014, 02:44 AM
ive looked everywhere

except for defiance.com, of course.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 02:55 AM
@griffix - no, the commercial said it was free to play. it said that a game, released by trion, called defiance, was free to play. thats all it said. it did not say available ONLY for pc, it did not say NOT available for ps3 and xbox. the commercial simply says free to play.

@dynikus - go to defiance.com. the opening page says the game is free to play. if you choose explore the game, there is an update dated august 8th that the game will go free to play on august 12th. the last time i saw the show was august 7th, and that is the last itme i saw the commercial live. the site also says that ther is no set date for xbox, which would still make the claim of free to play a lie on the commercial.

dynikus
08-09-2014, 03:03 AM
Actually, I go to defiance.com.
Then I click on the big bold button that says "play for free"
Then that takes me to another page which has a download link. If I click the download link, it downloads the game. For free. As advertised.

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 03:13 AM
Actually, I go to defiance.com.
Then I click on the big bold button that says "play for free"
Then that takes me to another page which has a download link. If I click the download link, it downloads the game. For free. As advertised.

okay, i will try that right now...

go to my browser, and go to defiance.com - check

go to defiance.com - check

click on download now - check

hmmm, theres a problem. it says i need to download glyph, and it keeps giving me a black screen that says connect media storage at the save destination everytime i click on download now. something doesnt seem right.

dynikus
08-09-2014, 03:16 AM
I think it's your brain that doesn't seem right... I suggest you consult a lawyer about this and see if they'll take the case. Or better yet, just take up the case yourself, given your obvious legal background.

Amack
08-09-2014, 03:19 AM
Since I read this entire thread...

http://i60.tinypic.com/2knf5i.jpg

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 03:20 AM
ive actually followed your instruction 3 times, with the exact same result. go to defiance.com, select play for free, and i get this message that says connect media storage at save destination every single time. not sure what im doing wrong

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 03:27 AM
I think it's your brain that doesn't seem right... I suggest you consult a lawyer about this and see if they'll take the case. Or better yet, just take up the case yourself, given your obvious legal background.

i think that, since your join date is today, and every post you have made on these forums is in this thread, im gonna treat you more or less like a diaper. your useful when your new, but pretty quickly you end up being full of **** and just need to be thrown in the trash. good luck on your next troll profile.

Chump Norris
08-09-2014, 03:40 AM
Yep I was told this thread was funny and it didnt disappoint.

What if said PS3 was purchased because the plaintiff saw the game was going to be F2P on July 15th?

They only let the plaintiff know of the delay a day before it was supposed to go F2P.

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?167502-Defiance-Free-to-Play-on-Xbox-360-and-PlayStation-3-Delayed

Please entertain me more :)

fighterpilot04
08-09-2014, 03:47 AM
Yep I was told this thread was funny and it didnt disappoint.

What if said PS3 was purchased because the plaintiff saw the game was going to be F2P on July 15th?

They only let the plaintiff know of the delay a day before it was supposed to go F2P.

http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?167502-Defiance-Free-to-Play-on-Xbox-360-and-PlayStation-3-Delayed

Please entertain me more :)

dude. your profile picture is off the hook. di you have down syndrome? im totally into charitable orginizations, so if there is one that helps people like you send me a link and i can probably donate part of my allowance or something to help you out. i got nothing but respect for a guy that aint afraid to post a pic of himsefl, no matter wat kind of affliction he might have. even something like you got

i like your cats by the way. they are cute

AngryCaveman
08-09-2014, 04:49 AM
http://i61.tinypic.com/28ml8o6.jpg

LMAO! Free to play vs like what ten bucks. I doubt it would even get to jurors.This would be a quick judgement by a judge and not how gamers would want with perhaps a little slap on Trions wrist at the max. If anything the advertisement should put in small print with asterist-PC only, or not available on all systems to cover themselves totally.Also, is anyone still playing anyways? Thanks for the laughs though.

Smeejo
08-09-2014, 05:04 AM
okay, i will try that right now...

go to my browser, and go to defiance.com - check

go to defiance.com - check

click on download now - check

hmmm, theres a problem. it says i need to download glyph, and it keeps giving me a black screen that says connect media storage at the save destination everytime i click on download now. something doesnt seem right.

Actually this message would mean something is wrong with your console not with the site or with defiance. Let alone with it's status as a f2p game. .Connect media storage at the save destination means you do not have a storage device in the location you have told it to download to. Your ps3 is the problem in that case not the game/website.

Also:


give me 12 jurors made up of old wyoming ranchers who think video games are a waste of time, a good lawyer, and a lawsuit filed before the 12th of september when you say ps3 gets F2P (which is 3 days after destiny launches making it a futile attempt to get new players lol) and i have a pretty good case.

This would NEVER happen as you are given a jury of your peers when on trial. So in this case suing trion would get trion a jury of 12 other game developers. Therefor chances are... you would lose on that account too.

Siinful
08-09-2014, 05:07 AM
To the OP: Can you not wait a few more days for it to go free for your platform? If you want to play for free NOW, then hop on a PC. Problem solved!

As for Glyph. You need that to log in to Defiance, Rift, Archage and Trove.