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Triggered
01-19-2017, 05:29 PM
The rough conscensus about these weapons is they provide nothing meaningful to events in game. Their visual effects cripple people's pcs and they are visually annoying. Now lets put that all aside and examine the reason why they are still used. Simple answer is the amount of score they generate at arkfalls for the effort invested is extremely overtuned. Go grab an epic bmg and go spam at a major if you dont believe me devs.

Please devs fix this. The level of effort is not commensurate to the score they provide. They need to be brought in line with everything else. Feel free to discuss but I'm sure there will be very little opposing discussion.

Bentu
01-19-2017, 05:46 PM
Yes please buff the bmg so that the dmg charge does as much as a BR.

Thank you.

Fallen_Aingeal
01-19-2017, 05:53 PM
Yes please buff the bmg so that the dmg charge does as much as a BR.

Thank you.

Agreed...

The heal numbers seem to be pretty on point though.

Personally, I'd like to see the range extended. As it is now, I can only cover about 1/2 of the ark circle. If the range was uber buffed, I could stand in the center and blanket the entire ark circle.

Great topic!

Hope y'all devs are paying attention to the consumer desires!

DEATHBRINGER210
01-19-2017, 05:58 PM
bmgs dont need a nerf, yes bmgs need a damage buff . and we need jp bmgs

No Identity
01-19-2017, 06:46 PM
In my opinion the OP is right. BMG should be nerfed or better completely removed from the game. It's annoying to see almost every new players plus hundreds of vets BMG spamming every single arkfall just to easy score without dealing any worth damage. All they do is to sit in the middle of the arkfall and hold the mouse button down and think they help alot. NOPE! BMG have got the lowest DPS ingame. All these players do is to annoy others with the BMG lightning effect. All this will end if you don't get that scores for using a BMG in spamming mode. JS

Chump Norris
01-19-2017, 06:58 PM
I agree with everyone that brought up buffing BMG, they need to be brought in line with everything else.

Johnny Stranger
01-19-2017, 07:27 PM
Buff the bmg !!! And a hell yea to a nano'd jp bmg !!!

richardkrainium
01-19-2017, 08:03 PM
while they are at it, they should buff bug guns too. stronger bug guns means less bugs and ALOT less system lag

richardkrainium
01-19-2017, 08:04 PM
yes, a syphon bmg so we can have a redundant gun

richardkrainium
01-19-2017, 08:08 PM
The rough conscensus about these weapons is they provide nothing meaningful to events in game. Their visual effects cripple people's pcs and they are visually annoying. Now lets put that all aside and examine the reason why they are still used. Simple answer is the amount of score they generate at arkfalls for the effort invested is extremely overtuned. Go grab an epic bmg and go spam at a major if you dont believe me devs.

Please devs fix this. The level of effort is not commensurate to the score they provide. They need to be brought in line with everything else. Feel free to discuss but I'm sure there will be very little opposing discussion.

if people werent taking so much damage, the scores wouldnt be as high when using a bmg. would love to see an event without bmgs...lol....all the belly crawlers and a failed arkfall, dont we already have that with monoliths

No Identity
01-19-2017, 08:29 PM
Main problem is that the DMG-board was removed and a score-board was introduced. I never understood why. The named reasons for this are bs in my opinion. Since this it's possible to get first place for almost nothing. You can get a higher score with a weapon 300-500 egos under your current ego level with useless nano than with a gun at your ego and reasonable nano.

No BMG was ever able to keep me alive. Also I'm permanently using lifesteal weapons so there's no need for healing me with an annoying BMG.

Besides, there is already an JP-BMG. It's nanoless, ok, but it's a Jackpot. You can get it at Soleptor for 1.5k rep. But it's still a BMG ^^

This game is a shooter. With a rpg part, right. But still a shooter. If you want to heal somebody or attack enemys without a gun go and play pure RPG where you can be a magician using mana.

MrHulot
01-19-2017, 08:31 PM
I still use a BMG sometimes because:

A) I find it useful on small, fast enemies like shrill or low-level scrappers, or on mobs of weak enemies, because it can take them out really fast (I am EGO 5600, so my BMG is moderately powerful).

B) At big events with lots of lag, I find that for a long time I cannot SEE the enemies, let alone shoot at them. The only way I can score any points at all is by healing friendlies, which (for some reason) works even when I cannot see them. I stop doing that and use a gun as soon as I can see the enemy, because for me a gun is a much faster way to score points.

BTW, I do NOT use a spanner protector, since I know that annoys people.

Calm like a Bomb
01-19-2017, 08:32 PM
Actually the jackpot BMG is the Halter from Soleptor.
So, yeah, it's about time for a BMG with a nano and good synergy.

Triggered
01-19-2017, 09:02 PM
if people werent taking so much damage, the scores wouldnt be as high when using a bmg. would love to see an event without bmgs...lol....all the belly crawlers and a failed arkfall, dont we already have that with monoliths

The fact of the matter is that healing provides no real benefit people still die without them. Ask yourself is there ever a time where you have been like damn that BMG saved my ***? I bet if the answer is yes the amount of times is countable on one hand. It is ineffective.

I want to clarify I have nothing against people using it to damage things with. Yes it does need a buff in this department but the score provided by healing is what is out of whack.

Riyo Chuchi
01-19-2017, 10:07 PM
Get rid of the score for healing players and buff the damage to encourage people to actually attack enemies so they will be productive at arkfalls. And make it so other players get no visual effect from it. Problem solved.

Bentu
01-19-2017, 11:59 PM
If the bmg did what it does but didn't put the bmg user any higher up the score board than a person using a gun there'd be no problem so at the end of the day this thread is all about you're higher than me on the score board no matter the score which is ridiculous.
The argument has been made that it's score that counts and not dmg so you're better off getting the devs to change the scoreboard back to dmg.

Next thing I won't be able to use a sludge rocket launcher because of the unfair scoring of the bio nano on it.

DEATHBRINGER210
01-20-2017, 12:52 AM
the bmg still doesnt beat the rewards from the 2 minute island of lost ark forge runs

Ackeron
01-20-2017, 12:58 AM
This topic is as old as the game itself almost.

Bentu
01-20-2017, 01:16 AM
This topic is as old as the game itself almost.

Except you used to be able to score higher and get better rewards until it was nerfed.

Moring
01-20-2017, 02:32 AM
The fact of the matter is that healing provides no real benefit people still die without them. Ask yourself is there ever a time where you have been like damn that BMG saved my ***? I bet if the answer is yes the amount of times is countable on one hand. It is ineffective.

every time you take damage on events but get heals from BMGs, think that otherwise you would crawl on your belly, loosing 1k score just for your defeat.
without heals during event arkfall it would look like DM arkfall with 2-4 monoliths up

Bentu
01-20-2017, 03:08 AM
every time you take damage on events but get heals from BMGs, think that otherwise you would crawl on your belly, loosing 1k score just for your defeat.
without heals during event arkfall it would look like DM arkfall with 2-4 monoliths up

When you think about it with so many healing bmgs there must be some kind of positive effect from them.

It's just that the people with the guns don't want to look at it that way.

Charapoo
01-20-2017, 04:40 AM
Yes please buff the bmg so that the dmg charge does as much as a BR.

Thank you.
+1../thread

You can tell bmg is the bastard child weapon of the game because they never offer it in any event as a drop. Im shocked they added the supreme one as an expo drop, but they are able to link right through the dark matter shields.

Also..BMG score really racks up from heals more than dmg..however, that can only happen when there are not 10 people BMG healing. You dont get score for healing people who are at 100%.

I have an infinite dmg charge 3-linking bmg and score wise it is probably behind just spamming an infector, so if anything they just need a dmg buff to be useful, not a score nerf.

Ronin9572
01-20-2017, 04:52 AM
while they are at it, they should buff bug guns too. stronger bug guns means less bugs and ALOT less system lag

I think this is a great idea!

Ronin9572
01-20-2017, 05:16 AM
I used to be like all the haters here, called them out in zone and here on the forums. Than I got to the point of weapon levelling and kept it quietly to myself. They weren't so bad and did great in some situations. Never been much of a healer, since the numbers they actually here are still kinda useless. This event I have been using a bmg alot. Can only see the red arrow of the enemy (if I'm lucky) and this will sometimes last for a few minutes so I heal to score. Than on top of that rendering and rubber banding has been absolutely atrocious and unless the enemies are running straight at you or away most of your shots are missing, so I'm using the dmg part of the bmg. So hate the ppl using bmg's all you want, but they might be doing it other than to annoy ppl. You want to hate the bmg and users, that's silly. Trion is the one to blame for this because of their inability to tone down the Vfx, and their useless servers that cannot keep up with all the players.

Johnny Stranger
01-20-2017, 05:28 AM
Let me clarify , i would love to see a jp bmg ( vot spanner or prefer stingray ) . The halter is a spanner trapper ... ugh .. I'd also be cool with the deletion of spanner protectors ...
Yes these threads have been going on for several years .
I am usure how the effects can bother you most times ( other than bubble) at a major when I only see bugs and sometimes enemies for almost the whole entire final . Everyone disappears along with the bmg effects, at least on PS3 .

konstantinov
01-20-2017, 05:28 AM
You can usually count on me to put up all zeroes on the scoreboard and typically I can keep pace just healing through the major.

#syphonbmg2017

Rambo Balboa
01-20-2017, 11:16 AM
The easy solution in my opinion is to put a healing score cap lets say 20k points after that you will stop getting points from healing and will be shooting like 90% of the ppl @ mjrs.

Bentu
01-20-2017, 06:24 PM
The easy solution in my opinion is to put a healing score cap lets say 20k points after that you will stop getting points from healing and will be shooting like 90% of the ppl @ mjrs.

You forgot to say and give everyone else who hasn't got one a high dmg br so they can get a high score to.

I'm sick and tired of the I'm better than you mentality because someone hit the rngesus jackpot and got awarded a decent drop and has to rub everyone else's nose in it.

Well there happens to be gear in game that gives the scrubs a chance to.

Deal with it!

Edit. The latter part wasn't aimed at you Rambo. :)

Chump Norris
01-20-2017, 06:53 PM
The easy solution in my opinion is to put a healing score cap lets say 20k points after that you will stop getting points from healing and will be shooting like 90% of the ppl @ mjrs.

They need to cap points gained from shooting also then so the people that prefer to shoot are forced to switch to healing to make up for the healers that are being forced to shoot.

Calm like a Bomb
01-20-2017, 07:00 PM
They need to cap points gained from shooting also then so the people that prefer to shoot are forced to switch to healing to make up for the healers that are being forced to shoot.

LMFAO! Love it.

Bentu
01-20-2017, 10:11 PM
One more thing on the subject too, if all the peeps stopped using bmgs and went over to conventional weapons they'd be dealing dmg and in turn taking a scoring opportunity away from you so you'd still be scoring low.

DEATHBRINGER210
01-21-2017, 12:27 AM
They need to cap points gained from shooting also then so the people that prefer to shoot are forced to switch to healing to make up for the healers that are being forced to shoot.

great idea . devs need to add this.

Triggered
01-21-2017, 02:33 AM
Look its all well and good for new ppl to get score, but they should have to invest in that if that is what they want to do not just get an epic bmg and spam heal. That is what needs toning down.

stoodakiss
01-21-2017, 02:42 AM
leave the bmgrs alone.

The Lady
01-21-2017, 09:08 AM
No more nerfs. Every time ya'll get them to nerf something, something else gets broken.

Lightning19
01-21-2017, 12:16 PM
Look its all well and good for new ppl to get score, but they should have to invest in that if that is what they want to do not just get an epic bmg and spam heal. That is what needs toning down.

How should new people "invest in that"? Are they supposed to break out their credit cards and dump obscene amounts of money into the game until they get a jp or two that helps them get that higher score? Are they then supposed to dump more $ into the game to acquire ark forge to level that weapon up along with their ego? Many people don't have the means to afford doing that, so they should suffer or just stop playing the game? Smh.

Or are you implying that they should grind, grind, grind for weeks on end in the hopes of winning the jp lottery? Guess what...some do (grind)...they hit every arkfall of a major, rack up 100 or more kills and still end up way down the scoring list. All while "veterans" camp out and wait for the final arkfall of a major, use one of their many supreme/jackpot weapons, and score in the top 10 with less than a quarter of the work the "grinder" has done.

As for the "veterans"... if they're going to use bmgs every arkfall to score high and be rewarded more arkforge/keys etc...why do they need jackpots or supreme weapons. I'll gladly take their jps and supremes if they're not going to use them!!!!!

Skiller115
01-21-2017, 12:58 PM
Simple solution is to bring back damage based scoring. Events wouldn't last so long because only like 10 people are doing any real damage and the noons will learn how to get good to deal the most damage and encourage them to rank up so they can deal maximum damage at 6k.

Or leave it in its silly state where the least amount of effort can still net you the same rewards as someone who's always doing all the work.

Skiller115
01-21-2017, 01:08 PM
But my real opinion on bmgs is that trion should either buff bmgs or just remove them from the game. As they are pointless and only good for "griefing" (farming score in the land of the easy) because the amount of healing they do is so low that any syphon gun can give more healing per second and the damage is so low that it only works at threat level 3 or lower! If trion buffed the healing by a multiple of 3 or 4 then the gun would have an application in the Meta game.

Valani
01-21-2017, 02:55 PM
If not a perk that can reverse healing effects as damage, then a toggle option to nullify healing altogether. Do something, because it's asinine to see someone 1st place with 0 kills. By not doing anything about it, it's like you're encouraging me to do the same.

Bentu
01-21-2017, 03:17 PM
So you guys who are doing all the real work can you tell me how many calories are you burning?

This is ridiculous complaining about who comes top of a scoreboard where dmg isn't even measured.

What with so much is broken and wrong with the game the whingers are going to have the devs invest time on changing how the game is scored, 9 times out of 10 the top guy is the one who was lucky enough to be where the major spawns and can solo the first two crystals on the way to the boss fight.

How do I know because I've done it.

Valani
01-21-2017, 04:03 PM
This is ridiculous complaining about who comes top of a scoreboard

Especially when it's the same type of weapon that's come up in so many topics via complaints.

Moring
01-21-2017, 05:07 PM
next people will ask to nerf FRC Sludge RL because players using it get higher score at sieges

Bentu
01-21-2017, 06:12 PM
Especially when it's the same type of weapon that's come up in so many topics via complaints.

Yeah I know what you mean as it's so powerful and outclasses everyone else in pvp.

Chump Norris
01-21-2017, 08:47 PM
So you guys who are doing all the real work can you tell me how many calories are you burning?

This is ridiculous complaining about who comes top of a scoreboard where dmg isn't even measured.

What with so much is broken and wrong with the game the whingers are going to have the devs invest time on changing how the game is scored, 9 times out of 10 the top guy is the one who was lucky enough to be where the major spawns and can solo the first two crystals on the way to the boss fight.

How do I know because I've done it.

All this ^^

Chump Norris
01-28-2017, 11:56 PM
Bentu, this is not the case for like two days I was doing this to save karma. I play multiple accounts and port to majors on my main from callouts in clan chat and then port my alts to my main to tag. I had not been scoring for two days straight.

Kind of crazy to complain about people that are actually participating being rewarded for their effort when you tag with alts..

Triggered
01-29-2017, 01:31 AM
Kind of crazy to complain about people that are actually participating being rewarded for their effort when you tag with alts..

I take it you dont play on PC? When I am not saving my karma doing nothing you'll find me at the top of the score solely doing damage. I don't use bmgs/sludge rls and that is after alt tabbing through 6 other characters, tagging, and porting them to safety. So in turn for my leeching, I actually do my part. Feel free to come to PC-NA and see for yourself. My IGN is Kreygasm.

Bentu
01-29-2017, 01:31 AM
Kind of crazy to complain about people that are actually participating being rewarded for their effort when you tag with alts..


Thus did cross my mind when I read the other post.

Triggered
01-29-2017, 01:43 AM
I take it you dont play on PC? When I am not saving my karma doing nothing you'll find me at the top of the score solely doing damage. I don't use bmgs/sludge rls and that is after alt tabbing through 6 other characters, tagging, and porting them to safety. So in turn for my leeching, I actually do my part. Feel free to come to PC-NA and see for yourself. My IGN is Kreygasm.

In addition to this, I want to add the day they stop the ability for alts to stop leeching for jps you will not see me complaining. I leech with alts because it is allowed and because rng in this game is horrible. Arkfalls would be much better with people not leeching on multiple accounts just like they would with bmg leechers (sludge rls not so much those are just people padding their points).

Bentu
01-29-2017, 06:16 AM
In addition to this, I want to add the day they stop the ability for alts to stop leeching for jps you will not see me complaining. I leech with alts because it is allowed and because rng in this game is horrible. Arkfalls would be much better with people not leeching on multiple accounts just like they would with bmg leechers (sludge rls not so much those are just people padding their points).

Three categories for using a bmg are

The guy levelling weapon skills.
The role play guy
The leacher as you put it.

Why should the other two suffer for the last and how come it's ok for you to alt leech jps and yet not ok for others to leech forge.

The bmg is in game and at best gives those with no skill or others like the majority of players on consoles a chance who can't see an enemy to kill at times so they get a healing score of those who can see them and are taking dmg.

I have to say it but trying to complain about one thing which in fact though can be annoying depending on the bmg used isn't causing lag but then you overpopulated a server with multiple alts does cause lag.

Who's to say that the server space you and others use to overpopulate couldn't be used by console players.

I don't know how server space is divided up but it seems logical to me.

mitch00uk
01-29-2017, 06:33 AM
Ronin9572

So hate the ppl using bmg's all you want, but they might be doing it other than to annoy ppl.


It's possible ^^^^^^^^^^

Triggered
01-29-2017, 07:05 AM
Three categories for using a bmg are

The guy levelling weapon skills.
The role play guy
The leacher as you put it.

Why should the other two suffer for the last and how come it's ok for you to alt leech jps and yet not ok for others to leech forge.

The bmg is in game and at best gives those with no skill or others like the majority of players on consoles a chance who can't see an enemy to kill at times so they get a healing score of those who can see them and are taking dmg.

I have to say it but trying to complain about one thing which in fact though can be annoying depending on the bmg used isn't causing lag but then you overpopulated a server with multiple alts does cause lag.

Who's to say that the server space you and others use to overpopulate couldn't be used by console players.

I don't know how server space is divided up but it seems logical to me.

Make a thread about it and I'd be happy to voice my opinions about having alts in support of your cause. The reason why you really do not see such a thread is because it injects jps into the pc economy where there are probably not as many players as ps3 or xbox thus giving a player who may not get his desired jp the chance to get it through trading. Also tons of players like me run more than one account. They may not do it to the extent I do, but they do it.

Lector Lacivious
01-29-2017, 07:50 AM
looks like the biggest complaints against the BMG are;

Graphics:
I can relate to this with running a high end machine and watching enemies start teleporting, rubberbanding and disappearing as soon as someone uses a BMG. The graphics issues are painful.

Event Scoring:
I have to agree that when I am running around working my a** off, trying to kill everything in an effort to get simply in the top 5 of the scoreboard, and hoping the karma is working and the the RNGeezus will be kind to me for a change.... to see the person in the top scoring spot above me has 2 kills and a slightly higher score....

now wait, I just worked my tail off, had my shield stripped off countless times had my health knocked down to one bar several times, probably went down a couple times, had to navigate all the way back to the battle field, thus losing precious scoring while limiting my chances of the RNGeezus acknowledging my efforts....

While some other player stood there healing everybody he could see ( because graphics issues are the only real difficulty of using a BMG, because the BMG while healing does nothing to attract the attention of enemies),
without having to actually work for their score, being ignored by the enemies, and just racking up the points...

Now for the record, I sincerely do appreciate a knowledgeable BMG user... who understands that people need to be healed after or even during a really heavy wave of enemies.... to those I say a truly heartfelt ... Thank You!

but these others who just run around spamming the BMG because that's the only way they can hit a barn, or they are too lazy to actually play the game... the BMG enables that behavior.

yeah I realize you cant have one without the other, but... the devs COULD change the graphics impact, and balance or buff the damage ( one of the main reasons I do not use a BMG ), and reduce the healing ability scoring points accumulation slightly .... and cause BMG users work for the score just like the rest of us.

Bentu
01-29-2017, 10:34 AM
Make a thread about it and I'd be happy to voice my opinions about having alts in support of your cause. The reason why you really do not see such a thread is because it injects jps into the pc economy where there are probably not as many players as ps3 or xbox thus giving a player who may not get his desired jp the chance to get it through trading. Also tons of players like me run more than one account. They may not do it to the extent I do, but they do it.


I couldn't make a thread on it as I have no idea of the amount of people doing it but all I can say and said the same re co op arkforge runs on pc is that trion monitor the drops across the board of jps etc dropped and people like yourself are artificially raising the number so in turn the console player loses out because we cannot run multiple toonz to that extent.

Same went for the af runs where pc people were doing solo runs with their alts.
That's okay you say but it takes away from af sales in the bits store which console players have to take up the slack on.

xXxDSMer
01-29-2017, 10:39 PM
Can't do damage if you can't see the mobs. So: bmg.

And all that really needs done with bmg is make the link real small and not visually obstructing. For protector: get rid of the golfball mby make that effect show up as ablative armor (except ablative from a spanner can't be broke as it can from PL8, or the stim, or ego perks).

Problem solved for everyone, without screwing people out of rewards (those that don't see mobs at all at arkfalls)

Calm like a Bomb
01-29-2017, 10:52 PM
Can't do damage if you can't see the mobs. So: bmg.

If you can't see the mobs you can do damage with explosive weapons. It can be hazardous though if there's objects thats not rendering that could be in front of you. Blew myself up a few times because of that. Bmg's definitely the safer alternative.

Moring
01-30-2017, 03:02 AM
If you can't see the mobs you can do damage with explosive weapons. It can be hazardous though if there's objects thats not rendering that could be in front of you. Blew myself up a few times because of that. Bmg's definitely the safer alternative.

it is fine when there are debris, at some point they render in and shooting while running backwards helps not to get hit by own explosives. more difficult is when someone spawns a car in your face

Light Energy
01-30-2017, 06:58 AM
I thought Iíd do some tests regarding this topic.


I tried sludge, bonfire and incinerator. Each time my score was even lower than normal and I found it quite boring! :( Iíve always thought the bonfire was pretty poor because it never seems to do much damage. At the NW majors, it might set mobs on fire for a bit, but made only a very little dent to their health.
The incinerator was ridiculous because it kept bouncing around and I had to practice getting the pellet to roll under the monarchs. :eek:
At one of the most recent majors, when I couldnít see any enemies at all (just lots of floating red chevrons), I thought Iíd give a BMG a go: I found that the score will rapidly increase for a bit with heal mode, but for most of the time I just wondered around with the score staying the same. With damage mode, when I could see the enemies, I could at least see the ticks and my score would continuously increase throughout the major. At the end I found my score was still pretty low and I think I was ranked 21 again! :rolleyes:

Your mileage may vary, but for me I think I will stick to my usual approach: rifles, guided rockets, mass cannon, smg, big boomer etc. I have noticed if I stick to a blast rifle or smg I will often briefly catch a glimpse of other players (so it doesnít feel so lonely! :)).
What is a big help with the score is to avoid extracting as much as I do, by grouping and reviving each other.

I have often found that if the enemies are phased out then I canít even do explosive damage. I tried firing my mass cannon all over the place when I was solo at a minor (claimjumpers) arkfall and my score stayed at zero. :confused:

So in summary, at least for me, I havenít found using the BMG helps my score at the Nuclear Winter event (so I don't know how the BMGers manage to get the top scores). The only benefit was that I didnít keep running out of ammo and get knocked down making a run for the ammo box! :o

Edit: Another thing which helps in getting the top score is doing the minors! LOL I think I revived the same guy 5 times at the minors (see below)

https://s24.postimg.org/66lubsiv5/nw_top_score.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/66lubsiv5/)

Or be one of the few people there! It's about the only way I can get a score close to the likes of ColapsN7:

https://s30.postimg.org/7pquaranx/nw_top_score_2nd.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/7pquaranx/)