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View Full Version : New Coding needed for Teamwork



Ryim
04-09-2017, 08:50 AM
For whatever reason it was coded that Arkfall Scoring caps at a certain point on damaging enemies, this needs to be changed.

Because the score caps at a certain point, players don't finish killing enemies, but simply move on to another and so forth, leaving enemies alive. It does not promote mass-fire on larger enemies, nor does it promote assembly line killing (where one would pick up after another moves on). The majority sprays-n-prays all over the place simply to raise their score. The current system actually works against teamwork.

If the cap was removed, players would have more of an incentive to kill the enemy they hit, and -then- move on to the next. Thus promoting teamwork at taking strategic enemies at different locations (ie snipers, feeders, etc). While others can still mass-fire on larger enemies to bring them down (ie bosses).

While a good number of players do go into arkfalls and fight with tactics, the incentives to do so are basically non-existent. Changing the score coding would go a long way to bringing the community together.

DSW
04-09-2017, 09:25 AM
thats a good point. but there's even worse thing, there's OVERALL score cap - anything you get past 200k is wasted, since you cant get more than 200001 xp, 23 keys and 30 AF.

so if you're on PP, you hit it after 10 mins of shooting in Event Horizon finale and then you have zero incentive of continuing to do so.

Light Energy
04-09-2017, 09:49 AM
I agree the scoring isn't ideal for promoting team work. But one could argue that if we all chip away at random targets (when there are a lot of players, the challenge can be to find a target before it gets destroyed) we are sort of helping each other in a haphazard sort of way :). For example, a Bulwark may be going after a friend, so I shoot at it to chase me instead... Sometimes getting enemies to get dizzy from chasing multiple players, helps everyone :). Another aspect is the whole mod hunting thing - if we want more loot we need to shoot (not kill) more enemies and certain enemies tend to drop mods more...


so if you're on PP, you hit it after 10 mins of shooting in Event Horizon finale and then you have zero incentive of continuing to do so.
Wow DSW, I knew you were good, but I didn't know you got 200k+ in 10 minutes :eek:. For me, if I can get to the minors before they vanish and if I can avoid dying, I'm lucky to get 100k+ :o. I don't think the 200k cap is a problem for many people (this is based on my screenshot records of nearly all the majors I have attended)!

Edit: Here is an example :)
https://s24.postimg.org/dm4j2y8gx/Defiance_EH_Score_Example.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/dm4j2y8gx/)
I don't recall seeing people in the scoreboard top position with scores above 200k very often. I can only recall that in the sieges/incursions we did over the Clan Anniversary weekend (some were stage 26 I think).

Tasin
04-09-2017, 09:53 AM
thats a good point. but there's even worse thing, there's OVERALL score cap - anything you get past 200k is wasted, since you cant get more than 200001 xp, 23 keys and 30 AF.

so if you're on PP, you hit it after 10 mins of shooting in Event Horizon finale and then you have zero incentive of continuing to do so.

Just got 327k at EH with only using a BR.

Darknessss
04-09-2017, 10:27 AM
thats a good point. but there's even worse thing, there's OVERALL score cap - anything you get past 200k is wasted, since you cant get more than 200001 xp, 23 keys and 30 AF.

so if you're on PP, you hit it after 10 mins of shooting in Event Horizon finale and then you have zero incentive of continuing to do so.

Ya I hit the OVERALL score cap alot at sieges and missions like the alamo, but I can only remember twice hitting it at an event major. Event majors pay poorly when it comes to keys and arkforge and I think its because of the enemy score cap Ryim mentioned. When the score tally doesnt wink out I can see that the scoring just stops at some point.

It would be nice to have a list of what contributes to the score per enemy. Teamwork is usually +5, Teamwork max is always +0, opportunist varies and seems to be what gives the most per enemy but that max's out also showing +0; assist adds a little, theres some with nano-kill, killshot or power kill. Ive also seen some odd ones like back breaker and monarch killer but what else is there to get score from?

Darknessss
04-09-2017, 10:37 AM
Just got 327k at EH with only using a BR.

Yep I did see that and congratz but, the rewards screen didnt give you that much. I can get over a million at the alamo but it still maxes out at 2000001 xp 23 keys and 30 af on the rewards screen. And of course you got that score by moving around and hitting everything as Ryim said theres no incentive to stay on a target until its dead. And that could be why it took over 20mins to finish, not enuf people working as a team to kill enemies (not that I could see if anyone was working together once the players phased out).

Tasin
04-09-2017, 11:01 AM
Yep I did see that and congratz but, the rewards screen didnt give you that much. I can get over a million at the alamo but it still maxes out at 2000001 xp 23 keys and 30 af on the rewards screen. And of course you got that score by moving around and hitting everything as Ryim said theres no incentive to stay on a target until its dead. And that could be why it took over 20mins to finish, not enuf people working as a team to kill enemies (not that I could see if anyone was working together once the players phased out).

I've been asking them to remove the score cap for a while. I can easily get 300k in a 15 min siege. Really pointless to put in the effort when the rewards don't increase.

Ryim
04-09-2017, 11:31 AM
The problem with "chipping away" at the enemies, Light, is that (especially with EH), the mobs can regen/reset. Making for a long, boring arkfall.

And not many can pass 200k score on PC NA. Seems PC EU a bit different then. Even with score hogs, I rarely see scores over 150k, and I think the times I've seen anyone over 200k has been twice.

And yes, there's a lot wrong (or at least not ideally adjusted) to the scoring system. Which is the point I'd like to get across to the Devs. We need a revamp badly and it needs to be thought out.

@Darknesss: I always thought that a "Max +0" score meant you had obtained the max points in that field. I may well be mistaken, and yes, it would be nice if we could get a list of how it's actually scored.

Of course, I asked in a ticket once for a "manual" on the game. CS told me that there "...was plenty of information on the internet to explain the game...". Which I took as "...we're far to lazy to actually write down this stuff and tell it to you...", so I won't hold my breath for an explanation of the scoring system.

Tasin
04-09-2017, 11:42 AM
The problem with "chipping away" at the enemies, Light, is that (especially with EH), the mobs can regen/reset. Making for a long, boring arkfall.

And not many can pass 200k score on PC NA. Seems PC EU a bit different then. Even with score hogs, I rarely see scores over 150k, and I think the times I've seen anyone over 200k has been twice.

And yes, there's a lot wrong (or at least not ideally adjusted) to the scoring system. Which is the point I'd like to get across to the Devs. We need a revamp badly and it needs to be thought out.

@Darknesss: I always thought that a "Max +0" score meant you had obtained the max points in that field. I may well be mistaken, and yes, it would be nice if we could get a list of how it's actually scored.

Of course, I asked in a ticket once for a "manual" on the game. CS told me that there "...was plenty of information on the internet to explain the game...". Which I took as "...we're far to lazy to actually write down this stuff and tell it to you...", so I won't hold my breath for an explanation of the scoring system.


The scoreboard only shows the score without boosts. Today i scored 240k at an arkfall yet the scoreboard said 180k.

Light Energy
04-09-2017, 12:02 PM
The problem with "chipping away" at the enemies, Light, is that (especially with EH), the mobs can regen/reset. Making for a long, boring arkfall.
Ah yes...that is something I have only really noticed with EH. I have never seen so many Bulwarks run away to recharge their shields and health! :eek: The run towards me, I retreat a bit and as soon as I gain the upper hand they run back to the centre. Very annoying and tiresome after a while.


Of course, I asked in a ticket once for a "manual" on the game. CS told me that there "...was plenty of information on the internet to explain the game...". Which I took as "...we're far to lazy to actually write down this stuff and tell it to you...", so I won't hold my breath for an explanation of the scoring system.

Does anyone read manuals any more? :) The most I've read for games is usually a little DVD insert booklet, PDF or some online guide by some helpful players. The forum and defiancedata.com have helped a lot...as have other players, friends and clan mates. Also, just fumbing around, trying different nanos, weapons, tactics etc has taught me a bit...

@Tasin: Oh, you including the score boost for Patron Pass...that explains it :).

Bentu
04-09-2017, 12:15 PM
Why have new coding if they're just going to cap the rewards.

There's no point in scoring a million say if they're only going to reward you for the first 200k.

May as well leave it be and pester the devs for something that needs fixing.

Light Energy
04-09-2017, 12:49 PM
...May as well leave it be and pester the devs for something that needs fixing.

I would be nice to see more "Bug Bash" threads like these:
Defiance-Bug-Bash-Alcatraz-Update (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?211231-Defiance-Bug-Bash-Alcatraz-Update)
Defiance-Bug-Bash (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?222712-Defiance-Bug-Bash)

However, I dont see that happening any time soon.

As for have new (proper) content, which players have asked for, I think the small dev team as working to some gruelling schedule of back to back events (little time for the back log of bug fixes etc). To get really fresh stuff would probably require 6+ months of the devs focusing on that and no events during that period. If they took this approach, maybe they could also look at the inventory management issue (as Destro said it was on their todo list). This all reminds me of reading PC magazines about games stuck in development hell for years and years...

Kristine DeBell
04-09-2017, 04:49 PM
This seems to be just a rehash of the same old issue of Risk v Rewards. What's the point of working so hard, get top score and still get blue drops.

Btw I tend to stick with one mob till it's dead for the opposite reason of score farming, i.e. why bother coming in top if all you're going to get is blue drops :P

MasterProtector
04-10-2017, 05:31 AM
ah i remember one event where i got to do a kenns farm incursion solo and had over 400k score by the end!

KevinVonBach
04-10-2017, 06:54 AM
What's the point of working so hard, get top score and still get blue drops.

Pro tip: There is no point. Work hard, get top score, get blue drops. Rinse, lather, repeat.

Kristine DeBell
04-10-2017, 07:42 AM
Pro tip: There is no point. Work hard, get top score, get blue drops. Rinse, lather, repeat.

I know right ? :D hence why i just toddle along during the arkfalls, pick a target and when it's dead move on to the next. Absolutely no point to score farming other than arkforge and there's easier ways to earn that.

Light Energy
04-10-2017, 08:56 AM
This seems to be just a rehash of the same old issue of Risk v Rewards. What's the point of working so hard, get top score and still get blue drops.
Well it's a bit of extra salvage to buy keycodes, to buy elite lockboxes, to get salvage...ad infinitum :).

I do the work to get all the lovely white mods (seems that is what my RNG is giving me right now for majors):

https://s15.postimg.org/p5dfa9ayf/Defiance_Gotta_Love_The_White_Mods.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/p5dfa9ayf/)

My experience:

Colony Courtship = (Mostly) Blue mods
Armistice = (Mostly) Green mods
Event Horizon = (Mostly) White mods

I have no idea how people can fully T5 any Event Horizon weapons :eek:...the mind boggles :confused:.

r1p
04-10-2017, 10:07 AM
I would be nice to see more "Bug Bash" threads like these:
Defiance-Bug-Bash-Alcatraz-Update (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?211231-Defiance-Bug-Bash-Alcatraz-Update)
Defiance-Bug-Bash (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?222712-Defiance-Bug-Bash)

However, I dont see that happening any time soon.

As for have new (proper) content, which players have asked for, I think the small dev team as working to some gruelling schedule of back to back events (little time for the back log of bug fixes etc). To get really fresh stuff would probably require 6+ months of the devs focusing on that and no events during that period. If they took this approach, maybe they could also look at the inventory management issue (as Destro said it was on their todo list). This all reminds me of reading PC magazines about games stuck in development hell for years and years...

The 2nd thread that you listed was supposed to be a huge bug fix release and instead became a combination PvP update/bit store bundle release called "Winter Bash" where only a few bugs were fixed. Out of the 19+ pages of bugs that were reported in the "Bug Bash" thread only 5-6 bugs were actually addressed and 3 of those didn't actually fix anything. So I do not want to see anymore threads like it because it is just another reminder of the where the road leads when it is paved with good intentions.

mitch00uk
04-10-2017, 10:10 AM
* edit - I think wrote this one wrong thread* I think there is another sort of cap.

Has anyone noticed sometimes after pounding a enemy ( When with a lot of strength) you stop scoring from it. So I start shooting at another enemy the score starts rolling again. I thought this was lag but its not

I always try to have score on screen and moniter it often. And it happens far to often

Light Energy
04-10-2017, 10:30 AM
Has anyone noticed sometimes after pounding a enemy ( When with a lot of strength) you stop scoring from it. So I start shooting at another enemy the score starts rolling again. I thought this was lag but its not

I only noticed this with the Matron at Colony Coutship majors... like some limit was imposed on the amount of damage possible during each appearance.

Ryim
04-11-2017, 07:38 PM
* edit - I think wrote this one wrong thread* I think there is another sort of cap.

Has anyone noticed sometimes after pounding a enemy ( When with a lot of strength) you stop scoring from it. So I start shooting at another enemy the score starts rolling again. I thought this was lag but its not

I always try to have score on screen and moniter it often. And it happens far to often

This is the cap that I was speaking of that started this thread, lol.

Happens on any high hp mob. Forges, for example, in EH.

Light Energy
04-13-2017, 07:09 AM
This is the cap that I was speaking of that started this thread, lol.

Happens on any high hp mob. Forges, for example, in EH.
LOL - I guess this is one of those times when one reads too many forum threads and one forgets how a thread actually started :o:o:o.