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gOn
04-22-2013, 01:08 AM
Was just wondering if anyone knows how long it took them to create the 5 days worth of content?

I mean...I heard somewhere they were developing this game for 4 years?

Please don't tell me that in those 4 years...they only created 5 days worth of content?

By content I mean quests(missions)..not constant grinding of the same CO OP map and ark fall.

darknessjw
04-22-2013, 01:11 AM
I believe it is a lie. Game like this is more like a year or two max with skeleton crew. There is no way they made this for last 4-5 years

Fiox
04-22-2013, 01:13 AM
Or you know the content is gated due to the show and your impatient XD

Shootersa
04-22-2013, 01:36 AM
there is more content, the DLC's, that is where the other years of content is.

silvertemplar
04-22-2013, 01:41 AM
there is more content, the DLC's, that is where the other years of content is.

Yet, Trion does not mention anything about what sort of content to expect? Everyone is just assuming they are mysteriously going to unleash entire new continents on us, chances are they are going to RE-USE the same zones with different quests. How would you feel about the content then?

I also can't imagine they would have the bulk of the content in the DLCs, or at the very least i don't expect the DLCs to be larger than the main game. If this was true they would have hinted at it already, there's not a single peep as to what the DLCs really entail. So i would expect more something like a DLC similar to what you get for Mass Effect or Dishonored , i am NOT expecting "StarCraft 2: Heart of the Swarm" or "WoW: Mists of Panderia" here. In other words, DLCs are generally not Expansion packs.

There's a reason why Expansions costs $40+ , and DLCs costs $10.....

Shootersa
04-22-2013, 01:44 AM
Yet, Trion does not mention anything about what sort of content to expect? Everyone is just assuming they are mysteriously going to unleash entire new continents on us, chances are they are going to RE-USE the same zones with different quests. How would you feel about the content then?

I also can't imagine they would have the bulk of the content in the DLCs. It would be very surprising if every DLC is remotely a Mt. Tam type of map that is entirely "new" . If so, chances are they are still busy creating it!

perhaps but if you look at the maps then all the gray areas are still yet to be unlocked along with missions, side missions, mini games and so forth, alsot there are ppl saying that we are getting new mobs etc etc.

ill just wait until they bring out the first DLC i think that then we can have a good indicator about what they are going to release further.

Khal
04-22-2013, 01:44 AM
I don't care how long it took to make the game, i am having tons of fun. That's what i care about.

Archeus9
04-22-2013, 01:49 AM
I just hope the content on each "episodes" supposed effect on the world as promised content doesn't just consist of activating certain objects, picking up data tapes, and killing x of y all the time because if it does then this is a gigantic disappointment.

Oh wait....

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 01:56 AM
Was just wondering if anyone knows how long it took them to create the 5 days worth of content?I'm playing from 2nd April and still am around Marin/Sausaito for the main storyline, lot of pursuits and side mission to do, and so on.
Always the same with every new MMO. You rush the content, you finish it fast, you whine. So tell me, I buyed and played Tomb Raider, finished the game in 12 hours, so what should I do? Go whine because the game is too short?

Anim
04-22-2013, 01:58 AM
Or you know the content is gated due to the show and your impatient XD

The problem is that people can realistically see a massive let-down on the horizon. The amount of content released on the launch of the game was terrible, for a game developed for 5 years and a budget of $80m. WoW was created in less time with $20m less budget and had literally worlds more content, hundreds of hours and a depth of game that makes Defiance look like a puddle.


there is more content, the DLC's, that is where the other years of content is.

It doesnt excuse Trion for releasing such a tiny game with the time and budget they were given. It's missing nearly every aspect of 'mmo' that people look forward to. Wheres the chat, the social, the trading, the need for grouping. All they did was create some fun mechanics of the game and stuck in a couple of pvp maps to keep people occupied, along with some pursuits where they obviously thought to themselves that 500 kills for a pursuit isnt enough so give it 5000 and make people grind for a while, suddenly fanatics are claiming this as genuine content to the game instead of realising what a joke that is.

Booshy
04-22-2013, 02:05 AM
The game is definitely short on content, but I still have fun with it. I"m sure I'll get bored frequently but at least each week there should be something new, even if it's only a small amount of stuff to do each week.

Grant Hammond
04-22-2013, 02:11 AM
Yet, Trion does not mention anything about what sort of content to expect? Everyone is just assuming they are mysteriously going to unleash entire new continents on us, chances are they are going to RE-USE the same zones with different quests. How would you feel about the content then?

I also can't imagine they would have the bulk of the content in the DLCs, or at the very least i don't expect the DLCs to be larger than the main game. If this was true they would have hinted at it already, there's not a single peep as to what the DLCs really entail. So i would expect more something like a DLC similar to what you get for Mass Effect or Dishonored , i am NOT expecting "StarCraft 2: Heart of the Swarm" or "WoW: Mists of Panderia" here. In other words, DLCs are generally not Expansion packs.

There's a reason why Expansions costs $40+ , and DLCs costs $10.....

Well yeah unless you can afford to put out ads and hype about it then no they will probably wait till its with in a month or a few weeks to announce the DLC. My bad ment to quick reply not copy post.

Anim
04-22-2013, 02:38 AM
Well yeah unless you can afford to put out ads and hype about it then no they will probably wait till its with in a month or a few weeks to announce the DLC. My bad ment to quick reply not copy post.

They had a budget of $80m, I think they can afford even a bit of online advertising.

Fiox
04-22-2013, 03:09 AM
They've been doing nothing but online advertising well before the 2nd if you never saw the defiance ads all over your blind lol

Harsk
04-22-2013, 03:20 AM
speculation! it's the new fact!

Oceanhawk
04-22-2013, 04:15 AM
I'm playing from 2nd April and still am around Marin/Sausaito for the main storyline, lot of pursuits and side mission to do, and so on.
Always the same with every new MMO. You rush the content, you finish it fast, you whine. So tell me, I buyed and played Tomb Raider, finished the game in 12 hours, so what should I do? Go whine because the game is too short?

LOL I think you are on the opposite end of the spectrum from a real gamer. Just because you play one quest per day doesn't mean you are the normal one. This game is short for an MMO, actually it is extremely short for an MMO.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 05:52 AM
This game is short for an MMO, actually it is extremely short for an MMO.It's always the same, every new released MMO with PvE have the same whines after 2-3 days of release "hey I hit cap in 4 hours, game is too short, devs, give us more content". Defiance is not different, people whines it's too short after few days of release. The same people will have to complain the same on the next MMO they will play. Those whines does not mean anything. And BTW, they already bought the game, so gave money to Trion, some of them already paid season pass too. In a B2P you don't have to spend all your time in game, you can stop playing and come back (if you want) whenever you want.

MrE78
04-22-2013, 06:03 AM
Okay so since this is a misinformation thread lets settle things up.

The game has been in development for 5 years. Now what that means is some guy somewhere along the chain came up with the idea to make the game then had to "sell" his idea to the upper management then had a idea a TV show also. Next would come getting a producers on board and finding a studio willing to take a risk. Since this is going to cost a lot they need sponsors out the door so yet it is held up more while someone is doing sales pitches of the idea.

The comes the actual production of the game and I would tend to bet that was maybe two years odds are closer to eighteen months though.

Now how do I know all this? I have personal friends that are in the industry at most of the big name companies now. Aside from one friend that left the sinking ship of THQ and well he left industry altogether. I know it is hard to wrap your minds around a massive project as I am sure most of you guys have never seen even a middle management position at a tech company.

TL;DR 5 years = someone thought up the idea and pushed for it to be developed so it goes off the first day it was pitched and got the green light.

Figma
04-22-2013, 06:06 AM
perhaps but if you look at the maps then all the gray areas are still yet to be unlocked along with missions, side missions, mini games and so forth, alsot there are ppl saying that we are getting new mobs etc etc.

ill just wait until they bring out the first DLC i think that then we can have a good indicator about what they are going to release further.
No they are not, i have been at the half of the grey areas and they have nothing to do with dlc. just borders of game world and this map is not going to expand from this point.
and even if people rumor that there will be new mobs thats nothing more than rumor, it has no solid proof.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 06:11 AM
http://defiance.junkiesnation.com/2013/04/18/highlights-from-the-raptr-defiance-qa/



What kind of content is planned during the show’s off seasons?

Answer: New species, game modes, maps, instances, vehicles, weapon types, new features and functionality, abilities, customization, power to the players, affecting and owning the world. And twerking.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:11 AM
-------8<-------

People are comparing it to other game development cycles though, they all go through the same thing but Defiance came up short for a final product. Doesnt matter which way you spin it, this isnt a 5 year start to finish game.

Munx
04-22-2013, 06:12 AM
The game is definitely short on content, but I still have fun with it. I"m sure I'll get bored frequently but at least each week there should be something new, even if it's only a small amount of stuff to do each week.

It is actually not short on content at all, it just offers very diffrent content then most people are used to, as such they burn trough the familiar content and then totally neglect the rest.

Even reviewers who scored the game 5-6 noted that the game had a good amount of content.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:14 AM
http://defiance.junkiesnation.com/2013/04/18/highlights-from-the-raptr-defiance-qa/

buzzwords


You really cant get enough of Trions PR can you? Also take note they said this of off seasons, which means thats after the show finishes airing which is months down the line. Nobody is going to care by then, there's no hook to this game, nothing to keep people playing other than the occasional log in after the TV show to get dissapointed again by a few new pursuits.

It's kinda sad that you're so engrossed in the fact that everything Trion says is golden and nothing can go or has gone wrong.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:16 AM
It is actually not short on content at all, it just offers very diffrent content then most people are used to, as such they burn trough the familiar content and then totally neglect the rest.

Even reviewers who scored the game 5-6 noted that the game had a good amount of content.

Pursuits arent different, they're achievements which have been in games for years. PvP isnt different, well unless it's different because it's badly implemented. The Co-op instances arent different, theyre just awful. The arkfalls are nothing new, they're bad versions of Rifts.

Please enlighten me, what's so shiny and new here that deserves such acclaim?

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 06:17 AM
Nobody is going to care by thenFalse, the players will be happy with the new content. Other people will already be whining on the lack of content on insert-new-future-released-MMO-here

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:19 AM
False, the players will be happy with the new content. Other people will already be whining on the lack of content on insert-new-future-released-MMO-here

I'm sure all 5 of them will love it.

ps. I love the way you ignore anything of relevance in a post because it might hurt your arguement that the game is going to be perfect.

Sdric
04-22-2013, 06:20 AM
The game was sold for 22€ at some internet shop.

And there are DLCs coming soon.

Think about it.

Orbital
04-22-2013, 06:24 AM
It doesnt excuse Trion for releasing such a tiny game with the time and budget they were given. It's missing nearly every aspect of 'mmo' that people look forward to. Wheres the chat, the social, the trading, the need for grouping. All they did was create some fun mechanics of the game and stuck in a couple of pvp maps to keep people occupied, along with some pursuits where they obviously thought to themselves that 500 kills for a pursuit isnt enough so give it 5000 and make people grind for a while, suddenly fanatics are claiming this as genuine content to the game instead of realising what a joke that is.

Do you need a tissue? So play your once through, get your $60 worth and quit for 6 months and come back when a few DLC's have come out if you're than bored. I like the system they have, you can group without really "grouping" for world objectives, so there is no real LFG and you can also do it solo fairly well most of the time. If you want to do actual group content you just queue up or get a group of clan mates to form a group before hand.

You just expect too much or are just trolling the forums. There is plenty to do until the show progresses more and more content opens up. Have you bothered to scroll around the world map, there are a lot of areas yet to open up. The game has not been out for long, lighten up and have some patience. I have run into plenty of frustrations along my game time with bugs and what not but I have been gaming for many years and know what I am getting into when I purchase a newly released MMO.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:25 AM
Think about it.

I did http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?43921-Concerns-amp-Constructive-thoughts-The-big-BIG-post.

Lets see what you have to say.

MrE78
04-22-2013, 06:26 AM
The game was sold for 22€ at some internet shop.

And there are DLCs coming soon.

Think about it.

Sorry what company? All I can think of is your are full of **it till you can provide proof.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:27 AM
You just expect too much or are just trolling the forums. There is plenty to do until the show progresses more and more content opens up. Have you bothered to scroll around the world map, there are a lot of areas yet to open up.


I see this same failure of an arguement time and time again from the fanatical defenders of the game. These areas, if they ever appear will just be more of the same old nothing, a few main missions, some repetitive side missions and a couple of challenges that are impossible to get less than gold on. See my main thread as to why this game is lacking real substance.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 06:28 AM
ps. I love the way you ignore anything of relevance in a post because it might hurt your arguement that the game is going to be perfect.
Perfect? No.
Fun, enjoyable? Yes
People play games with the same content for years and some (few) people are here whining there is few content after, what, 2 weeks of game release.
Do you know this is a MMO shooter and NOT a MMORPG, you do?

Munx
04-22-2013, 06:28 AM
Pursuits arent different, they're achievements which have been in games for years. PvP isnt different, well unless it's different because it's badly implemented. The Co-op instances arent different, theyre just awful. The arkfalls are nothing new, they're bad versions of Rifts.

Please enlighten me, what's so shiny and new here that deserves such acclaim?

Exactly when did I say it was "new" ? and having "achivements" as a major driving force by awarding "lvls" and various other awards is actually diffrent from just having achivements for the sake of having achivements.

Also I wonder where I said the content was unique, as you strongly seem to suggest I did, Defiance is diffrent in that it offers you a sandbox like enviroment where those who are willing can have a blast without being constantly directed by a story, pursuits are obviously a big part of that to.

If that kinda content is not for you then that honestly is your own problem, no developer can truely cater to everyones playstyle.

And once again you try to twist my words, I also never said it deserved acclaim.

Then again trying to reason with the likes of you is foolish on my part, you have been barking like a rabid dog for over a week now on these forums.

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:32 AM
Exactly when did I say it was "new" ? and having "achivements" as a major driving force by awarding "lvls" and various other awards is actually diffrent from just having achivements for the sake of having achivements.

Also I wonder where I said the content was unique, as you strongly seem to suggest I did, Defiance is diffrent in that it offers you a sandbox like enviroment where those who are willing can have a blast without being constantly directed by a story, pursuits are obviously a big part of that to.

If that kinda content is not for you then that honestly is your own problem, no developer can truely cater to everyones playstyle.

And once again you try to twist my words, I also never said it deserved acclaim.

Then again trying to reason with the likes of you is foolish on my part, you have been barking like a rabid dog for over a week now on these forums.

Still waiting for you to point out the content, because right now all you've said is that you can run around and repeat the same thing over and over but without anyone telling you to. It's about as much fun as watching paint dry in three different rooms, because the paint is different colours!

I almost overlooked this, having achievements as a 'major driving force' is downright lazy game design, no other company in the world has done it because its ****ing ******ed.

Orbital
04-22-2013, 06:32 AM
I see this same failure of an arguement time and time again from the fanatical defenders of the game. These areas, if they ever appear will just be more of the same old nothing, a few main missions, some repetitive side missions and a couple of challenges that are impossible to get less than gold on. See my main thread as to why this game is lacking real substance.

Well if the game isn't for you, no one is forcing you to play. There are many games out there to choose from, many have been going for years and years. Not every game is going to be for every gamer. Perhaps wait a few weeks for more game reviews to come out before you purchase next time to get a better idea of what your getting into first.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 06:41 AM
because right now all you've said is that you can run around and repeat the same thing over and over but without anyone telling you toHey, just like every insert-instance-farm-for-gear-MMO only in that you are FORCED to farm or you can't complete some content...

Anim
04-22-2013, 06:50 AM
Hey, just like every insert-instance-farm-for-gear-MMO only in that you are FORCED to farm or you can't complete some content...

At least they have content that is a challenge to complete.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 06:57 AM
At least they have content that is a challenge to complete.So why are you posting here instead of playing them? You have clearly bought the wrong game for you.
As soon as some (few) whiners will be gone, these forums will be back a nice place to read and post

Anim
04-22-2013, 07:08 AM
So why are you posting here instead of playing them? You have clearly bought the wrong game for you.
As soon as some (few) whiners will be gone, these forums will be back a nice place to read and post

Because MMO has the inherent basis of team play, doesnt matter if its RPG or shooter (ive played plenty of both before) it should still require teamwork. Defiance has none, if it had some changes this game would be great and I'm here because I'm hoping devs listen to some of the posts on the forums and take note.

If I could force you to read this thread (http://forums.defiance.com/showthread.php?43921-Concerns-amp-Constructive-thoughts-The-big-BIG-post.) I would, but people like you dont take anyone elses valid concerns to mind, you just brazenly ignore everything and crusade for the perfect game.

Cosmic Badger
04-22-2013, 07:17 AM
Because MMO has the inherent basis of team play, doesnt matter if its RPG or shooter (ive played plenty of both before) it should still require teamwork. Defiance has none,


This, so much, this.

r3dl4nce
04-22-2013, 07:19 AM
it should still require teamworkLike a lot of other MMO out there, Defiance has content that can be beaten in solo play and content that can be beaten playing in party or, if you are very good, alone (In DDO, for example, people were able to complete 12man RAIDs all alone, in GW2 someone completed alone dungeons made for party play, and so on).

Saraya
04-22-2013, 07:20 AM
Was just wondering if anyone knows how long it took them to create the 5 days worth of content?

I mean...I heard somewhere they were developing this game for 4 years?

Please don't tell me that in those 4 years...they only created 5 days worth of content?

By content I mean quests(missions)..not constant grinding of the same CO OP map and ark fall.

If it's any consolation, at least for it to make sense, it all revolves around the show.
Game = marketing for television show.

Crunchyblack
04-22-2013, 07:23 AM
I really don't get this, and I see this type of thread a lot in other games.

First off, the content cries always use a monthly sub game as comparison. However, these kids cant get daddy's credit card and therefore cant play monthly sub games (or are unemployed adults and cant afford to do anything but waste their time in front of a game rather than getting work)

So they complain about any game that has a monthly sub. So they start to make games with no monthly sub to appeal to the bottom feeders..ok im fine with that.

Those same people who trash any monthly sub game are now upset that their buy to play games don't have a years worth of content out the gate like a monthly sub game. Why would this matter? Well in a monthly sub game they need to keep you playing enough every month to warrant that 50 cents a day charge that's too expensive for you. With a buy to play game they give you some content, then DLC you more of it down the road.

Guild Wars 2 had this issue. The same people who hailed the game as a box purchase only then trashed the game for having way less content than a monthly sub game.

I know its rough not getting everything you want when your a child or unemployed adult...but you guys make the big stink about having to pay 50 cents a day for a sub based game with all the content up front...and beg for a game with no sub, then cant seem to grasp what that means to how content is distributed.

This game has no sub...are you out of content? Come back when theres more content...you already own the game and content will come for free you just have to wait on it. That is the trade off.


*

oh and it took them 5 years to develop the game three times across three different platforms. Let me know how long it takes you to make a game like that, and then we can count the content and see if you beat trion.

Cosmic Badger
04-22-2013, 07:23 AM
If it's any consolation, at least for it to make sense, it all revolves around the show.
Game = marketing for television show.

I think the shows schedule is really hurting them at the moment, there is so much pressure for them to get the current content bug free and making sure the content tied to the Tv episodes comes out on time.

Anim
04-22-2013, 07:37 AM
--- Prejudice uneducated rambling----

You should really try to fit more narrow minded stereotypes in there, they really help your arguement. Meanwhile I'll be over here with my full time job, house, car, etc making reasoned discussion with people who arent you.

Ps, its the same game across all the platforms, only the input is slightly varied but easily replicated across them.

EdgeTW
04-22-2013, 07:54 AM
Was just wondering if anyone knows how long it took them to create the 5 days worth of content?

I mean...I heard somewhere they were developing this game for 4 years?

Please don't tell me that in those 4 years...they only created 5 days worth of content?

By content I mean quests(missions)..not constant grinding of the same CO OP map and ark fall.

Defiance began development about 5 years ago, actually. There are a few other MMOs that were in development that long.. Guild Wars 2, World of Warcraft..

J1xx3r
04-22-2013, 07:58 AM
Yet, Trion does not mention anything about what sort of content to expect? Everyone is just assuming they are mysteriously going to unleash entire new continents on us, chances are they are going to RE-USE the same zones with different quests. How would you feel about the content then?

I also can't imagine they would have the bulk of the content in the DLCs, or at the very least i don't expect the DLCs to be larger than the main game. If this was true they would have hinted at it already, there's not a single peep as to what the DLCs really entail. So i would expect more something like a DLC similar to what you get for Mass Effect or Dishonored , i am NOT expecting "StarCraft 2: Heart of the Swarm" or "WoW: Mists of Panderia" here. In other words, DLCs are generally not Expansion packs.

There's a reason why Expansions costs $40+ , and DLCs costs $10.....

im with you on this one mate, everyone is assuming that Trion is going to develop this game into some kind of acceptable MMO. They make no mention to the stuff most of you are hoping this game will get just some DLC with a new race and new weapons and many people paid upfront for that lol

ten4
04-22-2013, 07:59 AM
Hmm more like a few hours of actual unique content and then repeats of that for 5 days...

Nightrave
04-22-2013, 08:02 AM
So, new to the forums, and must say that alot of the things Anim says are both poison and helpful, in ways. Going threw your huge post on things you would like to see improved Anim, i can say i can be brought to agree to alot of them, but attacking users on a board when new players look at it is poison. I have seen more negative talk on the boards then positive and that hurts the game (especially for people who research into games before purchase) whilst i have had nothing but a good time in the game itself. Now, my background on gaming? 20+ years and every MMO game ever produced essentially, and most of em i was in beta for (okay, only like...3 betas, but they were big games >.>) that being said every MMO has had a crappy launch, all of em. you can practically count down to the day when the doomsayers will start berating the forums, and this all passes, but it is still posion.

Im basically asking man, please dont attack other people or try to poison thoughts on a game that people can in fact enjoy. Your other post about improvements is great, it helps not only Dev's but people who look threw a game kind of see how others rate it, and where those thoughts can go. When you bark at people saying something is a giant pile of crap, with nothing else, it kills any desire to even test it, which kills players inflow to a game, which eventually causes a games playerbase to dry up, and it kills it.

As a new player to the forums who actually loves the game, please dont make me hate the dang forums cause i see nasty people attacking nasty people. Also, when you attack others it leasens credibility to your other post which as i said, i really have enjoyed so far.

ten4
04-22-2013, 08:14 AM
I really don't get this, and I see this type of thread a lot in other games.

First off, the content cries always use a monthly sub game as comparison. However, these kids cant get daddy's credit card and therefore cant play monthly sub games (or are unemployed adults and cant afford to do anything but waste their time in front of a game rather than getting work)

Lol at this. Rant more imo.



So they complain about any game that has a monthly sub. So they start to make games with no monthly sub to appeal to the bottom feeders..ok im fine with that.

Bottom feeders do not buy CS items, fyi. If you really think that defiance is worth a monthly sub, I really don't no what to say other than LOL! No, not by any stretch of the imagination is this game worth 15 bucks a month.


Those same people who trash any monthly sub game are now upset that their buy to play games don't have a years worth of content out the gate like a monthly sub game. Why would this matter? Well in a monthly sub game they need to keep you playing enough every month to warrant that 50 cents a day charge that's too expensive for you. With a buy to play game they give you some content, then DLC you more of it down the road.

Box priced content is like 1/3rd or less the amount of something like BL2 or GW2 which is a steal compared to Defiance.


Guild Wars 2 had this issue. The same people who hailed the game as a box purchase only then trashed the game for having way less content than a monthly sub game.

Played like 900+ hours GW2, I can't say a bad thing about it. Yea it's pretty content light at cap but there is more things to do and more variety when it comes to end game and like you said GW2 does not have much 'content' too but Defiance is considerably less. Biggest difference is that Anet adds content for free, no paid components at all; totally and utterly FREE. <3


I know its rough not getting everything you want when your a child or unemployed adult...but you guys make the big stink about having to pay 50 cents a day for a sub based game with all the content up front...and beg for a game with no sub, then cant seem to grasp what that means to how content is distributed.

Ah good ol stero typing, what would this world be without it? Better? Ha!



This game has no sub...are you out of content? Come back when theres more content...you already own the game and content will come for free you just have to wait on it. That is the trade off.

May work for SP games but this is touted as an MMO so I tend to expect better. Like OP said, it has 5 days of content and after that is grind from hell. And content 'free' thing; no one knows how that will all work. Regardless, dropped 200 hun here so far (/regret). Going to count it as a loss. ;)



oh and it took them 5 years to develop the game three times across three different platforms. Let me know how long it takes you to make a game like that, and then we can count the content and see if you beat trion.

Nah, this is what other developers are for. But if you can spare 40 mill or more, I be happy to see what I can do.

Anim
04-22-2013, 08:31 AM
So, new to the forums, and must say that alot of the things Anim says are both poison and helpful, in ways. Going threw your huge post on things you would like to see improved Anim, i can say i can be brought to agree to alot of them, but attacking users on a board when new players look at it is poison. I have seen more negative talk on the boards then positive and that hurts the game (especially for people who research into games before purchase) whilst i have had nothing but a good time in the game itself. Now, my background on gaming? 20+ years and every MMO game ever produced essentially, and most of em i was in beta for (okay, only like...3 betas, but they were big games >.>) that being said every MMO has had a crappy launch, all of em. you can practically count down to the day when the doomsayers will start berating the forums, and this all passes, but it is still posion.

Im basically asking man, please dont attack other people or try to poison thoughts on a game that people can in fact enjoy. Your other post about improvements is great, it helps not only Dev's but people who look threw a game kind of see how others rate it, and where those thoughts can go. When you bark at people saying something is a giant pile of crap, with nothing else, it kills any desire to even test it, which kills players inflow to a game, which eventually causes a games playerbase to dry up, and it kills it.

As a new player to the forums who actually loves the game, please dont make me hate the dang forums cause i see nasty people attacking nasty people. Also, when you attack others it leasens credibility to your other post which as i said, i really have enjoyed so far.

I do appreciate what you're saying, if you look at a nice big timeline of posts I think I'm fairly patient with a lot of the initial comments people make. Unfortunately for me my patience wears thin with people who cant look at a matter objectively, I need to start just ignoring those comments more to reduce the visible hostility in some of the posts. Thinking back about it now, it seems the more people lean towards the arguement that the game is perfect as it is, the more I lean towards the 'its in a terrible state' train of thought. The people in the middle, like I feel I genuinely am, I can talk Defiance all day with them :)

People like r3dl4nce and crunchy black I'll just add to my ignore list to go along with some of the others that cannot see reason, should help with the negativity. So yeah, because you asked nicely, I'll see what I can do.

Voc13
04-22-2013, 08:37 AM
WoW was created in less time with $20m less budget

No it wasn't.

Anim
04-22-2013, 08:39 AM
WoW was created in less time with $20m less budget

No it wasn't.

Actually, the figures are out there already for Defiance having a budget of $80m and WoW was on a budget of $60m.

jnt
04-22-2013, 08:40 AM
Actually, the figures are out there already for Defiance having a budget of $80m and WoW was on a budget of $60m.

How much did Trion pay for the rights to the Borderlands 1 code they built it off though?

Ensu
04-22-2013, 08:42 AM
The problem is that people can realistically see a massive let-down on the horizon. The amount of content released on the launch of the game was terrible, for a game developed for 5 years and a budget of $80m. WoW was created in less time with $20m less budget and had literally worlds more content, hundreds of hours and a depth of game that makes Defiance look like a puddle.

Budget of Defiance was $105m total, split between the TV series and the game. $45m to the TV series, $60m to the game. If the other numbers in your post are correct, it had the same budget as WoW. With inflation being what it is, those dollars wouldn't stretch as far today as they did all those years ago, no?

WoW frontloaded content, where Defiance aims to present content episodically. The world that has been created is larger than the world we currently see in the game, I saw a little of it, before I was yanked back to the nearest extraction point. It just hasn't been switched on for players yet.

WoW artificially increased the size of its content by making players wait for zeppelins and ships, making gryphon/bat/wyvern/hippogriff travel take minutes, over ten minutes for some routes, of doing nothing but watching scenery. It is essentially an extended loading screen. Not only this, but at low levels players had no personal transportation and had to run everywhere, at median levels they had slow transportation, and only at the higher levels did they have faster transportation. Even the fastest transportation in vanilla WoW was slower than a vehicle in Defiance.

Once you'd "finished" the game, you unlocked the endgame content, which was ultimately 'go into this dungeon, hope for the right loot to drop, if it doesn't drop, go in again, and again'. How is that not a grind to keep people occupied?

law
04-22-2013, 08:43 AM
I don't care how long it took to make the game, i am having tons of fun. That's what i care about.

Awesome Answer

Voc13
04-22-2013, 08:45 AM
Actually, the figures are out there already for Defiance having a budget of $80m and WoW was on a budget of $60m.

Actually was meaning that it took them 6-8 years for WoW. Understandable that you can manipulate timeframes to reflect a shorted develoment period.

Seal
04-22-2013, 08:47 AM
Was just wondering if anyone knows how long it took them to create the 5 days worth of content?

I mean...I heard somewhere they were developing this game for 4 years?

Please don't tell me that in those 4 years...they only created 5 days worth of content?

By content I mean quests(missions)..not constant grinding of the same CO OP map and ark fall.

You need to understand everything playable and doable in a game is content. What you are aiming at, is story and the story is much less than 5 days of playtime :D

jnt
04-22-2013, 08:49 AM
You need to understand everything playable and doable in a game is content. What you are aiming at, is story and the story is much less than 5 days of playtime :D

Calling things you can repeat endlessly , simple because they have been made repeatable (pvp, emergencies, co op maps), is a pathetic defense against content critics.

I mean now you can repeat the whole story! Defiance now has infinite content!

Anim
04-22-2013, 08:52 AM
Budget of Defiance was $105m total, split between the TV series and the game. $45m to the TV series, $60m to the game. If the other numbers in your post are correct, it had the same budget as WoW. With inflation being what it is, those dollars wouldn't stretch as far today as they did all those years ago, no?

WoW frontloaded content, where Defiance aims to present content episodically. The world that has been created is larger than the world we currently see in the game, I saw a little of it, before I was yanked back to the nearest extraction point. It just hasn't been switched on for players yet.

WoW artificially increased the size of its content by making players wait for zeppelins and ships, making gryphon/bat/wyvern/hippogriff travel take minutes, over ten minutes for some routes, of doing nothing but watching scenery. It is essentially an extended loading screen. Not only this, but at low levels players had no personal transportation and had to run everywhere, at median levels they had slow transportation, and only at the higher levels did they have faster transportation. Even the fastest transportation in vanilla WoW was slower than a vehicle in Defiance.

Once you'd "finished" the game, you unlocked the endgame content, which was ultimately 'go into this dungeon, hope for the right loot to drop, if it doesn't drop, go in again, and again'. How is that not a grind to keep people occupied?

Unfortunately, I got my info from a reasonably credible source rather than word of mouth.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffbercovici/2012/11/26/with-defiance-comcasts-syfy-bets-100m-on-convergence-of-tv-and-videogames/


But playing in this arena isn’t cheap. Trion spent $50 million developing Rift, the hit game it released in 2011. Defiance is an even bigger undertaking, with a budget said to reach $80 million, pushing the cost of the overall project well north of $100 million.

There wasnt anything artificial about the transport in WoW, you were flying over the land mass that you could walk if you wanted to, except to walk it would take many hours. I distinctly remember taking at least 180 minutes going from the hellgate to the royal chambers in the undercity kiting an unkillable mob to see how the npc guards would react. That's a direct route, not taking in to account the other major hubs I could have visited along the way. Unfortunately theres no way to reasonbly claim that Defiance even remotely matches WoW in terms of world size. I was only talking about one of the two continents at launch.

With regards to the dungeons to get gear, firstly it took people a lot of effort, patience and learning to actually clear the dungeons in the first place. It wasnt a walk in and one shot everything without dying affair like we have here, then after that the very fact that there was some kind of reward for figuring the dungeons out gave people a reason to do it again, to improve and feel rewarded.

Anim
04-22-2013, 08:55 AM
Actually was meaning that it took them 6-8 years for WoW. Understandable that you can manipulate timeframes to reflect a shorted develoment period.

But it didnt, and we know this because of the facts. It's kind of upsetting that peoples prejudice against wow makes them make up their 'facts' from thin air to refute any arguements against their precious game. We need to be looking at this objectively instead of with blinkers on.


World of Warcraft was first announced by Blizzard at the ECTS trade show in September 2001.[48] Development of the game started in 1999 and took roughly 4–5 years, including extensive testing.

MacDeath
04-22-2013, 09:00 AM
Okay so since this is a misinformation thread lets settle things up.

The game has been in development for 5 years. Now what that means is some guy somewhere along the chain came up with the idea to make the game then had to "sell" his idea to the upper management then had a idea a TV show also. Next would come getting a producers on board and finding a studio willing to take a risk. Since this is going to cost a lot they need sponsors out the door so yet it is held up more while someone is doing sales pitches of the idea.

The comes the actual production of the game and I would tend to bet that was maybe two years odds are closer to eighteen months though.

Now how do I know all this? I have personal friends that are in the industry at most of the big name companies now. Aside from one friend that left the sinking ship of THQ and well he left industry altogether. I know it is hard to wrap your minds around a massive project as I am sure most of you guys have never seen even a middle management position at a tech company.

TL;DR 5 years = someone thought up the idea and pushed for it to be developed so it goes off the first day it was pitched and got the green light.
Bill Trost joined Trion in 2007 when they founded the San Diego studio. You can read more here: http://uk.eonline.com/videos/206421/grant-bowler-addicted-to-defiance-game

Jason Stone joined Trion on Defiance in 2008 (almost 5 years ago). When he got there, there were 4 people on the design team so he was pretty early. See more of his story here:

http://community.defiance.com/en/2012/10/29/meet-the-dev-jason-stone-system-designer/

So, yep it took 5 years to get this far. Now, what none of us outside of Trion know is how much DLC stuff they have already produced but are rolling out over time to coincide with the TV series episodes. So, it can look like they didn't get enough done to explain the 5 years. But we don't yet know how much they have in the bag ready to roll out.

Lamerian
04-22-2013, 09:00 AM
Wow is old. It's graphics are old. The vast majority of its content isn't new, just re-tweaked. Ensu made a great point - there are ways to slow players down to make the content feel more indepth. When I first started playing years ago, after vanilla made its big splash, most regions were sparsely populated. WoW is about endgame content, grind-grind to level up, then get to have some fun. Trion has made a game in Defiance that you can have a lot of fun and get cool content from the start.

People need to move on, but the third parties who make money off of WoW don't want the party to end. Defiance needs to be different, it's own MMO, not a copy of WoW. The problem is expectation. People just expect another flash of newness because WoW is so old and boring. But, they want the same feeling they got from WoW when they first started it. Move on. Defiance is an MMO which is running along side a television series. This is the angle, it's not just an MMO. New experience, ditch the WoW mentality.

Sharky36
04-22-2013, 09:03 AM
Although I haven't played too many MMO's, I am more of a first person shooter type playing games like Modern Warfare and Black Ops. I've enjoyed what I've seen so far, they have implemented a few different types of games into Defiance. You have racing, first person shooter, quests and storyline.
I've only been playing a week and although some of the items in the game can get a little monotonous there are many things that I do like. I've spent time just running my 4 runner all over the hills just to see what kind of tricks I can pull off.
Some of the graphical content could be better and I would like to be able to interact a bit more on a social level with others that are playing the game, every game I've ever played has the good and bad.

Matter of fact the one thing I would like improved is chat, its not difficult to use, but you really have to be paying attention to it actively to have any type of conversation with anyone using it. Besides that I've enjoyed what I've seen so far and look forward to playing the content I've yet to see.

Jax Bane
04-22-2013, 09:04 AM
I believe it is a lie. Game like this is more like a year or two max with skeleton crew. There is no way they made this for last 4-5 years

The one main problem with any game taking 4 or 5 years to creat is :: when they start they are using Tech that is 4 to 5 years old, unfortunatly when the game comes out it feels like something you played 5-10 years ago! How do you fix that problem??

proto
04-22-2013, 09:06 AM
What it sounds like to me is that all the people *****ing should have spent their money on CoD or the next Battlefield. Or maybe you should get a life and go outside every now and then.

jnt
04-22-2013, 09:07 AM
The one main problem with any game taking 4 or 5 years to creat is :: when they start they are using Tech that is 4 to 5 years old, unfortunatly when the game comes out it feels like something you played 5-10 years ago! How do you fix that problem??

It feels like they built it off a divergent pre alpha of borderlands 1. It plays fantastically on some older computers too. Nothing surprises me anymore.

waltz
04-22-2013, 09:10 AM
And here is my objective view.
They put out a massive multiplayer game but only tested this game with 10% of a servers capicity.
Diluting the problems across platforms completely.
They rushed a game to keep a schedule with a telivision show, and it shows.
Now for another thing stop using your cars and fast travel and tell me how small the world is.
It's not that tiny. And for those of you who don't think they wont be adding land area to this game, i believe that we still must reach St. L at some point its the background to evrything they are releasing for ad's. It would be crazy to think they would not at it.
I am also upset at the lack of class based playing. I mean you have the capibility to set up classes that could , with proper gear and skills, tank or deal more damage or even heal, kinda.
But there is no codependance. This game is seeming like the middle ground between a borderlands style game and an mmo. it has great idea's but is currently too small scale. and the lack of a hardcore is rather uppsetting.
the lack of an auction house or publicly knows trading area is a little annoying, having to weed through this websites trading section is slow and almost ineffective.
And lastly This tier stuff on the lockboxes and bits. A Tier would be a level of quality not chance, and giving people the ability to just buy lockboxes is a little crazy. There is no skill or dedication required to gain any substantial currently.
Oh look starting to rant. Have a good one guys.

Voc13
04-22-2013, 09:11 AM
The one main problem with any game taking 4 or 5 years to creat is :: when they start they are using Tech that is 4 to 5 years old, unfortunatly when the game comes out it feels like something you played 5-10 years ago! How do you fix that problem??

Cause thats not how it works, I create applications and programs to run off of DirectX versions that aren't even out yet or standardized.

And Anim, why you attack people when you don't like that they debate your points? You want to talk objectively here, but when somone does you attack them on a personal level....And, even more disturbing is that you attack what I say with no credible information. I have done the same to you, but was trying to state that companies manipulate information to make it reflect better for them and their bottom line. Let me just ask, are you including the time that Blizzard was working with Games Workshop for an MMO that was cancelled and then later turned into WoW? Or just speaking of the WoW creation timeline?

Cynical Jester
04-22-2013, 09:11 AM
No they are not, i have been at the half of the grey areas and they have nothing to do with dlc. just borders of game world and this map is not going to expand from this point.
and even if people rumor that there will be new mobs thats nothing more than rumor, it has no solid proof.

misinformation all over the place!! This thread stinks of it.. They've talked about everything you guys are saying they haven't talked about and more.. You all just choose not to pay attention...

http://www.imaginaryatlas.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/defiance-states.jpg

Edit: Your comment about mobs is totally false too.. just read that post the other guy put or one of the many other interviews!!! .. I know.. how about you get involved and watch the accross the badlands on twitch tonight.. But I know you wont.. Your to busy being a troll and spreading misinformation.

Anim
04-22-2013, 09:47 AM
Cause thats not how it works, I create applications and programs to run off of DirectX versions that aren't even out yet or standardized.

And Anim, why you attack people when you don't like that they debate your points? You want to talk objectively here, but when somone does you attack them on a personal level....And, even more disturbing is that you attack what I say with no credible information. I have done the same to you, but was trying to state that companies manipulate information to make it reflect better for them and their bottom line. Let me just ask, are you including the time that Blizzard was working with Games Workshop for an MMO that was cancelled and then later turned into WoW? Or just speaking of the WoW creation timeline?

I quoted items from a neutral party, why would Forbes lie about a game and how much development budget it has? You seem to have failed the basic understanding of sourcing information, rumour and hearsay doesnt hold up.

Blizzard never worked with GW on a game. They wanted to but negotiations fell through at the first hurdle (source: http://kotaku.com/5929161/how-warcraft-was-almost-a-warhammer-game-and-how-that-saved-wow ), come along with some sources behind what you say and I'll take them seriously.

Ensu
04-22-2013, 09:51 AM
Unfortunately, I got my info from a reasonably credible source rather than word of mouth.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffbercovici/2012/11/26/with-defiance-comcasts-syfy-bets-100m-on-convergence-of-tv-and-videogames/



There wasnt anything artificial about the transport in WoW, you were flying over the land mass that you could walk if you wanted to, except to walk it would take many hours. I distinctly remember taking at least 180 minutes going from the hellgate to the royal chambers in the undercity kiting an unkillable mob to see how the npc guards would react. That's a direct route, not taking in to account the other major hubs I could have visited along the way. Unfortunately theres no way to reasonbly claim that Defiance even remotely matches WoW in terms of world size. I was only talking about one of the two continents at launch.

With regards to the dungeons to get gear, firstly it took people a lot of effort, patience and learning to actually clear the dungeons in the first place. It wasnt a walk in and one shot everything without dying affair like we have here, then after that the very fact that there was some kind of reward for figuring the dungeons out gave people a reason to do it again, to improve and feel rewarded.

That reasonably credible source calling on "business analysts", with a budget "said" to reach $80million. Forbes is guessing. It's also the only place saying that. Whereas the $60m number was given by Trion Worlds and SyFy.

With regards to the dungeons to get gear, it didn't take a lot of effort, it took a lot of patience, it didn't take a lot of time to learn. Groups were wiped repeatedly by overwhelming numbers, which extended the time in the dungeon significantly due to corpse runs and the like. But with a group that was switched on, runs could be completed without any hassle. Once you had the gear, the runs become almost laughably easy.

Anim
04-22-2013, 09:55 AM
That reasonably credible source calling on "business analysts", with a budget "said" to reach $80million. Forbes is guessing. It's also the only place saying that. Whereas the $60m number was given by Trion Worlds and SyFy.

For the love of god, give us a source for these numbers and I'll more than happily believe you. Everything I've found so far said $80m.


With regards to the dungeons to get gear, it didn't take a lot of effort, it took a lot of patience, it didn't take a lot of time to learn. Groups were wiped repeatedly by overwhelming numbers, which extended the time in the dungeon significantly due to corpse runs and the like. But with a group that was switched on, runs could be completed without any hassle. Once you had the gear, the runs become almost laughably easy.

This would explain why it took the best players in the world months and months to finish Molten Core, must have been those overwhelming numbers each time, not the practice needed to get better at what they were doing. Unless you're talking about a year down the line where the content had been nerfed to oblivion to let the casual gamers walk through it without hassle?

Nothingness
04-22-2013, 10:01 AM
The problem is that people can realistically see a massive let-down on the horizon. The amount of content released on the launch of the game was terrible, for a game developed for 5 years and a budget of $80m. WoW was created in less time with $20m less budget and had literally worlds more content, hundreds of hours and a depth of game that makes Defiance look like a puddle.



It doesnt excuse Trion for releasing such a tiny game with the time and budget they were given. It's missing nearly every aspect of 'mmo' that people look forward to. Wheres the chat, the social, the trading, the need for grouping. All they did was create some fun mechanics of the game and stuck in a couple of pvp maps to keep people occupied, along with some pursuits where they obviously thought to themselves that 500 kills for a pursuit isnt enough so give it 5000 and make people grind for a while, suddenly fanatics are claiming this as genuine content to the game instead of realising what a joke that is.


Dude, NO ONE is MAKING you play the game. You DO NOT pay a sub fee and pay just as much for other games with similar levels of content. Some people ***** just to hear themselves *****.

Fiancee
04-22-2013, 10:05 AM
I believe it is a lie. Game like this is more like a year or two max with skeleton crew. There is no way they made this for last 4-5 years

They dont need to lie, if the crew was just small. Rift was their main MMO, started in 2008 (Trion World was founded in 2006...) perhaps Defiance is/was secondary project.

Archangel
04-22-2013, 10:12 AM
@OP you must have missed the part in the live streams where they said they created the entire graphics engine from scratch. A game isn't just about the story or missions and quest. Its how everything blends together.

Story
Gameplay
Immersion

4 years on a game this size seems reasonable. But im not a game designer are you?

Lets talk about a game that took 9 years to make and still sucks. Diablo 3 anyone?

So have more patience. Its a MMO and we have not seen all that this game has to offer. So we can't really complain about the lack of new content since we have yet to see it but we know its comming.

Anim
04-22-2013, 10:19 AM
@OP you must have missed the part in the live streams where they said they created the entire graphics engine from scratch. A game isn't just about the story or missions and quest. Its how everything blends together.

Story
Gameplay
Immersion

4 years on a game this size seems reasonable. But im not a game designer are you?

Lets talk about a game that took 9 years to make and still sucks. Diablo 3 anyone?

So have more patience. Its a MMO and we have not seen all that this game has to offer. So we can't really complain about the lack of new content since we have yet to see it but we know its comming.

It has the gameplay and that's its biggest factor, the immersion is way off though and the story is pretty amateur. We've already gone in to some depth on development time though, creating WoW vs creating Defiance. WoW had (from sources so far) a smaller budget and shorter development time yet was released on a scale that dwarfed Defiance :\

Ensu
04-22-2013, 10:22 AM
For the love of god, give us a source for these numbers and I'll more than happily believe you. Everything I've found so far said $80m.

http://www.adweek.com/news/advertising-branding/syfy-bets-105m-tv-series-and-video-game-147622


Still, $105 million is the rough budget for the project, which includes a staggering $40 million for the TV series alone (for perspective, HBO, the gold standard for expensive TV, shelled out $60 million on Game of Thrones' first season). The balance pays for the $50 million it cost to make the video game, developed with software company Trion Worlds, which shares the financial burden (NBCU owns half of the game with Trion), and the show's huge marketing budget—upwards of $15 million.

[UPDATED: The budget breakdown for Defiance has been revised per new information from Syfy, which initially provided Adweek with erroneous numbers. Though the overall figure is correct, NBCUniversal bears less of the financial burden than it originally indicated.]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324178904578342570369741316.html


This would explain why it took the best players in the world months and months to finish Molten Core, must have been those overwhelming numbers each time, not the practice needed to get better at what they were doing. Unless you're talking about a year down the line where the content had been nerfed to oblivion to let the casual gamers walk through it without hassle?

Molten Core is not a dungeon, it was a raid. There is no comparable instance/event in Defiance to match a raid. That may come later, it may not.

Dungeons like Wailing Caverns, Uldaman and Stratholme are closer comparisons.

Jestunhi
04-22-2013, 10:25 AM
Or you know the content is gated due to the show and your impatient XD

This.

Does no one know what they are buying before paying for it and whining that it's not something else?

Since the entire first season of the TV show has already been filmed (and therefore the story not only written but finalized) I suspect there is more content which has been written but is not ingame / enabled yet.

Ensu
04-22-2013, 10:31 AM
It has the gameplay and that's its biggest factor, the immersion is way off though and the story is pretty amateur. We've already gone in to some depth on development time though, creating WoW vs creating Defiance. WoW had (from sources so far) a smaller budget and shorter development time yet was released on a scale that dwarfed Defiance :\

The Warcraft mythos has been developed since before November 1994, when Warcraft: Orcs & Humans was first released. Defiance, by contrast, is a new IP without the benefit of years of feedback, polishing and refinement.

Anim
04-22-2013, 10:34 AM
http://www.adweek.com/news/advertising-branding/syfy-bets-105m-tv-series-and-video-game-147622


Still, $105 million is the rough budget for the project, which includes a staggering $40 million for the TV series alone (for perspective, HBO, the gold standard for expensive TV, shelled out $60 million on Game of Thrones' first season). The balance pays for the $50 million it cost to make the video game, developed with software company Trion Worlds, which shares the financial burden (NBCU owns half of the game with Trion), and the show's huge marketing budget—upwards of $15 million.

[UPDATED: The budget breakdown for Defiance has been revised per new information from Syfy, which initially provided Adweek with erroneous numbers. Though the overall figure is correct, NBCUniversal bears less of the financial burden than it originally indicated.]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324178904578342570369741316.html



Molten Core is not a dungeon, it was a raid. There is no comparable instance/event in Defiance to match a raid. That may come later, it may not.

Dungeons like Wailing Caverns, Uldaman and Stratholme are closer comparisons.

So we have claims of 80, 70 and 65 million. Unfortunately I doubt Trion will give us an exact figure on how much budget they were given to make the game. The reality of it though is that unless the free DLC and episodic missions are something extraordinary I wouldnt have put the budget for Defiance at anything over $20m.

On to the wow thing. The dungeons were designed to be done maybe once or twice by a character and then move on to the next area, each one lasted a solid hour due to poor design and took a lot of effort and concentration. Compare that to Defiance and we have 15-20minute shoot fests that dont present a challenge, where you can do them solo if it were technically possible and they're being sold as the end game fun. Also I'm pretty sure WoW had a lot more of them, 2-3 per level band all the way up to 60 and then the massive raid content started. Honestly I dont see it being implemented in Defiance which is why I didnt even include raiding in my main thread, it's a shame though because people enjoy the challenge.

Ensu
04-22-2013, 10:51 AM
So we have claims of 80, 70 and 65 million. Unfortunately I doubt Trion will give us an exact figure on how much budget they were given to make the game. The reality of it though is that unless the free DLC and episodic missions are something extraordinary I wouldnt have put the budget for Defiance at anything over $20m.

On to the wow thing. The dungeons were designed to be done maybe once or twice by a character and then move on to the next area, each one lasted a solid hour due to poor design and took a lot of effort and concentration. Compare that to Defiance and we have 15-20minute shoot fests that dont present a challenge, where you can do them solo if it were technically possible and they're being sold as the end game fun. Also I'm pretty sure WoW had a lot more of them, 2-3 per level band all the way up to 60 and then the massive raid content started. Honestly I dont see it being implemented in Defiance which is why I didnt even include raiding in my main thread, it's a shame though because people enjoy the challenge.

AdWeek is still the only site I've seen that claims its numbers are directly from SyFy.

WoW did have a lot of dungeons, there's a list here (http://www.wowwiki.com/Instances_by_level). However, it didn't have any Arkfalls/dynamic events, it just had fields of wandering monsters/animals with rudimentary AI.

As for raids, Rift launched with only one raid but has since added many more, much like WoW did. It is not inconceivable that instanced pve content designed for 10/20+ people will appear further down the line. Rift also had Master modes for dungeons, so higher difficulty versions of their current instances may well appear also. This is a different game, however, so they may want to take it down a different path.

Oceanhawk
04-22-2013, 11:31 AM
AdWeek is still the only site I've seen that claims its numbers are directly from SyFy.

WoW did have a lot of dungeons, there's a list here (http://www.wowwiki.com/Instances_by_level). However, it didn't have any Arkfalls/dynamic events, it just had fields of wandering monsters/animals with rudimentary AI.

As for raids, Rift launched with only one raid but has since added many more, much like WoW did. It is not inconceivable that instanced pve content designed for 10/20+ people will appear further down the line. Rift also had Master modes for dungeons, so higher difficulty versions of their current instances may well appear also. This is a different game, however, so they may want to take it down a different path.

If I am not mistaken your numbers are including the TV production. 80 mill for this game would be insane. If they had spent that much we would be looking at a game that would require computing power of a PC/Console that hasn't been invented yet.

Ensu
04-22-2013, 11:43 AM
If I am not mistaken your numbers are including the TV production. 80 mill for this game would be insane. If they had spent that much we would be looking at a game that would require computing power of a PC/Console that hasn't been invented yet.

AdWeek's numbers:
$105m total. $50m on Defiance game. $40m on Defiance TV series. $15m on Defiance marketing.

SWTOR by contrast was estimated to have cost $200m to develop.