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MrGunn2001
05-08-2013, 09:32 AM
Dear All:

I thought that this week's Defiance, Episode 4: A Well Respected Man, was an excellent episode, and hopefully portends the show may be catching its stride.

Episode 4 was all about relationships, and it did a wonderful job of teaching us about the character's relationships to each other and to their environment. So many things are introduced and hinted at, it is hard to keep track. The episode opens with Nolan (Law Keeper), busting, some of Datak's (Alien Underworld Boss) thugs in order to send a message, that he (Nolan) is coming for him (Datak). The great thing about this episode is that while Nolan's motives are noble, his heavy handed approach has consequences. The consequences occur soon enough when Amanda (the Mayor) learns that Datak's illicit business interests and the town's interests intersect in the form of an unsavory arms acquisition from the Votanis Collective brokered by Datak. Amanda's (the Mayor) naivete is revealed again when she is shocked to learn of the town council's dealings with Datak, and even further shocked to learn the council made the deal behind her back. A nice bit of future hinting, and political intrigue occur when Amanda expresses her annoyance at the situation, and Rafe (Gulnite Mine Owner) reminds Amanda she is only the appointed Mayor, and elections are coming up soon. The scene is short but demonstrates the sophisticated nature of the writing, and how much is packed into the episode. Things in Defiance are not as they, nor are they all black and white, good vs evil. Further consequences are incurred when Kenya (Mayor's sister/Bordello Madam) and one of her ladies of the night are grabbed off the street by the Bioman, after they accidentally witness his truck full of bound and gagged kidnapping victims in the back of an ice cream truck; the victims are being transported to be drained of their adrenal juices.

Nolan goes searching for Kenya but quickly exhausts his resources as no one will open up to him, thus he cannot locate Kenya through his own efforts, so he and Amanda proceed to the Datak's house, however, Nolan's man handling and lack of respect causes Datak to refuse to help. Moreover, Datak also shows he has a better intelligence network, because he knew about Kenya's kidnapping and Nolan's search "several hours ago". The scene further illustrates just how ineffective Nolan's don't take no guff, I'm the new sheriff in town, heavy handed law enforcement efforts are, the blow back it is causing. Later Datak relents and agrees to help, but only after Datak's wife, Stahma, the real power behind the throne, approaches Amanda with a quid-pro-quo deal for help finding Kenya, he price, Datak's appointment to the empty seat on the town council, all deliciously political and back handed.

I especially appreciated the scene where Datak and Ryan are walking through the town and Datak is talking about how important it is to understand Defiance's people and their relationships and interconnectedness. Datak singling out out several people and their peccadilloes; the butcher is a drunk who has to be monitored by his wife and children, the carpet salesman has an illegitimate child, serves to remind the viewers Defiance is a living breathing town full of people living their lives, and not just a two dimensional canvas back drop for the actors to stand in front of and repeat their lines. To me this scene was very well done, it brings the town of Defiance to life, and shows how/why Datak is a power. However, the scene also demonstrates that while Nolan is a bit of a bull in the china shop, he is a fast learner as he ferrit's out Datak's ruse to make himself appear magnanimous, when they arrive at the house of the Castithan who set up the drug lab for the kidnappers.

The show explores more relationships, doing a very good job of teaching us about Amanda and Kenya's relationship. A relationship that is strained for many reasons; Amanda took on the role of mother figure to Kenya after their mother was lost in the Pale Wars, where a Kenya took on the aspect of a rebellious younger child. Amanda represents Ego, order, and responsibility, where as Kenya is Id, impulse, and chaos; capricious vs staid. Amanda is conflicted about her sister's occupation, yet she loves her begrudgingly respects her sister's success. I liked that they showed the siblings are in conflict, yet still work as a family unit.

The next interesting area is the relationship between Rafe McCawley (Miner) and his son Quentin. To me Quentin represents the son who stayed home, where Luke, now dead, represents the prodigal. Quentin feels his father loves Luke more and is in competition with Luke even though his brother is dead. Rafe mourns is son Luke's death, and seems not to realize that Quentin is more like him than his brother was. I enjoyed the growth in their relationship when Rafe tells his son he loves and values him, and then opens up about the possible motive for Luke's death. The story teller manages to bring father and son together, and teases us with hints of the mysterious motive for Luke's death and reason for the Volge attack.

Lastly we see Nolan beginning to learn, when he turns to Stahma, who is sitting just outside of the town council's closed door meeting room, and Nolan says; You know, I have had my eye on the wrong snake, you're the dangerous one. Stahma responds; You're very sweet.

All about relationships, in this episode we learn not everything is as it seems, and not everything is black and white, and that life is complicated. Nolan learns his approach to law keeping is not working and he needs to get smarter; Datak gains real power via his wife's machinations of course; Amanda learns she is still naive when it comes to her job as Mayor. Amanda and Kenya demonstrate life and relationships are complicated but family is what matters. Rafe grows when he builds a bridge to Quentin; and the mystery of Defiance deepens (pun intended :) by hinting at something fantastic at the bottom of shaft L7. While I felt some of the Amanda/Kenya flashback scenes could have made it to the cutting room floor, overall I felt this was an excellent episode, the writing was crisp, the acting good, and pacing was tight; there was lot's of red meat and crunchy bits to keep us hungry for more. I hope the goodness continues.

Scrag
05-08-2013, 10:00 AM
The biggest problem with the show is this: Most people watching it don't play the game or spend a bunch of time synchronizing their tablet with SyFy to get extra material. They just want to watch a good sci-fi tv show. SyFy seems to have lost sight of this and has left out mountains of backstory in the actual TV show.

They need some epic flashback episodes, fill in the blanks for us on the history of the world, flesh out the main characters more (they did start doing that this week a little, but it needs more). That will get more people pulled in an invested in the show.

Xynnvincible
05-08-2013, 10:02 AM
What is this syncing tablet with SyFy for extra material? I'm a noob on this stuff, I have a tablet but have no idea what you're talking about

Scrag
05-08-2013, 10:09 AM
http://www.defiance.com/en/series/news/get-more-defiance-with-syfy-sync

That.

MrGunn2001
05-08-2013, 10:16 AM
The biggest problem with the show is this: Most people watching it don't play the game or spend a bunch of time synchronizing their tablet with SyFy to get extra material.

They need some epic flashback episodes, fill in the blanks for us on the history of the world, flesh out the main characters more (they did start doing that this week a little, but it needs more). That will get more people pulled in an invested in the show.

I like your comment.

Chemikz
05-08-2013, 10:53 AM
I thoroughly enjoy the show and this episode was quite good, but not my favourite. Episode 3 still holds that spot but this was close. I've always preferred domestic Sci-Fi so this is right up my street. I the cultures Sci-Fi can present, alien and human. I agree that it was nice to see this side of Defiance in more depth with episode 4, a closer look at the many lives that inhabit the town from behind the curtain.

Detak is an awesome character and I'm loving the angle they're playing with his wife. I wonder what her motives are, what's best for her family, or herself? I only wish they ran with it a little longer instead of Nolan outright realising this, but oh well.

You can tell the budget isn't immense like some others (Game of Thrones, Walking Dead etc.) but it's brilliantly put to use. Whenever I tune in to Defiance I'm totally immersed and they've really crafted some awesome lore to go by. If I could request two things from the producers it'd be show us more of the Badlands, perhaps another arkfall and a stronger link between San Francisco and St.Louis, but that's only because I'm so invested in the game aswell as the show.

LtRobbiesan
05-08-2013, 11:00 AM
http://www.defiance.com/en/series/news/get-more-defiance-with-syfy-sync

That.

I would love to use this on my tablet but alas Canada is left out. Why do they do that? We watch the show in Canada too...

Anyhow, good post OP. I thought it was a good episode too, and can aprpeciate the character development. L7...yep, that is very interesting, and looking forward to more on that.

Tiibalt
05-08-2013, 11:02 AM
Their mother may not be dead? They didn't really confirm whether she died or not to my knowledge.

HuntGod
05-08-2013, 11:11 AM
Their mother may not be dead? They didn't really confirm whether she died or not to my knowledge.

Correct I am sure the mother will show up down the road.

I'm really hoping they finally give some devo time to Irissa in the next episode, I so want to engage with her character but she is just flat right now.

squidgod2000
05-08-2013, 11:14 AM
Best thing about this show--and especially this episode--is the characters whose personalities don't match their appearance.

FattyMcG33
05-08-2013, 11:19 AM
http://www.defiance.com/en/series/news/get-more-defiance-with-syfy-sync

That.

Too bad they only support 10" tablets =(

Garu
05-08-2013, 11:22 AM
I thought the native americans finding cave paintings a real different route for the show to go, a prostitute with a heart of gold and the suchy subtle imagery as dataks wife weaving a thread like a spider at the end. Im glad the show isnt using cliches and blunt force imagery to get its story across.

Apart from that i am enjoying the show its no where near as good as most of the shows on tv right now but because of the game its slightly interesting and i hope it improves in writing and special effects.

Tilarium
05-08-2013, 01:16 PM
Anyone else excited for the episode that Nolan learns he has been sharing his bed with someone that shares Datek's bed too? Now THAT is must see TV!

Yun
05-08-2013, 01:21 PM
Anyone else excited for the episode that Nolan learns he has been sharing his bed with someone that shares Datek's bed too? Now THAT is must see TV!

Yeah except they are both sharing Kenya's bed as it is in the Need/Want so it's neither Nolan's or Datak's bed. Also at this point it's been shown that Sthama is very very manipulative and crafty. She may have said that to get under Nolan's skin she definitely has something planned and I can't wait to see what her master plan is once all of the other pieces are in place.

Mindfix
05-08-2013, 01:21 PM
This was by far the best episode to date. They need more flashbacks that dive into these characters past.

jasper murtagh
05-08-2013, 01:30 PM
Good character development on some. Cliche writing alot. Lenny um Ulyssess the bio man, Need to know used as plot device, extra tripping over her two feet, uptight wronged wife, catching the bad sister sleeping around with main character, tough street kid gets money and loot, prostitude on drugs,
Anybody else want add in on the cliches in this episode. I was laughing at the cliches before the second commerical break.

Remag Div
05-08-2013, 01:40 PM
The biggest problem with the show is this: Most people watching it don't play the game or spend a bunch of time synchronizing their tablet with SyFy to get extra material. They just want to watch a good sci-fi tv show. SyFy seems to have lost sight of this and has left out mountains of backstory in the actual TV show.

They need some epic flashback episodes, fill in the blanks for us on the history of the world, flesh out the main characters more (they did start doing that this week a little, but it needs more). That will get more people pulled in an invested in the show.

I'm sorry but I hate when someone brings this up as a negative.

I understand what you're saying, but this whole TV show/game project was touted as a seamless experience between the two. The main reason I (and I'm sure many others) got interested in this project was the fact a video game could impact a show so much and vice versa.

If you just watch the show or just play the game then you should miss out because it's meant to be a dual experience and they shouldn't shy away from that.

Clarkeh
05-08-2013, 01:43 PM
I can't wait to see Nolan's backstory fleshed out a little more, the story behind the man so to speak, maybe a feature length episode dedicated to the flashback of The Battle of Defiance now that would be epic, this in turn would bring in some of the characters we have engaged with in the game.

ratt707
05-08-2013, 01:45 PM
Anyone else excited for the episode that Nolan learns he has been sharing his bed with someone that shares Datek's bed too? Now THAT is must see TV!

I'm pretty sure half the town has been in that bed. Lol!

Really curious to see how the election goes down and what rolls datak and mcCawley play.

Muffinman
05-08-2013, 02:13 PM
Loved the Episode.

Only one part pissed me off, when Datek said that hes not helping find the Mayors sister. Im sorry, but Nolan should have arrested him and interrogated or threatened him with jail if he didn't help. He has information on a serial kidnapper/murderer, he should have been arrested. I wouldn't stand for that crap, not sure why he did :P

AGuyWithNoName
05-08-2013, 04:53 PM
Yeah except they are both sharing Kenya's bed as it is in the Need/Want so it's neither Nolan's or Datak's bed. Also at this point it's been shown that Sthama is very very manipulative and crafty. She may have said that to get under Nolan's skin she definitely has something planned and I can't wait to see what her master plan is once all of the other pieces are in place.

I'm thinking control through association (her having control via her husband). After all, it is she who is from the more "noble" status within her species' society and it was Datak who was more the "commoner". If I'm remembering everything correctly. Personally, I absolutely have grown to love the character Sthama. She's super intelligent, very calculating, and genuinely seems to know how to "play the game". Her retort to Nolan when he made his wrong snake comment was ...not sure what word I want to use here...I can only think of perfect in regards to showing you the kind of being she is. It had such an apathetic tone of amusement...and I was instantly endeared to her. I liked her character to begin with but this is one of the few "bad guys", if you even want to call her that, for which I want to and can pull for. I absolutely adore Sthama.

With Nolan's backstory, playing through the game you can kind of piece some of it together. After all, the Lawman ( I keep forgetting his name dang it!) refers to the actions of the Defiant Few and even speaks about what actually happened there with Nolan in some of the dialogue. It wasn't pretty and it was a decision that was made that "should never be talked about again". Seeing as how we are now being peppered with scenes involving the ark-core in the series and couple that with the ending of the game (and learning about what the ark-core can do in the process), I can see some places where, if they truly pursued it, they could really push the crossover aspect that keeps getting advertised. I would also like to see more of his story too though because him being who he is, he's had to have seen some things.

IntenseSpirit
05-08-2013, 06:39 PM
Did anyone else notice how inefficient Castithan knitting is? It was like Stahma wasn't knitting at all!

DaMaJaDiZ
05-08-2013, 06:55 PM
Did anyone else notice how inefficient Castithan knitting is? It was like Stahma wasn't knitting at all!

Yeah, I made a mental note to go back and try to make sense of what she was doing there.

Saminator
05-08-2013, 06:57 PM
It was great, though I'm confused why Nolan's daughter wasn't in the episode, considering she was very dramatic over the guy who died at the end of episode 2.

AGuyWithNoName
05-08-2013, 07:32 PM
It was great, though I'm confused why Nolan's daughter wasn't in the episode, considering she was very dramatic over the guy who died at the end of episode 2.

I'm thinking (could be wrong) that scene in episode two was just a little hint as to some of her backstory. We know she was orphaned, but who had her before Nolan found her? We also know that whomever had her before Nolan "rescued" her, had to have ill intent in mind because we see she still has scars from chains. She even states that she hates chains when the deputy tried to comfort her.

I have a feeling Irisa is going to be complicated, and I don't mean that in a bad way. She's endured a great deal in her life and her actions and mannerisms towards others displays this fact perfectly. You might have just as much a chance of getting close as getting your teeth kicked in with her...and I like that. What I'm more curious about is how this band of Spirit Riders could play into her development. I'm hoping it's not going to be an easy metaphor with a young adult leaving the nest as it relates to her and Nolan. Possibly an eventual leadership role within that pack which could in turn lead to some odd alliance maybe? Waaayyyy too early for me to even begin to tell.

As far as Castithan knitting...I thought it was pretty neat looking. Had a whole Dream Cather type of vibe to it. I will say when they first showed her doing that though I thought she was playing some sort of game or something. Wasn't until I watched the replay that it dawned on my slow self that she was knitting:o.

Chemikz
05-08-2013, 08:12 PM
Nolan rescued Mirisa by killing her parents and taking her in. That's all we've been told.

Remag Div
05-08-2013, 08:43 PM
Did anyone else notice how inefficient Castithan knitting is? It was like Stahma wasn't knitting at all!


Yeah, I made a mental note to go back and try to make sense of what she was doing there.

I saw it more as an analogy of a spider capturing its prey and weaving a web, kinda like how she's manipulating everyone and weaving a web of deceit and deception.

DaMaJaDiZ
05-08-2013, 08:46 PM
I saw it more as an analogy of a spider capturing its prey and weaving a web, kinda like how she's manipulating everyone and weaving a web of deceit and deception.

Yeah, I go that part. I used to knit when I was a kid, so I was more curious to see the function side as well as the metaphor. Like if what she was doing was even feasible with ten digits. I still haven't gone back and looked, but I have it on the Kindle for later.

AZAG0TH
05-08-2013, 10:19 PM
Didn't look like she was actually doing anything to me DaMaJaDiZ - I mean she was moving her fingers around a little.. but that's about it. I am 100% sure nothing was actually happening on her "web".

I'm still not thrilled with the show - I want far more action, far less cliched and hackneyed plots and virtually no family drama. I doubt I will get that though. I'll probably keep watching through the season, but my hopes aren't all that high at this point.

EdgeTW
05-08-2013, 10:36 PM
I liked episode 4 a lot better than episode 3. Honestly, I feel like episode 4 linked with episode 2 a whole lot better than episode 3 did. You could remove 3 from the lineup and, save for the revelation that Irisa has visions, we're not missing a whole lot beyond a hellbug tie-in.

DaMaJaDiZ
05-08-2013, 10:37 PM
Didn't look like she was actually doing anything to me DaMaJaDiZ - I mean she was moving her fingers around a little.. but that's about it. I am 100% sure nothing was actually happening on her "web".

I'm still not thrilled with the show - I want far more action, far less cliched and hackneyed plots and virtually no family drama. I doubt I will get that though. I'll probably keep watching through the season, but my hopes aren't all that high at this point.

You guys are just ribbing me about my interest in knitting right? Of course she, the actress wasn't doing anything other than holding it. But it was a weave of some sort, and someone had to have created it. There's an entire science associated to the creation of fabrics etc.. I just want to see if there was any thought put into that, and how it was done. There are a million ways to weave material that aren't used in the west. Just curious is all. :p