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View Full Version : The Thread I mos want to see... Welcome to the Defiance Public Test Shard!



MacDeath
05-09-2013, 03:22 AM
"Welcome to the Public Test Shard! - Getting Started

This Public Test Shard is the bleeding edge of the game and where you can check out the latest updates before they're released world-wide.

All active players have access to the Public Test Shard when it is available; however, we will often bring the Public Test Shard offline without notice for frequent unless there is a scheduled testing event. (We'll be sure to announce them in the TestLive forum when we have one.)

Always expect the unexpected when accessing the Public Test Shard. There are no guarantees that a patch or new update won't cause everything to break, but take comfort in the fact that you're helping us to discover issues before they can impact players all around the world - thanks!

Downloading the Public Test Shard Client

You'll need a special Public Test patcher to access the Public Test Shard. You can download it here:
XXXXXXX

Simply copy the patcher into a new directory (create a folder next to where Defiance is installed called "Defiance PTS" for example) and login using the same Username and Password you normally use.

The patcher will need to download the latest version of the Public Test client, this may take some time and requires additional space on your hard-drive (roughly the same amount as the Live client.)

And that's it!

Character Copy to PTS!

You can now copy your character to the Public Test Shard! Simply click the Transfer button when you’re at Character select on the Live client and select “Copy to PTS” – it’s as easy as that! (though there may be a few bugs/limitations we’re working out). We will no longer be offering Gear/Leveling vendors with the introduction of this feature (except when testing requires it.)

Thanks for your help in making Defiance better, keep an eye on these forums for schedule events and how you can participate - Have fun!"

Iceberg
05-09-2013, 03:36 AM
Just connect to the NA Pc server. But ya, they need this badly.

Arsenic_Touch
05-09-2013, 03:37 AM
But then we might see the awesome new content that they hype up each week before they can actually hype it up and ruin the big surprise! Trion would never go for that.

MacDeath
05-09-2013, 03:46 AM
But then we might see the awesome new content that they hype up each week before they can actually hype it up and ruin the big surprise! Trion would never go for that.
IMO, that can easily be handled with NDA (Non-Disclose-Agreement) where the PTS testers agree to not disclose (post) PTS feedback outside of the Test forums. Also, with disclaimers that the stuff you see on the PTS may be changed before being promoted to Live, or, in fact, may NEVER be promoted to Live. A lot of stuff that seems like a good idea at the time should NEVER make it into the Live game.

Schwa
05-10-2013, 12:28 AM
IMO, that can easily be handled with NDA (Non-Disclose-Agreement) where the PTS testers agree to not disclose (post) PTS feedback outside of the Test forums. Also, with disclaimers that the stuff you see on the PTS may be changed before being promoted to Live, or, in fact, may NEVER be promoted to Live. A lot of stuff that seems like a good idea at the time should NEVER make it into the Live game.

It would get leaked anyway. But that doesn't excuse the lack of a test shard. Even if it's a week-long test before pushing things live, that (in theory) would cut down on the Freight Yard Telenovela story arcs.

The storyline can be as buggy as whatever, that only lasts two weeks tops and tends to be paper lantern-deep. Maps and major patches though? Test shard.

WhiteCell
05-10-2013, 12:41 AM
But consoles wouldn't get it and then people would complain and I'm unsure whether or not there are enough players to justify it on the PC to begin with.

It is a standard for most MMO's though.

MacDeath
05-10-2013, 02:19 AM
But consoles wouldn't get it and then people would complain and I'm unsure whether or not there are enough players to justify it on the PC to begin with.

It is a standard for most MMO's though.
IMO, there would be no requirement on Trion's part to exclude consoles from a TEST server. Alpha allowed consoles as well as PCs. It's only the LIVE game, IMO, that MS and Sony care about being single platform.

Schwa
05-12-2013, 01:37 AM
But consoles wouldn't get it and then people would complain and I'm unsure whether or not there are enough players to justify it on the PC to begin with.

It is a standard for most MMO's though.

Let them complain. If it's needed for QA to do its job, then it's needed for QA to do its job. If there isn't enough demand for 3 test servers, then release the one. If the consoles won't play ball with the vastly easier-to-patch platform of PC for testing, then they don't play ball.

Sanguinesun
05-12-2013, 01:58 AM
Gonna tell ya folks, a test shard matters nothing. Most of the bugs and glitches were in alpha for months, reported by us players, etc. It didnt matter obviously because we're still encountering them today.

A public test shard would simply be a form of lip service at this point. Dont be naive to think otherwise.

Noks
05-12-2013, 02:05 AM
Actually, the alpha server will be used as a test shard. When I get bored enough, I'll find the post and link it.

BrassRazoo
05-12-2013, 02:07 AM
This all sounds very complicated.
Can TRION handle a shard thingy?

Schwa
05-12-2013, 02:11 AM
Gonna tell ya folks, a test shard matters nothing. Most of the bugs and glitches were in alpha for months, reported by us players, etc. It didnt matter obviously because we're still encountering them today.

A public test shard would simply be a form of lip service at this point. Dont be naive to think otherwise.

Wow. That's an even deeper level of cynicism than I tend to reach, but I can say absolutely nothing that counters what you have said.

I concede.

BrassRazoo
05-12-2013, 02:23 AM
Schwa got out pessimisticaled.

Skydive
05-12-2013, 02:23 AM
Gonna tell ya folks, a test shard matters nothing. Most of the bugs and glitches were in alpha for months, reported by us players, etc. It didnt matter obviously because we're still encountering them today.

A public test shard would simply be a form of lip service at this point. Dont be naive to think otherwise.

It doesn't matter if something is reported or not, doesn't guarantees a bug gets fixed! If the report isn't the issue, then there is a huge multitude of problems why something isn't fixed, some technical, some logistical.

The biggest problem with bug fixes is down to the report themselves. Here's an example of probably the worst and LEAST helpful bug report I have ever seen

"XYZ is broken, fix it!"

Trust me when I say a lot of so called beta or alpha testers report a bug like this. There is zero information that helps the programmer even look for the problem. There's no explanation to problem, what time it happened (which is hugely useful if they have to look through server logs), what caused it and whether the problem can even be repeated.

A test server is only as good as the testers on it! Given the the sheer volume of unconstructive feedback posts I have seen on the forum. I for one do not believe the test server will help unless there is a radical change in the mentality in the forum posting community.

Taking the tester out of the equation to the use of a Test server. People need to understand even if all the information is there. There is priority over the bug. Some bugs will be fixed faster than others. Namely anything that is an known exploit or game breaking will be fixed faster than you blink, a non-critical or a bug that can be bypassed is a lower priority.

Even if priority isn't an issue then there is the question of whether the bug can be fixed or not. I remember the infamous warping backwards bug with server walls in Star Wars Galaxes, that thing was reported to death. It happened before the game was even launched and well past several changes in game play for that game for several years. Everyone knew what was causing it, but it took them five years to fix that bug.

Defiance has the added issue with content and spoilers, which may not be a simple fact of having an NDA for anyone on a possible test server. The potential for any form of spoiler leak can cause a lot of legal problems as result of the TV show. And that's a can of worms I doubt even TRION or Syfy want to risk opening. As another poster has replied, an NDA will not stop people on these test servers leaking information.

Schwa
05-12-2013, 02:28 AM
It doesn't matter if something is reported or not, doesn't guarantees a bug gets fixed! If the report isn't the issue, then there is a huge multitude of problems why something isn't fixed, some technical, some logistical.

The biggest problem with bug fixes is down to the report themselves. Here's an example of probably the worst and LEAST helpful bug report I have ever seen

"XYZ is broken, fix it!"

Trust me when I say a lot of so called beta or alpha testers report a bug like this. There is zero information that helps the programmer even look for the problem. There's no explanation to problem, what time it happened (which is hugely useful if they have to look through server logs), what caused it and whether the problem can even be repeated.

A test server is only as good as the testers on it! Given the the sheer volume of unconstructive feedback posts I have seen on the forum. I for one do not believe the test server will help unless there is a radical change in the mentality in the forum posting community.

Taking the tester out of the equation to the use of a Test server. People need to understand even if all the information is there. There is priority over the bug. Some bugs will be fixed faster than others. Namely anything that is an known exploit or game breaking will be fixed faster than you blink, a non-critical or a bug that can be bypassed is a lower priority.

Even if priority isn't an issue then there is the question of whether the bug can be fixed or not. I remember the infamous warping backwards bug with server walls in Star Wars Galaxes, that thing was reported to death. It happened before the game was even launched and well past several changes in game play for that game for several years. Everyone knew what was causing it, but it took them five years to fix that bug.

Defiance has the added issue with content and spoilers, which may not be a simple fact of having an NDA for anyone on a possible test server. The potential for any form of spoiler leak can cause a lot of legal problems as result of the TV show. And that's a can of worms I doubt even TRION or Syfy want to risk opening. As another poster has replied, an NDA will not stop people on these test servers leaking information.

Sorry, the poor quality of the game at launch can't be laid at the feet of the alpha/beta testers that did what they could as best as they could. Nor does it excuse foundational bugs (loss of player progression in pursuits or unequipping traits or reload issues) a month and a half after launch.

He does have a point-- all a test server would do at this point is provide lipservice to the community. Trion's QA has been a step behind during the entire development and continued live service of Defiance.

If you'd like to disagree: Freight Yard.

MacDeath
05-12-2013, 02:31 AM
Gonna tell ya folks, a test shard matters nothing. Most of the bugs and glitches were in alpha for months, reported by us players, etc. It didnt matter obviously because we're still encountering them today.

A public test shard would simply be a form of lip service at this point. Dont be naive to think otherwise.
Just because it didn't work well then, doesn't mean it won't work now. The devs were under pressure to get the game out in early April prior to the TV series premire. That pressure is off now and IMO, they have time to give the Test Server(s) a chance to improve the quality of the game.

Myria
05-12-2013, 05:30 AM
Just because it didn't work well then, doesn't mean it won't work now. The devs were under pressure to get the game out in early April prior to the TV series premire. That pressure is off now and IMO, they have time to give the Test Server(s) a chance to improve the quality of the game.

There hasn't really been any indication of a shift in priorities since launch, to be honest. Meaningful communication remains nigh unto nonexistent (the dev blog posts are nothing but marketing, IMHO, they're not even really bothering to hide that), major issues -- chat, PTT, clan, etc -- that have been discussed since Alpha remain unacknowledged in any meaningful form. Aside from a mention early on, there's been no indication of any interest on Trion's part to a PTS and there has been no official presence on the Alpha boards (and, to be fair, very little player presence these days, understandably enough) in quite some time -- frankly that was true for quite a while prior to launch.

I'd like to see a real and meaningful PTS in place, but if it's just going to be for show and not really listened to -- which, frankly, was the case for most of the Alpha and the Betas -- I don't see the point of players wasting their time and taking some of the flak (as was the case post-launch, with several people suggesting Alpha testers "hadn't done their job") just to provide Trion with a little arse coverage.

MacDeath
05-12-2013, 07:19 AM
There hasn't really been any indication of a shift in priorities since launch, to be honest. Meaningful communication remains nigh unto nonexistent (the dev blog posts are nothing but marketing, IMHO, they're not even really bothering to hide that), major issues -- chat, PTT, clan, etc -- that have been discussed since Alpha remain unacknowledged in any meaningful form. Aside from a mention early on, there's been no indication of any interest on Trion's part to a PTS and there has been no official presence on the Alpha boards (and, to be fair, very little player presence these days, understandably enough) in quite some time -- frankly that was true for quite a while prior to launch.

I'd like to see a real and meaningful PTS in place, but if it's just going to be for show and not really listened to -- which, frankly, was the case for most of the Alpha and the Betas -- I don't see the point of players wasting their time and taking some of the flak (as was the case post-launch, with several people suggesting Alpha testers "hadn't done their job") just to provide Trion with a little arse coverage.
Well of course it needs to be "real and meaningful" or it's not worth doing. Trion had a "real and meaningful" PTS for Rift, IMO and we have no reason to believe it would be different for Defiance.

mcwjimbo
05-12-2013, 07:54 AM
silly rabbit

current game is the alpha test servers

Miserere
05-12-2013, 08:31 AM
I would love for a PTS to go live. It would be beneficial to not only the player base but to the devs as well. They could see how our reaction to certain changes are and if the changes are good for the game. But even with a PTS, some bugs will slip through because if my memory serves me correctly, they always clean the PTS and install a fresh batch.

Swampster
05-12-2013, 08:51 AM
It doesn't matter if something is reported or not, doesn't guarantees a bug gets fixed! If the report isn't the issue, then there is a huge multitude of problems why something isn't fixed, some technical, some logistical.

The biggest problem with bug fixes is down to the report themselves. Here's an example of probably the worst and LEAST helpful bug report I have ever seen

"XYZ is broken, fix it!"

Trust me when I say a lot of so called beta or alpha testers report a bug like this. There is zero information that helps the programmer even look for the problem. There's no explanation to problem, what time it happened (which is hugely useful if they have to look through server logs), what caused it and whether the problem can even be repeated.

A test server is only as good as the testers on it! Given the the sheer volume of unconstructive feedback posts I have seen on the forum. I for one do not believe the test server will help unless there is a radical change in the mentality in the forum posting community.

Taking the tester out of the equation to the use of a Test server. People need to understand even if all the information is there. There is priority over the bug. Some bugs will be fixed faster than others. Namely anything that is an known exploit or game breaking will be fixed faster than you blink, a non-critical or a bug that can be bypassed is a lower priority.

Sorry but I disagree with a lot of this, and the blame here certainly can't be laid at the alpha testers feet.. they did what they were asked to do and then some. Screenshots, videos, and a whole raft of other data that we could generate showing what issues we had over and above the usual reports made in game, which were supposedly always timestamped and bundled with various other bits of data.

The Alpha discussion boards were very civilised and very constructive, there was a palpable and genuine desire amongst the long term testers to get this game out of the door in a fit state. Problems were raised, discussed, evaluated and even suggestions made to work around issues.. the problem for testers back then was that the communication was effectively only going in one direction. With no feedback and very little progress being made on many of the reported problems, many of which are still present.. some of which could be construed as major exploits or game breaking.

The one thing I do agree on, is I don't think a PTS will help unless there's a change in how we work together.. and that's not because of the testers, especially if the same group of Alpha testers were invited to participate, but whether in fact Trion actually listen and act on the reports being given to them.. or at least engage in genuine feedback as why they're going a certain direction or appearing not to act on certain issues.

SteveMND
05-12-2013, 09:06 AM
While a playtest server will likely catch a many bugs, chances are it won't affect a lot of them. Quite often in these cases -- and you can hear devs from all games mentioning this all the time -- a bug or issue won't be found until there's a certain number of the population dealing with it -- a playtest group of 100 people simply cannot encounter the same types and numbers of issues with the same frequency as 100,000 people can. And while this may these numbers may be somewhat boosted by the apparent lack of things to do at 'endgame,' most playtest servers I've seen don't really have a huge amount of people on them helping out. Either some people don't want to 'spoil' upcoming content for themselves or don't want to go through all the bother of setting up the playtest client, and even then, I've noticed most people just tend to auto-level themselves to the max if available, thus invalidating a lot of potential issues that lower-level player might come across as part of the normal leveling-up procedure.

So yes, a good playtest server would be a definite step in the right direction and would no doubt catch a lot of stuff, I'd caution people about getting too optimistic about it being a guaranteed fix for stuff.

MacDeath
05-12-2013, 09:25 AM
While a playtest server will likely catch a many bugs, chances are it won't affect a lot of them. Quite often in these cases -- and you can hear devs from all games mentioning this all the time -- a bug or issue won't be found until there's a certain number of the population dealing with it -- a playtest group of 100 people simply cannot encounter the same types and numbers of issues with the same frequency as 100,000 people can. And while this may these numbers may be somewhat boosted by the apparent lack of things to do at 'endgame,' most playtest servers I've seen don't really have a huge amount of people on them helping out. Either some people don't want to 'spoil' upcoming content for themselves or don't want to go through all the bother of setting up the playtest client, and even then, I've noticed most people just tend to auto-level themselves to the max if available, thus invalidating a lot of potential issues that lower-level player might come across as part of the normal leveling-up procedure.

So yes, a good playtest server would be a definite step in the right direction and would no doubt catch a lot of stuff, I'd caution people about getting too optimistic about it being a guaranteed fix for stuff.
IMO, adding a PTS can't prevent ALL problems getting to Live but it can prevent LOTS of them. That would be worth doing if it helped improve the quality going to live by 50%, no? How about 10%? I'm guessing all the work to set something like this up wouldn't be considered worth it for a 10% improvement in Quality. Only Trion knows what the costs are and what the likely value is.

I stand ready to spend MOST of my time on the PTS if they decide to move forward with this. Who's with me on this?

Miserere
05-12-2013, 09:32 AM
I'd be with you, MacDeath. I spent a vast majority on WoW PTS and found many issues. But as you said, a 10% is better than no %.

MacDeath
05-12-2013, 09:27 PM
I'm suprised so few people have indicated a willingness to help. Of course this isn't an official thread so maybe there are thousands who are willing...

Arsenic_Touch
05-12-2013, 10:15 PM
Just because it didn't work well then, doesn't mean it won't work now. The devs were under pressure to get the game out in early April prior to the TV series premire. That pressure is off now and IMO, they have time to give the Test Server(s) a chance to improve the quality of the game.

So if the pressure if off, what's the excuse for not fixing the bugs that were already reported during the alpha and continue to plague this game? What makes you think if they suddenly added test shards that those same bugs would suddenly get fixed? They already have the feedback and aren't acting on it. Either because they don't know what they're doing, don't care or just haven't prioritized things. So what evidence do you have that a PTS would change anything? Swampster pretty much nailed it.

MacDeath
05-12-2013, 10:27 PM
So if the pressure if off, what's the excuse for not fixing the bugs that were already reported during the alpha and continue to plague this game? What makes you think if they suddenly added test shards that those same bugs would suddenly get fixed? They already have the feedback and aren't acting on it. Either because they don't know what they're doing, don't care or just haven't prioritized things. So what evidence do you have that a PTS would change anything? Swampster pretty much nailed it.
I don't have any evidence for Defiance. It worked quite well for Rift and therefore I expect it would work well for Defiance.

Phidbaker
05-12-2013, 10:59 PM
Wait... Aren't we are already on test servers already...?!

Kane
05-13-2013, 12:11 AM
I agreee with the PTS and it is a great idea, i would like to know whey there isn't one or was one at launch, almost every mmo i played had a form of pts, no matter what it was called it was there, optional, and helpful for the evolution of the game, and ffs trion...freee QA...might be better than the payed one you have now...

MacDeath
05-13-2013, 12:33 AM
I agreee with the PTS and it is a great idea, i would like to know whey there isn't one or was one at launch, almost every mmo i played had a form of pts, no matter what it was called it was there, optional, and helpful for the evolution of the game, and ffs trion...freee QA...might be better than the payed one you have now...
Well, IMO, PTS isn't a substitute for Paid QA, in fact it may increase the workload of the QA staff. Someone does have to coordinate and monitor the PTS and that will be the QA staff. However, a well implemented PTS can provide higher quality of the offerings being promoted to Live servers and thus higher customer Satisfaction. Higher customer sat SHOULD lead to better retention which should lead to more income for Trion.