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Hope499
05-10-2013, 11:18 AM
Trying to settle an arguement. Help from the forums I need.

My buddy is trying to tell me this is a RPG. Im telling him its a shooter (with rpg elemets) but still classified as a shooter.

Thoughts? (I know ANY game can be a RPG-Role playing game, but im talking bout the game description)

Justin CarMichael
05-10-2013, 11:18 AM
MMOShooter with a few RPG elements.

Santana Ortega
05-10-2013, 11:19 AM
Shooter. There is no RPG here just a character storyline to quest through.
No MMO either or it would have let you group to do the storyline quests.

RoG Goat
05-10-2013, 11:20 AM
Barely any RPG attributes when compared to games like fallout and Fable...

It's definitely a shooter first.

Garu
05-10-2013, 11:23 AM
It's difficult to pin down an exact definition of the RPG genre (especially since it's not uncommon for games from other genres to incorporate RPG elements), but RPGs can be counted on for hours of exploration, enthralling stories, and deep gameplay.

So does this game cover those basics?

Cutlass Jack
05-10-2013, 11:23 AM
RPG and Shooter are not mutually exclusive. Mass Effect for example is both. This is both as well.

Garu
05-10-2013, 11:26 AM
I would like to change my earlier post as i was checking around online for a definition of a RPG and i think this comes closest.

A game is a computer RPG if it features player-driven development of a persistent character or characters via the making of consequential choices.

In that respect i would say it is an rpg, but it is also a shooter. But that doesnt mean that all shooters are RPG's. Somethings can be described in more than one term.

MJGoodbarr
05-10-2013, 11:26 AM
I'd say shooter. MMOTPS. RPG? No way. I don't even see elements. All characters hold the same values regardless if you're an Irathient, Human or an upcoming Castithan. Nor does it matter what class you choose. Survivalist, Veteran, they are all the same...

Garu
05-10-2013, 11:28 AM
I'd say shooter. MMOTPS. RPG? No way. I don't even see elements. All characters hold the same values regardless if you're an Irathient, Human or an upcoming Castithan. Nor does it matter what class you choose. Survivalist, Veteran, they are all the same...

But the choices you make (your ego perks) define your characters advantages and disadvantages in the world and these are obtained by leveling your character.

Cutlass Jack
05-10-2013, 11:30 AM
I'd say shooter. MMOTPS. RPG? No way. I don't even see elements. All characters hold the same values regardless if you're an Irathient, Human or an upcoming Castithan. Nor does it matter what class you choose. Survivalist, Veteran, they are all the same...

Its funny that what you point out as being the same are actually Roleplaying choices.

Daholic
05-10-2013, 11:31 AM
Defiance is a shooter on an rpg template.

If your a hardcore rpg'er, you will find Defiance lacking while laughing your azz off how this game can possible exist amongst other game that's done whats currently available in Defiance better.

If your a hardcore shooter guy, then you will..again..laugh your azz off because again, its been done better else where.

But if you lower your standard a bit, and make an exception for this game, and this game only, you may enjoy this game very much.

Miserere
05-10-2013, 11:33 AM
But the choices you make (your ego perks) define your characters advantages and disadvantages in the world and these are obtained by leveling your character.

I see what you mean but people won't see it as a traditional RPG such as Final Fantasy or KotOR. I still see it more as a shooter.

Daholic
05-10-2013, 11:33 AM
But the choices you make (your ego perks) define your characters advantages and disadvantages in the world and these are obtained by leveling your character.

Here's a question, can you be effective without any perks, or high end weapons and grenades?

Justin CarMichael
05-10-2013, 11:34 AM
But the choices you make (your ego perks) define your characters advantages and disadvantages in the world and these are obtained by leveling your character.

But at the end of the game everybody will have all the same perks ((all of them)). I wouldn't consider something an RPG that allowed you to pick red or blue as a shirt color. I mean by that you would call the original Mario brothers an RPG because you pick red Mario or green Lugi at the start.

MJGoodbarr
05-10-2013, 11:35 AM
I know what you're saying and you both make good points. I think that I just want more depth to the characters, y'kno?

Garu
05-10-2013, 11:42 AM
I think the problem is that so many medias now have incorperated RPG elements in to their games that realisticly most games can be classed as having rpgs elements but if you are asking for one or the other then this is a shooter first, there are no consequences for your actions ingame like most rpgs. There are no choices at all for your character to make and the majority of the game has nothing to do with the story.

However it does have rpg elements such as the ego choices, just because these are not needed and you could eventually get them all, dont change that it is still a rpg element they have taken. Leveling up at all and then having a choice what to do when you have leveled is at its core a rpg staple.

This is by no means a final fantasy/baldurs gate but it does have elements from both.

Cutlass Jack
05-10-2013, 11:43 AM
My feeling will always be that if you can fully create your own protaganist of varying builds and play that character through a full story its an RPG. I've seen many games posing as RPGs that didnt let you do even that much.

That doesn't mean Defiance is on the upper end of RPG like features, because of course, its not. But the fully voiced cutscenes do make it feel more like one than say RIFT did for me.

ironhands
05-10-2013, 11:43 AM
Shooter, hands down.

IMO - what makes an RPG is the "role" your character takes in the combat mechanic. The stronger/greater the class division and/or progression, the more of an RPG it is.

Yenah
05-10-2013, 11:46 AM
If we want to truly be technical about the definition of RPG, then any game where you become invested in what your character is doing, and play that character according to the game world, could be considered, in some term, Role Playing, as you are playing the role of your character in its world.
I think Defiance is a shooter, with role playing elements to it.

Daholic
05-10-2013, 11:46 AM
I think the problem is that so many medias now have incorperated RPG elements in to their games that realisticly most games can be classed as having rpgs elements but if you are asking for one or the other then this is a shooter first, there are no consequences for your actions ingame like most rpgs. There are no choices at all for your character to make and the majority of the game has nothing to do with the story.

However it does have rpg elements such as the ego choices, just because these are not needed and you could eventually get them all, dont change that it is still a rpg element they have taken. Leveling up at all and then having a choice what to do when you have leveled is at its core a rpg staple.

This is by no means a final fantasy/baldurs gate but it does have elements from both.

What im saying is, when people say your ego makes the difference on how you character plays, in a game that can be played without any egos equipped, then it becomes completely beatable with or without.

Garu
05-10-2013, 11:52 AM
What im saying is, when people say your ego makes the difference on how you character plays, in a game that can be played without any egos equipped, then it becomes completely beatable with or without.

But the difficulty of the game doesnt decide if it is an RPG, its about taking role of something and making choices based upon the role you want to do. But i think we are agreeing on the same thing but with a different stance on it, i think its a shooter with rpg elements, i think u think the same?

Daholic
05-10-2013, 11:57 AM
But the difficulty of the game doesnt decide if it is an RPG, its about taking role of something and making choices based upon the role you want to do. But i think we are agreeing on the same thing but with a different stance on it, i think its a shooter with rpg elements, i think u think the same?

Yes I do agree.

Mad
05-10-2013, 11:59 AM
Defiance is a shooter on an rpg template.

If your a hardcore rpg'er, you will find Defiance lacking while laughing your azz off how this game can possible exist amongst other game that's done whats currently available in Defiance better.

If your a hardcore shooter guy, then you will..again..laugh your azz off because again, its been done better else where.

But if you lower your standard a bit, and make an exception for this game, and this game only, you may enjoy this game very much.

have to lower it a LOT more then a bit....only thing this game has going for it that s in any way unique and not from a template ... is the interaction with show .... when .. if .. that actually starts ...

The game is clearly labeled an MMO shooter and truly has little in the way of RPG elements at all ...
Borderlands Shields
Borderlands Guns
Crime Craft Weapon mods
Modified GW2 revive system
etc ...

jasper murtagh
05-10-2013, 12:01 PM
"hey hope got some rpg in my shooter!"
Some call a mmo to clean up this mess.

Anderson
05-10-2013, 12:03 PM
My definition of RPG is pretty simple: It borrows ideas from Dungeons & Dragons.

Hope499
05-10-2013, 12:09 PM
I think the problem is that so many medias now have incorperated RPG elements in to their games that realisticly most games can be classed as having rpgs elements but if you are asking for one or the other then this is a shooter first, there are no consequences for your actions ingame like most rpgs. There are no choices at all for your character to make and the majority of the game has nothing to do with the story.

However it does have rpg elements such as the ego choices, just because these are not needed and you could eventually get them all, dont change that it is still a rpg element they have taken. Leveling up at all and then having a choice what to do when you have leveled is at its core a rpg staple.

This is by no means a final fantasy/baldurs gate but it does have elements from both.

Yup. It has RPG elements to be sure, but its a shooter first and foremost...

Im not controlling a moogle under Figaro castle or exploring a hidden dungeon looking for Espers...lets be real. Its a shooter....

ironhands
05-10-2013, 12:09 PM
Here's a question, can you be effective without any perks, or high end weapons and grenades?

so long as you have one ego ability, and a shield, you can play. Might not even need the ego ability, and shield is debatable. A good shooter player can adapt and use their skills to survive. An RPG relies mostly on the actual stats of the character. a level 1 wizard would likely have 0 chance on the final boss.

Valethar
05-10-2013, 05:08 PM
The official designation, back when it was still in development, was that Defiance is a TPS with some RPG elements thrown in. That has not, to my knowledge, ever been changed.

Technically, you could likely say both of you are right, to a degree, but by Trion's own admission you would be correct, where your friend would not. It's a shooter first and foremost.

WhiteCell
05-10-2013, 05:11 PM
Trying to settle an arguement. Help from the forums I need.

My buddy is trying to tell me this is a RPG. Im telling him its a shooter (with rpg elemets) but still classified as a shooter.

Thoughts? (I know ANY game can be a RPG-Role playing game, but im talking bout the game description)

Since there are no roles nobody with a straight face could say it's an RPG. Hell, even team shooters have roles and aren't called RPG's. Planetside 2 has roles and isn't considered an RPG either. I'm sure if Defiance had roles it could easily be considered an MMORPG but right now Planetside 2 is more of an MMORPG than defiance.

baelrusk
05-10-2013, 05:54 PM
It's an MMOTPS.
Just an online shooter. Nothing else.
The elements they added that people are confusing with RPG elements....are not. They simply are also part of RPG games.
There are RTS games that as well have some of those elements as well. They are actually used in many genre.

Adryn
05-10-2013, 06:02 PM
Possibly the first thing i really noticed when i first started looking into defiance the game was that the letters RPG arn't anywhere.
Indeed there are some elements that, it could be argued, are rpg like but the game as a whole isn't an mmorpg and it never set out to be and doesn't try to be.
It's refreshing in a way, too many now are using RPG as a lure and then handing the player a heavily stripped down system that has only some basis in rpg mechanics so your left feeling kinda screwed over.

While personally i do wish they'd lean more towards rpg features in the future, i won't get all hot and bothered if they don't because it seems like it was never their intention in the first place.