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View Full Version : Contracts, Co-ops, Rushing through everything and complaining about the grind...



AngryFire
05-18-2013, 05:34 PM
I want to start off by stating that I am an older gamer, I have been playing video games since back when Atari and other systems came out. I was playing PC games back on the very first PC's introduced for public consumption. So you could say that I have been into gaming a little while.

Secondly I would like to say that I absolutely love this game (call me a Fanboy if you wish, i really do not care:) ). There have only been a few games I have delve into such as i did with Defiance (almost ego 4100) despite the bugs and broken items within the game. I still rather enjoy playing it (I have faith Trion will continue to improve the game and add content).

One of the biggest issues i have had with the game lately can be blamed on two things, changes in game mechanics and the players themselves.

The mechanics of getting shared credit for contracts should have never been placed within this 'co-op' game. They removed co-op from the game doing so (I know, this has been discussed countless times). Now you have to be sure you tag everything possible or else risk getting nothing for performing an action (be it a co-op or mission in the open world). Its not to hard to re-run whatever it is to get the contract requirements but this should have never happened.

Now whenever you do contract work you are dealing with a ton of others doing the same thing.. Sure some of them realize there are others there and will tag the targets too so others can get credit as well but allot of times this just does not happen.

Often people will rush in, kill whatever it is that needs killed and leave and not even complete the event (allot of them will exit the instance just to join another to complete their contract work as fast as possible)

Trion should change the game mechanics to require you to fully complete an event before you get credit for the contract kills. This hurts most with coop maps. When a contract requires you to kill xxx in a coop map allot of people will just exit the instance once they get what they need (a good example is Scrapworks where you must kill Dark Matter, i was trying to complete that contract the other day and every instance I joined someone jumped the fence or I started half way through the event because the ones that finished their kills leaved the instance and i was thrown in the scrapper part of the event).

The youth of today just do not make any sense to me. Even my own kids behave like this. Every one is so rush rush rush, got to get as much as I can as fast as I can, forget about everybody else. I enjoy playing the missions, i never leave once my contract is met. I enjoy running through an entire coop map (contract or not). I have never left a coop map once, i complete it and enjoy them. If I am not going as fast as you wish and want me to skip over portions of the map so you may farm keys faster, then YOU should leave the instance and do this with friends.

I suspect that allot that are complaining about the grind and there being nothing to do that a good majority of them rushed and found every shortcut they could to get keys, get ego, etc as fast as they could. Its no wonder they dont enjoy the game.

Ok Rant over..

Anim
05-18-2013, 05:51 PM
Yup, everyone who got bored of the <20 hours non-repetitive content is just a kid who rushes through things. Obviously we should be asking you how to play a game before we try it.

It takes a special kind of person to find the co-op instances in this game fun after even the 3rd run, nothing dynamic, nothing challenging, nothing of interest.

WhiteCell
05-18-2013, 05:57 PM
Get off my lawn, you kids!

Age has nothing to do with Defiance's problems. If you want to believe that obviously you will, but you're so very wrong about that.

pamoth
05-18-2013, 06:06 PM
rushing/grinding sucks in all mmo's not just this i like to turtle through enjoying every aspect of the game wait for those rabbits to nap for a second then overtake to win the race ;) but with defiance after that first patch the game became unberable, obviously i kept playing in hope the issues would get fixed but its almost 2 months now and every patch the game feels a little more worse for ware so i just look for silly things like scenery which catapults you into the air or ways out of the map

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 06:06 PM
Joy, someone who uninstalled the game and a troll.

If you were to read my post you would realize that i stated that the issues were ones that " i have had". I will not even respond to the other nonsense.

Nyx_Rainhart
05-18-2013, 06:10 PM
I took my time. My patience is godly I must admit.

WhiteCell
05-18-2013, 06:11 PM
Joy, someone who uninstalled the game and a troll.

If you were to read my post you would realize that i stated that the issues were ones that " i have had". I will not even respond to the other nonsense.

I read your ramblings. I thought I was pretty gracious with my response. It was short and to the point. Your projecting, pal. Don't get all angry when people point it out. There isn't much substance to your thread anyway. You assume things about people you have no idea and present it as fact when in reality those "youth" are more likely adults constrained for time than kids who have significantly more time to fart around with boring tedious stuff. Yes, every single one of the cooperative instances is tedious and boring.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 06:15 PM
rushing/grinding sucks in all mmo's not just this i like to turtle through enjoying every aspect of the game wait for those rabbits to nap for a second then overtake to win the race ;) but with defiance after that first patch the game became unberable, obviously i kept playing in hope the issues would get fixed but its almost 2 months now and every patch the game feels a little more worse for ware so i just look for silly things like scenery which catapults you into the air or ways out of the map

I done my fair share of grinding (mostly arkfalls and roadside events, i did not grind things like mine 99, etc). The game has great potential it just needs a TON of TLC. I stick around in hopes it gets that. I am at the point i just do allot of silly things as well.

Some things just are becoming very aggravating to myself and i hope get addressed in some ways. Some things I know they cant and that's just because its a MMO and players will be players.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 06:17 PM
I read your ramblings. I thought I was pretty gracious with my response. It was short and to the point. Your projecting, pal. Don't get all angry when people point it out. There isn't much substance to your thread anyway. You assume things about people you have no idea and present it as fact when in reality those "youth" are more likely adults constrained for time than kids who have significantly more time to fart around with boring tedious stuff. Yes, every single one of the cooperative instances is tedious and boring.

Troll #2 Present. Thanks for your feedback.

Dooks
05-18-2013, 06:34 PM
My only issue with this game in content, I love the idea, I love the mechanics, I just wish it was more social and had more content. As I have repeatedly said, if we are to measure level in EGO, give me enough content to reach that max EGO. Drive here kill the same stuff, dive there kill the same stuff has just got old. As for co-ops, I don't mind repeating them, they are fun. This game is a huge grind and that I don't like. I understand the idea behind grind, but it is usually to obtain something other than leveling, at least in the games I like to play. I too am an older gamer, remember saving up that $99 (which was a crap load of money back then) to to buy my first 2600 back in the day, but the grind may prove too much for me here, hopefully they will address it.

As far as patience goes, I have 6 kids, I ooze patience, so the fact that this game is trying my patience says something.

Orge Lambart
05-18-2013, 06:43 PM
I want to start off by stating that I am an older gamer, I have been playing video games since back when Atari and other systems came out. I was playing PC games back on the very first PC's introduced for public consumption. So you could say that I have been into gaming a little while.

Secondly I would like to say that I absolutely love this game (call me a Fanboy if you wish, i really do not care:) ). There have only been a few games I have delve into such as i did with Defiance (almost ego 4100) despite the bugs and broken items within the game. I still rather enjoy playing it (I have faith Trion will continue to improve the game and add content).

One of the biggest issues i have had with the game lately can be blamed on two things, changes in game mechanics and the players themselves.

The mechanics of getting shared credit for contracts should have never been placed within this 'co-op' game. They removed co-op from the game doing so (I know, this has been discussed countless times). Now you have to be sure you tag everything possible or else risk getting nothing for performing an action (be it a co-op or mission in the open world). Its not to hard to re-run whatever it is to get the contract requirements but this should have never happened.

Now whenever you do contract work you are dealing with a ton of others doing the same thing.. Sure some of them realize there are others there and will tag the targets too so others can get credit as well but allot of times this just does not happen.

Often people will rush in, kill whatever it is that needs killed and leave and not even complete the event (allot of them will exit the instance just to join another to complete their contract work as fast as possible)

Trion should change the game mechanics to require you to fully complete an event before you get credit for the contract kills. This hurts most with coop maps. When a contract requires you to kill xxx in a coop map allot of people will just exit the instance once they get what they need (a good example is Scrapworks where you must kill Dark Matter, i was trying to complete that contract the other day and every instance I joined someone jumped the fence or I started half way through the event because the ones that finished their kills leaved the instance and i was thrown in the scrapper part of the event).

The youth of today just do not make any sense to me. Even my own kids behave like this. Every one is so rush rush rush, got to get as much as I can as fast as I can, forget about everybody else. I enjoy playing the missions, i never leave once my contract is met. I enjoy running through an entire coop map (contract or not). I have never left a coop map once, i complete it and enjoy them. If I am not going as fast as you wish and want me to skip over portions of the map so you may farm keys faster, then YOU should leave the instance and do this with friends.

I suspect that allot that are complaining about the grind and there being nothing to do that a good majority of them rushed and found every shortcut they could to get keys, get ego, etc as fast as they could. Its no wonder they dont enjoy the game.

Ok Rant over..

Cool story bro about the history lesson in your gaming repertoire, needless to say it doesn't validate your opinion. Moving on.. Cool me too, I love this game even though it has issues, although once I finish up my last two achievements i'll be taking a break until the DLC rolls out. Probably still pop in from time to time in order to do new weekly content.

Yep it was stupid to remove shared updates during Co-ops, really stupid. I can understand in non groups making it that way but if I'm in a group doing a co-op and someone kills an enemy why shouldn't the whole group get an update for it?

I don't agree with forcing you to finish to get credit, the co-ops are boring especially after you've done them all 30 times, it gets even worse when you have Mr. I want to stop and check every single corner or wait until we reach the boss portal then go run around looking for data recorders. I want to get in and get out, sure I don't leave them very often, but I want the option to leave at any point in time no matter what.

As for rushing, I don't understand it either, it's just the nature of the beast, people see grindy content and want to finish it. Everything in this game is a grind, Xp, contracts, scrip, ark salvage, faction, key codes. It's human nature to grind these things, typically as fast as you possibly can.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 06:47 PM
My only issue with this game in content, I love the idea, I love the mechanics, I just wish it was more social and had more content. As I have repeatedly said, if we are to measure level in EGO, give me enough content to reach that max EGO. Drive here kill the same stuff, dive there kill the same stuff has just got old. As for co-ops, I don't mind repeating them, they are fun. This game is a huge grind and that I don't like. I understand the idea behind grind, but it is usually to obtain something other than leveling, at least in the games I like to play. I too am an older gamer, remember saving up that $99 (which was a crap load of money back then) to to buy my first 2600 back in the day, but the grind may prove too much for me here, hopefully they will address it.

As far as patience goes, I have 6 kids, I ooze patience, so the fact that this game is trying my patience says something.

LOL, 6 kids :) I have 4, but i completely understand.

And yes I pretty much agree with all you said above. The game needs better social tools, better ways to team up. Maybe that will address the issues that "I" have. And definitely a better reward for the grind, which i wouldn't mind so much if it existed.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 06:56 PM
I don't agree with forcing you to finish to get credit, the co-ops are boring especially after you've done them all 30 times, it gets even worse when you have Mr. I want to stop and check every single corner or wait until we reach the boss portal then go run around looking for data recorders. I want to get in and get out, sure I don't leave them very often, but I want the option to leave at any point in time no matter what.

Fare enough. That is understandable. But do not plop me into an instance that's already beyond a certain point where I have no chance of fulfilling a contract even partially. Start a new instance:)

RealHoosier07
05-18-2013, 07:01 PM
Agreed. Great post.

pamoth
05-18-2013, 07:01 PM
6 kids? screw that lol, told my girlfriend if she gets pregnant im gone, gaming means more to me than a kid ever will :p

Dooks
05-18-2013, 07:04 PM
6 kids? screw that lol, told my girlfriend if she gets pregnant im gone, gaming means more to me than a kid ever will :p

Did for me too, til I had the first one lol, now the youngest is still at home and we frag the **** out of stuff together :)

Avril Parker
05-18-2013, 07:11 PM
Having people that rush through the content available you'll find with every MMO out there.
They're usually the ones that complain first that there's no "endgame"-content as they've "beaten the game" within weeks or even just days.
It's the kind of gamers that won't even watch the cutscenes the first time, nor reading the instructions to the Missions or listening to the recordings you find throughout the game.
It's the same type of player that's using external sources to find all the recorders, hidden spots (in various other games), looking up solutions to puzzles (also with other games) and so on...
Can't change that fact, so one will have to live with it.

Sure there's much left out in Defiance that'd add greatly to more content being available as the regular missions right now, which are basically all of the same type, go somewhere and tag something with your EGO-device. Along with the very repetative Arkfalls.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 07:13 PM
6 kids? screw that lol, told my girlfriend if she gets pregnant im gone, gaming means more to me than a kid ever will :p

Well my kids are all but grown up and out of the house or on the way out so I have plenty of gaming time :) Doesn't hurt i work from home either :)

Hiroller
05-18-2013, 07:14 PM
I want to start off by stating that I am an older gamer, I have been playing video games since back when Atari and other systems came out. I was playing PC games back on the very first PC's introduced for public consumption. So you could say that I have been into gaming a little while.

Secondly I would like to say that I absolutely love this game (call me a Fanboy if you wish, i really do not care:) ). There have only been a few games I have delve into such as i did with Defiance (almost ego 4100) despite the bugs and broken items within the game. I still rather enjoy playing it (I have faith Trion will continue to improve the game and add content).

One of the biggest issues i have had with the game lately can be blamed on two things, changes in game mechanics and the players themselves.

The mechanics of getting shared credit for contracts should have never been placed within this 'co-op' game. They removed co-op from the game doing so (I know, this has been discussed countless times). Now you have to be sure you tag everything possible or else risk getting nothing for performing an action (be it a co-op or mission in the open world). Its not to hard to re-run whatever it is to get the contract requirements but this should have never happened.

Now whenever you do contract work you are dealing with a ton of others doing the same thing.. Sure some of them realize there are others there and will tag the targets too so others can get credit as well but allot of times this just does not happen.

Often people will rush in, kill whatever it is that needs killed and leave and not even complete the event (allot of them will exit the instance just to join another to complete their contract work as fast as possible)

Trion should change the game mechanics to require you to fully complete an event before you get credit for the contract kills. This hurts most with coop maps. When a contract requires you to kill xxx in a coop map allot of people will just exit the instance once they get what they need (a good example is Scrapworks where you must kill Dark Matter, i was trying to complete that contract the other day and every instance I joined someone jumped the fence or I started half way through the event because the ones that finished their kills leaved the instance and i was thrown in the scrapper part of the event).

The youth of today just do not make any sense to me. Even my own kids behave like this. Every one is so rush rush rush, got to get as much as I can as fast as I can, forget about everybody else. I enjoy playing the missions, i never leave once my contract is met. I enjoy running through an entire coop map (contract or not). I have never left a coop map once, i complete it and enjoy them. If I am not going as fast as you wish and want me to skip over portions of the map so you may farm keys faster, then YOU should leave the instance and do this with friends.

I suspect that allot that are complaining about the grind and there being nothing to do that a good majority of them rushed and found every shortcut they could to get keys, get ego, etc as fast as they could. Its no wonder they dont enjoy the game.

Ok Rant over..

So..

You self proclaim yourself as a white knight, drop a wall of complaints about this game and your kids. Then you fixate on one thing concerned customers complian about out of at least 20 issues. Is that about right?

chrismeyer34
05-18-2013, 07:19 PM
LOL, 6 kids :) I have 4, but i completely understand.

And yes I pretty much agree with all you said above. The game needs better social tools, better ways to team up. Maybe that will address the issues that "I" have. And definitely a better reward for the grind, which i wouldn't mind so much if it existed.

yeah i got 2, both are 8 and 10 and they love the hell out of this game, a lot of times they cant wait to get home from school to watch me and their mom jam out on this lmao...she's in the game room and im usually in the living room on the big screen, they get a kick out of the co ops more than the arkfalls cuz they get frustrated with all the nascar wannabe's driving in circles around the crystals lol...and yeah i do agree the rewards should be a lot better, definitely should give a legendary or something, not the usual some ol same ol...never been the 1 to rush through a co op czu i get 5 keys from every co op, so i just make sure that everyone has recorders and whatnot and to make sure everyone makes it to the end ok, dont really care if i rank 1st on the leaderboards afterwards cuz i think its more important to be a team player

1 thing i can say i do is, if i see a group of people blazing through and 1 other player lagging behind cuz theyre trying to find a recorder or something, if those other players get downed, ill leave em there while ill go and help the other player find their recorder cuz on 6-7 maps i know where all the recorders are by heart, most players just need to be attentive of the fact that not all players have all recorders or pursuits completed in a particular map, i have 7-7 maps completed but id rather help others rather than blaze through a map and sell them short from completing whatever they need for that map just cuz i want to farm keys or whatever cuz im getting 5 keys when its over anyway so i just as might as well help others in the process and i have just as much fun talking and hanging out with the other players...its a win-win for me, dont know about other people but thats how it is for me at least lol

FantasyMeister
05-18-2013, 07:29 PM
I read the first post and got the impression it's mostly about consideration for others rather than anything else, e.g. if you're doing Diablo Refinery tag those 15 Blast Pods rather than try to wipe them out as quickly as possible before anyone else gets to them, if you're in a co-op instance ask if anyone needs help with their relevant pursuits rather than focus on your own needs, and so on.

It's about "do unto others as you would have them do to you" and "pay it forward", both incredibly important foundations for the way I live my life personally, and part of my general philosophy of 'being nice'. The fact that Trion changed a few mechanics that brought out the worst in others hasn't changed me, I still find workarounds that enable me to continue to be nice under the harsher conditions.

However, as a counterpoint, it takes all sorts to make the world, and another philosophy people live by is live and left live. We have to appreciate that other gamers play differently to us, have different drives and needs, and that we'll meet them in an MMO quite often.

The solution, as always, is band together with like-minded people, make your voice heard in the hope that things will change for the better from your perspective, and carry on enjoying what you're doing.

OP is doing it right.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 07:31 PM
@chrismeyer34 - Thats very cool that your wife plays and kids love it. Also you sound like you play allot like I do. I try to help whenever I can although sometimes im sure i just get in the way :)

@Hiroller - I have no clue what your talking about but ok, thanks for your contribution.

@FantasyMeister - Exactly

chrismeyer34
05-18-2013, 07:45 PM
I read the first post and got the impression it's mostly about consideration for others rather than anything else, e.g. if you're doing Diablo Refinery tag those 15 Blast Pods rather than try to wipe them out as quickly as possible before anyone else gets to them, if you're in a co-op instance ask if anyone needs help with their relevant pursuits rather than focus on your own needs, and so on.

It's about "do unto others as you would have them do to you" and "pay it forward", both incredibly important foundations for the way I live my life personally, and part of my general philosophy of 'being nice'. The fact that Trion changed a few mechanics that brought out the worst in others hasn't changed me, I still find workarounds that enable me to continue to be nice under the harsher conditions.

However, as a counterpoint, it takes all sorts to make the world, and another philosophy people live by is live and left live. We have to appreciate that other gamers play differently to us, have different drives and needs, and that we'll meet them in an MMO quite often.

The solution, as always, is band together with like-minded people, make your voice heard in the hope that things will change for the better from your perspective, and carry on enjoying what you're doing.

OP is doing it right.

i agree, sometimes i tend to get over zealous with those damn blast pods, usually 2-3 shots can kill someone instantly so i tend to get personal when 1 takes out a group mate lol...the way i see it, when youre in a group with me, youre a friend and im gonna watch your back as best as i can, even if i dont add you or whatever, im still gonna look out for you and the other guys, its the way ive always played lol

KeevanSixx
05-18-2013, 10:06 PM
for the most part Op, i agree. but i have to say that we live in a very interesting little world with a lot of different playstyles existing therin.
I can relate, to a point...i'm an old fart myself with 2 kids, a house, and a full time job.....i play when i am able to, come on here to get the latest info about the game. (tips, quips, humor, ect.) and tend to take the long slow path in any game i play.

I still feel that the dev team could have implemented a few things differently than they did....for example.

keycodes: it was nice to get them in almost everything we did, be it arkfalls or emergencies, it gave a purpose to mindlessly grinding those instances over and over. the decision to nerf keycodes felt like knee-jerk reactions to a couple of robotesqe players grinding over 900 k-codes in the span of a few hours. I still feel that a better solution would have been to initiate key caps across the entire player base than to nerf them outright. instead of unlimited keys one could farm daily, they should have implemented a reasonable daily number at the onset, allowing everyone to benifit in the long run. It is still possible for them to remedy this.

I think the singular thing (just my personal opinion, mind you), in all the broken items on the list, for right now, would be the dev team to fix the smeggin' chat, voice chat, and chat UI. I know it sound trivial....true....but would aleviate a bit of the player frustration in the short term, smooth out the playerbase a tiny bit, and mellow some harsh. sure, I know there are bigger concerns that really really need addressing, but this one small measure would reassaure the group that trion is working on it.....it's psychological value, the ability to communicate to others in game efficently and quickly, has no price.

griefing: sorry, it can't be helped...it's in almost every game where there is a playerbase and delves into individual motivations to do so. that falls to an individuals sense of honor and fairplay, and is a fair indication of society at an individual level....not good at the moment....i blame the sugar.

Fantasymiester got it right.....play with like minded people. It's tough, i know, but still possible....the world has yet to be totally filled with selfish prats yet....keep the faith!

Orge Lambart
05-18-2013, 10:34 PM
Fare enough. That is understandable. But do not plop me into an instance that's already beyond a certain point where I have no chance of fulfilling a contract even partially. Start a new instance:)

i'm all for that, I've been saying since the start they should give people the option to start their own co-ops so you can start from the beginning, it was really rough when 90% of them were glitched up and you had to leave and research for a new one. Now at least the co-ops are more stable, but I still think they should have the option to start a new instance instead of just being plopped into an already running one. Still leave that option, but give people the toggle option to start their own.

ItISLupus
05-18-2013, 11:15 PM
I read your ramblings. I thought I was pretty gracious with my response. It was short and to the point. Your projecting, pal. Don't get all angry when people point it out. There isn't much substance to your thread anyway. You assume things about people you have no idea and present it as fact when in reality those "youth" are more likely adults constrained for time than kids who have significantly more time to fart around with boring tedious stuff. Yes, every single one of the cooperative instances is tedious and boring.

I partially agree with you here. The "youth" the OP talks about is more likely the 20 something demographic. That's about as ar as my agreement goes.

As for instances being tedious and boring, that's how they are. I've played, Requiem: Momento Mori, 2moons, Almost all of the MMO's in the Phantasy Star universe.. With the exception of the phantasy star series(which didn't have instances really. everything was an instance) Other than farming for my armor set pieces I had no desire to do them.

AngryFire
05-18-2013, 11:51 PM
I partially agree with you here. The "youth" the OP talks about is more likely the 20 something demographic. That's about as ar as my agreement goes.

Perhaps I chose my words inappropriately and misspoke. For that I do apologize. Maybe I should have just said that people today are all in a hurry and left it at that. Because for the most part, they are.

It was just a bad day yesterday, people non stop rushing and moaning because you were not playing 'their way'. Lord forbid you actually try to help someone who is working on a pursuit.

Wtflag
05-19-2013, 03:20 AM
I read the first post and got the impression it's mostly about consideration for others rather than anything else, e.g. if you're doing Diablo Refinery tag those 15 Blast Pods rather than try to wipe them out as quickly as possible before anyone else gets to them, if you're in a co-op instance ask if anyone needs help with their relevant pursuits rather than focus on your own needs, and so on.

It's about "do unto others as you would have them do to you" and "pay it forward", both incredibly important foundations for the way I live my life personally, and part of my general philosophy of 'being nice'. The fact that Trion changed a few mechanics that brought out the worst in others hasn't changed me, I still find workarounds that enable me to continue to be nice under the harsher conditions.

However, as a counterpoint, it takes all sorts to make the world, and another philosophy people live by is live and left live. We have to appreciate that other gamers play differently to us, have different drives and needs, and that we'll meet them in an MMO quite often.

The solution, as always, is band together with like-minded people, make your voice heard in the hope that things will change for the better from your perspective, and carry on enjoying what you're doing.

OP is doing it right.


Agree. I for one always use a BMG when doing pods or doing future sight contracts.

Anderson
05-19-2013, 04:19 AM
It's the same type of player that's using external sources to find all the recorders, hidden spots (in various other games)

I'm gonna be honest, I agree with most of the stuff you say, but these ****ing "find 100 needles in a gigantic haystack" type things are just the worst kind of pointless grind and I almost always have to just give up and go look it up in the internet for these.

It's just stupid having to comb over every square inch of game just to be SURE that you didn't overlook the hidden flag/pigeon/data recorder the first 50 times you looked in that spot.

Covington
05-19-2013, 04:46 AM
I'm gonna be honest, I agree with most of the stuff you say, but these ****ing "find 100 needles in a gigantic haystack" type things are just the worst kind of pointless grind and I almost always have to just give up and go look it up in the internet for these.

Yep, I gave up looking on my own too and now have my cheating listing with me when we play - I knew that Tablet would come in handy. Now if someone can tell me where the hidden Casti is I would be happy.

Avril Parker
05-19-2013, 05:21 AM
-skip-

Well yes, with the data-recorders in Defiance it's a bit tricky, they're really easy to overlook and they tend to lie around at places you'd usually don't look for anything at all most of the time.

But my reference had been more general as in people looking for the locations of the hidden Jumping-Puzzles in GuildWars2 for example, then using outcourced information to look how to beat the JP they've found. Or people using "the wiki" (as there's usually one for every game out there) to find out how to beat a little riddle that's eventually keeping a door closed. Instead of using their godgiven mind for once as most of those "riddles" are not that hard.
It's the type of players that want to achieve everything with the most less effort, but also the ones that'll tell you the game does not challange them later.

I admit I'm too using an external map for Defiance, just because I've no landmarks named on the map IG, nor can I set own flags on the map to mark and name important spots. But that's about it all for me.

fmarin83
05-19-2013, 06:49 AM
i love the game but how can you say your not a grinder when your at 4000+ ego? At the same time what's helped me the most with this game is my pre-mmo experience (EQ2, SWG, WoW, SWTOR, etc.). They will fix the stuff or lose the clients so its understandable.

Also playstation plus is offering sleeping dogs and probably better games in the future so thats helped me when killing hellbugs gets mundane.

also would like to reference the COD games that are the same repetitive thing every game. Maybe us as Americans have just gotten used to that, and our kids "grind" is the equivilance of what adults do at work. Kids dont have a job, so if they get into something, albeit games,sports, art they just take it as far and fast as they can go.

shadowkin
05-19-2013, 08:15 AM
The whole not getting credit thing blows my mind. One if the worst parts of WoW is the mob tagging and trion just added that to groups....

So stupid...

Chemikz
05-19-2013, 08:57 AM
I read your ramblings. I thought I was pretty gracious with my response. It was short and to the point. Your projecting, pal. Don't get all angry when people point it out. There isn't much substance to your thread anyway. You assume things about people you have no idea and present it as fact when in reality those "youth" are more likely adults constrained for time than kids who have significantly more time to fart around with boring tedious stuff. Yes, every single one of the cooperative instances is tedious and boring.

I've yet to see anything constructive from your posts on this forum since I joined. You quit playing the game like a month ago. I remember that previous avatar you used that said QUIT PLAYING over your character picture. Why do you still post here daily I wonder? *cough* Troll *cough*

Anim
05-19-2013, 09:06 AM
I've yet to see anything constructive from your posts on this forum since I joined. You quit playing the game like a month ago. I remember that previous avatar you used that said QUIT PLAYING over your character picture. Why do you still post here daily I wonder? *cough* Troll *cough*

Why bother posting constructive things if the majority of the people 'defending' the game then choose to ignore it becuase it actually shows how wrong they are for believing everything will be fine if the game continues on its current path?

diggergig
05-19-2013, 09:20 AM
It takes a certain kind of mind-set to continue posting on a forum concerning a game one no longer plays, or is interested in playing in the future.

You are not in their league, OP, nor, I suspect, would you want to be.

Badblade
05-19-2013, 09:22 AM
Troll #2 Present. Thanks for your feedback.

Jeez... Are we just calling anybody who disagrees, a troll?

You may not like to hear it or refuse to believe it because you are still enjoying the game, but defiance has some serious issues. I'm not going to restate it all here (feel free to read the thousands of complaints and posts from the past month), but I can spit out a 10 point list of problems just as an appetizer. I could get carpel tunnel doing a full review of the failings.

Nothing seems to be getting any attention. And now staff cuts. Good grief.

Last night I threw in Borderlands 2 simply because I was in the mood for some post apocalyptic shooting. Call me crazy, but why didn't I reach for defiance? Playing BL2, I found it appalling that Defiance is so rough around the edges. Where is the polish? And what's sad, is that I didn't miss the "social component" of Defiance at all. The characters and dialogue in BL2 is crisp, funny and generally well voiced. In Defiance all you get are players silently running around doing their thing, and endless fetch missions. Painfully one dimensional.

I really wanted Defiance to kick ***. It hasn't delivered, and here I am already looking for my next game. Poor longevity and lacking content to the point of negligent game development.

(For the record, I still play. I desperately hope for improvement. I just wish I wanted to load up defiance more than I do, rather than scan through old games or check out new releases.)

Badblade
05-19-2013, 09:30 AM
i love the game but how can you say your not a grinder when your at 4000+ ego? At the same time what's helped me the most with this game is my pre-mmo experience (EQ2, SWG, WoW, SWTOR, etc.). They will fix the stuff or lose the clients so its understandable.

Also playstation plus is offering sleeping dogs and probably better games in the future so thats helped me when killing hellbugs gets mundane.

also would like to reference the COD games that are the same repetitive thing every game. Maybe us as Americans have just gotten used to that, and our kids "grind" is the equivilance of what adults do at work. Kids dont have a job, so if they get into something, albeit games,sports, art they just take it as far and fast as they can go.

Quick comment: I feel that PVP is a different animal. I don't think it can be lumped in as "grinding". It is repetitive in the same way that baseball, or paintball, or any sport is. It's lure is the fact that you are up against other people like you. No AI. And if a game does PVP well, the game can cash in on some amazing longevity. I played Bad Company 2 for over a year. Played the bejesus out of it. If defiance can't show us a quality single player experience, it is a long way off from showing us a quality PVP experience. 2 small maps. Weapon imbalance. Terrible.

Michael Ching
05-19-2013, 09:51 AM
Let me date myself by saying Logo the Turtle. Age has nothing to do with it.

Now the original OP says you can re-run it but how many of us want to re-run the same thing 3 or 4 times? I call this a grind after doing the same scenario over and over again as some of us have already have. That being said I maxed out both Bolt Action Sniper Rifles and Semi Auto Sniper Rifles a while ago (and that felt less of a grind to me).

Oh and on the subject of rushing I have replayed the game 3 times (what is the point of killing Nim for the 4th time?), majority of my faction rep is Trusted (so you can figure out how many times I have ran dailies). The game needs more content.

AngryFire
05-19-2013, 10:13 AM
@Badblade

No, not exactly. I do realize that Defiance has issues and to some players issues which break the game for them. Not once did i deny this or say otherwise. I am simply a player that can enjoy a game despite the many issues it has and for me I really have not hit any game breaking issues which ruin the experience. Its a fun game. I do hope they eventually fix things but if not, i feel i got my monies worth out of it.

@fmarin83

I do not recall ever saying I do not grind. Its an MMO, that's what you do. I did a ton of grinding but not once did i complain about it. When I get tired of it, i will leave or take a break:)

@Michael Ching

More content a must!!!

Quiet
05-19-2013, 10:18 AM
Old, long term gamer here (also). Long grind is pretty normal, but it is usually backed up with some reward or requirement (example EQ and raids - ugh that was painful) There are other less level based games where leveling up really isn't hard or long. This one seems to incorporate the painful part without the reason for it.

Credit - Just giving folks in groups credit for anything in groups would go a LONG way to fixing the credit system. At the least - co-ops would work. It would still leave places like Diablo messed up, but folks would learn to do/accept invites.

The chat box is way too small, too out of the way. I almost never notice someone has said anything, and I see others are the same way. Hard to have a social game when the only social is watching what someone is shooting at.

(FYI - I have just over 2K ego - so grinding yes - but so far not insane) As far as credit for co-ops (leaving early) there is no system that really works on that except not splitting up instances into "useful" and "non-useful" sections. Also, instances half done should expire and go away (faster). And don't get me started on broken instances - there should be some way to verify that the hulker isn't spawning in the 101 explosions room but everyone is waiting for him.

The bugs are my biggest concern. Resetting counts are deadly. The roller over level is deadly.

No reward in Major Arkfalls for trying compared to not trying. (And they worry about people getting credit without doing damage, but only one mob gives full credit for MAF?)

Who cares about credit - leveling in the game gives very little, so don't bother pretending it is hard.

PVP - I suck at PVP. Let me say that again - I suck. However, I am passable in other PvP games. I could use one of the "OP" builds, and not using them clearly hinders me (It is like driving a race with blind-folds on - not good if you are a professional) But... I don't view it as important - which is why I suck.