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Sandman UK
06-10-2013, 03:03 AM
This game was released a year too early. I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go. Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister company

How far away from the truth can I be. Communication from them has been pee poor to say the least although they did try for a day or two

I will gladly walk away from this game if I can get a refund on the DLC pack I have brought in advance. The way its been going we will be lucky to see any and when we do I can safely say it will be bugged to hell guaranteed

Please offer us a refund on DLC subscribers or even credits towards Rift store and I am out of here with a hard lesson learned

But guess this will go unread like so many other posts

reeno32
06-10-2013, 03:06 AM
You´re so right dude....

Fiox
06-10-2013, 03:39 AM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers

Blondin
06-10-2013, 04:21 AM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers
Sum it up :)

Covington
06-10-2013, 04:25 AM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers

I just did a double take a million threads about whining about wanting DLC and this one wants to give it back... Kids today man.....

I wonder how many of them have any job that has deadlines, and time limits, and creative input - do they understand how much time it takes to do something and that everything isn't poofed out of thin air?

There are REAL problems with Trion and the game, legitimate ones - DLC will only make it worse if it is released before the problems are fixed. This takes time.

Sigh so tired of it.

Fiox
06-10-2013, 04:30 AM
They most likely don't lol

Jac
06-10-2013, 04:55 AM
I don't know if it is me getting older, but I'm finding it kind of fascinating watching the game getting smoothed out. Almost like a gardener sculpting the landscape. Sure it's a flawed game but it's definately better than some games I've bought for the same price. Like the last wolfenstein game, certain points of gta had fatal bugs that never let you progress no matter what you did. Anyway it's being sorted so time will tell. Patience is a virtue so they say, sadly lacking in today's gimme gimme society

ralisti
06-10-2013, 05:35 AM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers

Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

Fiox
06-10-2013, 05:57 AM
Their not walking over us have you ever coded a mmo across 3 platforms at once I'm sure you haven't so unless you have a slight idea as to what goes into fixing all the bugs your whining about do yourself a favor and shutup you will look less foolish. That game in alpha thing your talking about you wanna see that go look up war z that was truly a broken *** game that had a cash shop and you had to buy the game too.

Covington
06-10-2013, 05:59 AM
For those of us who played in Beta/Alpha I can assure you this is no where near Alpha.

Enundr
06-10-2013, 06:13 AM
I just did a double take a million threads about whining about wanting DLC and this one wants to give it back... Kids today man.....

I wonder how many of them have any job that has deadlines, and time limits, and creative input - do they understand how much time it takes to do something and that everything isn't poofed out of thin air?

There are REAL problems with Trion and the game, legitimate ones - DLC will only make it worse if it is released before the problems are fixed. This takes time.

Sigh so tired of it.

its funny you say this about deadlines , with next gen around the corner it would have been a smarter choice in delaying it for next gen , save some grief , and plenty of time to do LOTS of testing and polishing. instead its as it is right now and its sad.

Sandman UK
06-10-2013, 06:20 AM
Lol some of the fan boys response do make me laugh out loud

Just for them I'm a 46 year old manager of 300 people and my hobbies are online gaming with 30+ years of computer gaming under my belt.

I know a **** game thats flawed in so many ways. If I wanted a shoot um up thats free and well made I can play Americas Army or other good shooters. This game claims to me an mmo yet it always feels like I'm playing alone even though I have 22 members in the clan due to pee poor communications ingame. Their fix for it lol turn it off.

Oh hold on I am playing on my own silly me they not logged on for over 70 days stupid me thinking it was the game

So we wait patiently for new content. New contract find 3 tape recorders we have place right next to fast travel point. Guess theres an achieve to complete the episode in under 35 secs

Oh Sieges here we go some new..... Um looks like the same.... just more stuff coming at you.... Hold on im here but the areas empty thats strange the map shows its here... Hmmm maybe I just wait till clock counts down and disappears.....hmmm maybe I could ask the social side of game....hmmm ok broken.... Well guess its back to some warfront maps....is waterfront on today or off. Bah lets go watch some paint dry


Once you peal back the flimsy layer of gaming wallpaper theres a whole wall of cracks that need totally re plastering

All I'm asking for is a refund on something I haven't received yet and my hearts not in it to wait for something decent to come out of it

Lowlif3r
06-10-2013, 06:21 AM
Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

If it was a finished product when it hit the shelves, we wouldn't have this: http://www.ikeahackers.net/ The future is all about mods and sidegrades. Now, stop walking over Trion for doing things other companies don't have the balls to do (Movie/Game Cross) and come up with some great ideas on how to do it better. Bugs just get run over like Skitterlings in an Arkf... ok, on the road.

I'll start: Change the loot system radically. No more lockboxes. Vendors only sell greens. All Purple and Orange is now Random Drops. You now have a PvE Endgame, like the one in Diablo 2 which keeps people entertained. Oh, and make a Dodge Mod Shop for the Cars. Let's customize that ride. Sell a few exclusive paint jobs by profiessionals in the Defiance Store. And fix the Chat System. Always show "Last 3 Messages" on the screen.

Enundr
06-10-2013, 06:34 AM
If it was a finished product when it hit the shelves, we wouldn't have this: http://www.ikeahackers.net/ The future is all about mods and sidegrades. Now, stop walking over Trion for doing things other companies don't have the balls to do (Movie/Game Cross) and come up with some great ideas on how to do it better. Bugs just get run over like Skitterlings in an Arkf... ok, on the road.

I'll start: Change the loot system radically. No more lockboxes. Vendors only sell greens. All Purple and Orange is now Random Drops. You now have a PvE Endgame, like the one in Diablo 2 which keeps people entertained. Oh, and make a Dodge Mod Shop for the Cars. Let's customize that ride. Sell a few exclusive paint jobs by profiessionals in the Defiance Store. And fix the Chat System. Always show "Last 3 Messages" on the screen.
in order to add that kind of stuff , the rest right now has to be fixed and stay fixed XD and yes i play mmos alot and not many stay this broken that often.

Covington
06-10-2013, 06:38 AM
its funny you say this about deadlines , with next gen around the corner it would have been a smarter choice in delaying it for next gen , save some grief , and plenty of time to do LOTS of testing and polishing. instead its as it is right now and its sad.

True they could have waited, but with the less than happy response with Xbox1 I don't think - and probably they too - it will go over big in the gaming community.

I have no intention of buying a new PS4 right now I don't care what it does I don't need it. They won't abandon the current consoles for the next gen (that would be a death nail) they would have to give it a good year or two before they would change over completely.

The show, which is financing the game is in power here for deadlines. They should have listened to us in testing better - some of those bugs are STILL there and it's frustrating.

Adrena Chrome
06-10-2013, 06:41 AM
Yes! They feed the sheeple shtako and tell them it's manna from heaven and they eat it up. Trion is a multi-million dollar corporation. They don't do anything without permission from the top brass. And the top brass says feed them crap and charge them top dollar!! It's still better than fable!! Haha haha(deep laugh) Given the game concept is better than most. Corporate greed has ruined it and made me sick...



Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

Enundr
06-10-2013, 06:46 AM
True they could have waited, but with the less than happy response with Xbox1 I don't think - and probably they too - it will go over big in the gaming community.

I have no intention of buying a new PS4 right now I don't care what it does I don't need it. They won't abandon the current consoles for the next gen (that would be a death nail) they would have to give it a good year or two before they would change over completely.

The show, which is financing the game is in power here for deadlines. They should have listened to us in testing better - some of those bugs are STILL there and it's frustrating.

actually i believe i saw a post saying theyve said defiance will be coming to xbox 1 (and by default PS4 as well?) i didnt particularly waste time reading it , but when this game first came out so close to next gens release and expected it to be a mmo setting it would want longevity , and considering xbox live would most likely be moved to XBox 1 and same with the PSN to PS4 , 360 and ps3 no longer have access to the internet i guess , how xbox orginally did?

Lorenzo
06-10-2013, 06:48 AM
Their not walking over us have you ever coded a mmo across 3 platforms at once I'm sure you haven't so unless you have a slight idea as to what goes into fixing all the bugs your whining about do yourself a favor and shutup you will look less foolish. That game in alpha thing your talking about you wanna see that go look up war z that was truly a broken *** game that had a cash shop and you had to buy the game too.

Well your comment make no sense, if i went to a shop and it's busy and they accepted me i want to be served properly cause i payed for the service. If trion was not confident of not pulling this off on 3 platforms they should have sicked to only one.

SoulChaserJ
06-10-2013, 06:50 AM
Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

While I generally agree with you, I don't see many issues with this game outside of clipping on occasion, and most certainly bugged arkfalls/missions.

FattyMcG33
06-10-2013, 06:53 AM
actually i believe i saw a post saying theyve said defiance will be coming to xbox 1 (and by default PS4 as well?) i didnt particularly waste time reading it , but when this game first came out so close to next gens release and expected it to be a mmo setting it would want longevity , and considering xbox live would most likely be moved to XBox 1 and same with the PSN to PS4 , 360 and ps3 no longer have access to the internet i guess , how xbox orginally did?

2 points to make here. Obviously, OP hasn't had much MMO launch experience. Rift was an anomaly, usually an MMO will have many more issues than that launch. That was probably the best launch I've seen. If you look at games like WoW, the original launch had issues for a good 6 months. And every expansion has had it's own set of issues. Yes, Defiance has issues, but as another poster pointed out, it's been developed for 3 platforms, and on this scale it's no easy task, and takes time to fix the bugs.

As for the quote above, I believe that the original xbox live was still available for a good year or 2 after the 360 came out. So I don't think there will be much issue with connecting on current gen hardware for a while after the Xbone comes out.

Chump Norris
06-10-2013, 06:54 AM
Seems like you guys should have stuck with a PC exclusive MMO.

Sandman UK
06-10-2013, 07:18 AM
2 points to make here. Obviously, OP hasn't had much MMO launch experience. Rift was an anomaly, usually and MMO will have many more issues than that launch. That was probably the best launch I've seen. If you look at games like WoW, the original launch had issues for a good 6 months. And every expansion has had it's own set of issues. Yes, Defiance has issues, but as another poster pointed out, it's been developed for 3 platforms, and on this scale it's no easy task, and takes time to fix the bugs.

As for the quote above, I believe that the original xbox live was still available for a good year or 2 after the 360 came out. So I don't think there will be much issue with connecting on current gen hardware for a while after the Xbone comes out.

I have had plenty of launch experience old and new

Age of Conan. Archeage, Guild Wars, Secret World, Guild Wars 2. Diablo 3

All had massive issues upon release. But how long has defiance been going now 8 weeks and I can not really put my hand on any relevant fixes that actually shouldn't have been there in the first place that required fixing. Im surprised its been only 8 weeks since launch. Its dragged so long it feels like years

Im not even convinced the tv show will last even thats getting bland and the same thing every week

Arrielle Shaw
06-10-2013, 07:35 AM
Syfy already inked Defiance to a second season halfway through the first season, and I fail to see the repetitive nature you think the show has. The story has already had some interesting plot turns, and the acting talent is superb. Defiance is quickly becoming my favorite show to watch. Anyway, if you want a repetitive show, look at the first 5 or 6 seasons of Burn Notice. However, I still enjoy Burn Notice because Jeffery Donovan does great as Michael Westen, and Bruce Campbell is a riot.

Kronik
06-10-2013, 07:47 AM
You want repetitive syfy shows try wwe or any reality show on their network, yay lets stumble around in the dark and scare ourselves...

Defiance is a huge step up from what syfy has become.

alred
06-10-2013, 08:06 AM
For those of us who played in Beta/Alpha I can assure you this is no where near Alpha.
No where near beta even. This is a much better game then even launch.

Badmood
06-10-2013, 08:42 AM
Ok if you really really wanted you scrip back from Trion you should either be emailing or calling customer support not posting here.
I know this regardless of how you feel about trion or this or any other game or company customer support if contacted will usually do what they need to satisfy you even if that means a refund.

So if your not simply looking for attention and really want to get a refund your in the wrong place to get any satisfaction at all.

divaldo
06-10-2013, 08:44 AM
If you read on any season pass does state no refunds

Valanga
06-10-2013, 03:44 PM
I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go.

You haven't played many games, have you?

Maixx
06-10-2013, 04:05 PM
I've seen so many games over the past few years that were broken on release day, it seems to be a new low standard to release then fix.
I enjoy this game, yeah it has bugs, but I just deal with them.

This argument of keeping it in development is moot now, it is pointless to say what should have done. What is important is what is being done, and Trion has been releasing fixes for the bugs a couple times a week.

Snowgoons
06-10-2013, 04:19 PM
This game was released a year too early. I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go. Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister company

How far away from the truth can I be. Communication from them has been pee poor to say the least although they did try for a day or two

I will gladly walk away from this game if I can get a refund on the DLC pack I have brought in advance. The way its been going we will be lucky to see any and when we do I can safely say it will be bugged to hell guaranteed

Please offer us a refund on DLC subscribers or even credits towards Rift store and I am out of here with a hard lesson learned

But guess this will go unread like so many other posts

Completely agreed. As someone who wasted $100 (was able to trade the game in and get Animal Crossing New Leaf free :)) I feel your pain.

There is absolutely no excuse for how this game has ended up. People defending them saying give them a chance = the generation I hate.

The generation that will just take a sub par not even in the same ballpark as advertised game and still play it and support the company while they "patch it" while hanging on to your money.

Pull a Final Fantasy XIV, fix the game for as long as it needs then give everyone that bought 1.0 Version 2.0 free.

Also, next time know how to make your own video game. Audio clipping present in beta, still present at launch was the first signs that Trion had absolutely no idea what they were doing when it comes to coding this game.

The people also saying give them a chance act like this company did not put out a full fleshed out MMORPG.

Even though diablo 3 is trash, it still "works" imagine Blizzard having WoW, SC1&2, Diablo 1&2, all their other games including the console The Lost Vikings etc etc etc, then all of a sudden dropping Diablo 3 and the audio is clipping, items are getting deleted.

Trion either bought Rift or hired a bunch of rookies for Defiance and didn't take it seriously.

I'm done "sugar coating" the truth. This game was a complete failure, and not because of "small issues" like some here on the forums would like to lick Trion and tell you.

This game failed because of:

1. Salvage matrix deleting items.
2. Xbox downtime at launch for a week.
3. Clipping sound.
4. PC Hackers.
5. Constant menu UI lag.
6. Lockboxes not giving you anything.
7. Quest not completing to the point where you have to call in to get them to complete it for you.
8. Stutter bug.
9. Lack of content.
10. Lack of tie in content.
11. Lack of anything related to the game in the first season of the show.

Let's see...

12. Lack of enemy types.
13. Watered down Borderlands "99ers"
14. Lack of pvp innovation.
15. Taking forever to do anything about obvious shotgun imbalance in pvp.
16. Lack of a town hub or anything to actually meet in.
17. Introducing 10000 zombies without a town hub or anything for them to actually have come from.
18. Having 99% the same content as the beta.
19. Lack of variety regarding Arkfalls
20. Allowing people to kill the small bugs that open up weak spots during arkfalls, so that said arkfall takes forever.
21. Not being able to get into co-ops with your friends a lot of the time. (group breaks up everyone ends up elsewhere or not in)
22. Lack of equipment slots, seriously 2 guns a nade and a shield, how long was that supposed to keep the "MMO" side of things rolling?

I am sure someone could come in here and fill out 22-100.

Game = Failure.

NightfallRob
06-10-2013, 11:17 PM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers

I like the game and think it has potential but it was rushed. I pity this generation of gamers too, so many of you seem to think it's ok to be provided with a faulty product and then have the company piss down your back and tell you its raining while simultaneously selling you DLC.
I like Trion as a company, they did great work with Rift and the customer service and communication between Trion and Rift players has been excellent. But this game has been incredibly poorly implemented and does not appear to be improving. It's missing important features, the game is extremely unstable, and the engine appears to be deeply flawed. Whatever experiment Trion has tried with cross-platform development is not working well. This game's release date should have been pushed back at least until it could play well across all three platforms, its multiplayer options were all working reliably, and it had a decent chat system. Asking for the base components of a working MMO to be in place prior to selling an MMO is not asking for too much.

wtfdidibuyseasonpassfor
06-10-2013, 11:24 PM
im right there with you. They need to go learn from Sony and DC universe to learn how to make a game with replay ability and variety in their missions. Really? how many times am I going to run through the same bunker?

wtfdidibuyseasonpassfor
06-10-2013, 11:39 PM
I couldn't agree more. They didn't sell the game at half price, why should I be happy with a half working game? I understand bugs and issues with this big of a project, but we are on what patch now 21? I've never been given 21 chances to get my work done right. I applaud the effort, and it had some really good potential, but so far Trion has failed to deliver a full functioning product. That is unacceptable in any profession where payment has been collected.

Strontium Dog
06-11-2013, 01:32 AM
Their not walking over us have you ever coded a mmo across 3 platforms at once

While i don't agree with the OP, he does have a point. Stating the above is like buying a car and expecting shtako because they produced a Petrol,Diesel and Hybrid version.

So what if they are coding for three consoles, who cares if they hired wrong folk for the job. A product was bought, the buyer has the right to expect some level of competency.

Saying give it time is a total mmo cop out used time and time again.Accusing the *kids* of impatience is funny because its us old uns that used to expect things we bought to work.*kids* nowadays expect patch after patch. In the Atari/Amiga days games came out and that was that,no patch frenzy.

Being nice guys sin iirc, having a tv show and giving us boosts is blinding some folk to the fact that Trion are out of their depth and while Defiance will get better, there is sure as hell worse times ahead due to cockups and mismanagement.

Uvirith
06-11-2013, 01:35 AM
This game was released a year too early. I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go. Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister company

If you are a massive RIFT-Fan you surely remember that the game was a buttload of crap the first 6 months? So why dont you give Defiance the same benifit of the doubt?

Strontium Dog
06-11-2013, 03:49 AM
If you are a massive RIFT-Fan you surely remember that the game was a buttload of crap the first 6 months? So why dont you give Defiance the same benifit of the doubt?

It was sure as hell better state than this game sorry. In fact it was, to quote ;


.. awarded Rift "Best PC Persistent World/MMO Game of 2011" calling it, "...the most bug-free and out-of-the-gate high-quality MMO ever created."

So your argument doesn't quite hold water sorry .

Durva360
06-11-2013, 04:05 AM
It was sure as hell better state than this game sorry. In fact it was, to quote ;



So your argument doesn't quite hold water sorry .

Sorry but as soon as I see "IGN" I completely ignore whatever they post.

Imani Hype
06-11-2013, 05:13 AM
Every time i play a new MMO and i read forums, it feels like deja vu all over again. This is nothing new. Anyone who has at least played a couple of MMOs knows what to expect during the initial launch time frame. I've played countless of MMOs and seen it all before. The complaints are the exact same thing in every MMO forums, GW2, SWToR, Rift, DCU, WoW, even SimCity that considers itself an MMO because of online requirement are having problems, the list goes on. The real truth is no MMO has ever had a smooth launch, and no MMO has ever had satisfied players during launch.

MacDeath
06-11-2013, 05:14 AM
This game was released a year too early. I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go. Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister company

How far away from the truth can I be. Communication from them has been pee poor to say the least although they did try for a day or two

I will gladly walk away from this game if I can get a refund on the DLC pack I have brought in advance. The way its been going we will be lucky to see any and when we do I can safely say it will be bugged to hell guaranteed

Please offer us a refund on DLC subscribers or even credits towards Rift store and I am out of here with a hard lesson learned

But guess this will go unread like so many other posts
Sandman, you may indeed have a case for a refund of the DLC, but it all depends who you bought it from. If you bought it direct from Trion, contact Trion CS and explain to them why you want a refund. If you bought it somewhere else, ie from Microsoft with MS Points, you need to contact them. In any case, no matter where you bought it, no one on these forums can authorize a refund.

Here's how to contact Trion CS: https://support.trionworlds.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/478

alienoid
06-11-2013, 05:19 AM
Just to make sure we play the same game, can anyone list me the utterly gamebreaking problems, please ? (on PC that is).

Jac
06-11-2013, 06:47 AM
i keep having to stop to go to work, sleep, eat etc does that count as a game breaking problem?

Gabbro1000
06-11-2013, 07:55 AM
As far as I'm aware, its 5 dlc packs by Christmas. 2 months in, nothing. Not even a hint at the next 6 months. Any estimated due dates from Trion would be nice instead on me coming back here to check for any word of a dlc. I stopped playing 2 weeks ago, my enjoyment for the game has dried up completely and I'm quite sad I wasted 3200 points on this game. But that's me, I did enjoy the game but not anymore.

This game isn't broke, it is bugged rotten, but I disagree more with the people saying 'this generation of gamers are so impatient'. This game has a severe lack of content for an mmo. Monthly content would be nice, because there is no longevitiy in this game. You could play the game for 2 weeks and have just as much chance of killing Nim as you would if you could just run to him straight from the tutorial area. There's no progression, no sustainability and for me that's just not fun.

"SEASON PASS
Join the fight and save big on 5 DLC packs with the Defiance Season Pass. Enjoy a new playable alien species, new weapons and vehicles, missions, and rewards – plus a bonus Hellbug Combat Cap and Lock Box – a 20% savings!* This is the ultimate package for the true Ark Hunter!"

This is the line from the DLC page. I'm not fully aware how the new character will work. Will there be an option to change my characters look or will I have to start from ego 0? If I gotta start from 0, that's just a complete waste of my time. Without any kind of 'class' system, having more than 1 character in this game is completely pointless.

Also the new weapons. White, green, blue or orange, weapons have the same stats. So I can only assume this means a new type altogether. Introducing melee weapons as a new skill system to level up, wicked, I'd start playing again for that. But if its just a new assault rifle and lmg... no thanks.

And the new generation consoles. The only problem in transition I can see is the lack of backwards compatibility will mean the game will still work, characters will still be playable from the same account, but you would HAVE to buy a new version of the game. Again, no thanks. Still not sure if I'll be getting xbox 1 when it comes out, but the pointless-ness of all the features will still out weigh the want to play this game.

I'm all for a refund, but I'll be waiting till Christmas before I even bother looking into it. I can only imagine anything that may gte released will be bugged beyond belief and will take months to fix each time (honestly, I hope I am wrong). But by that time I'll probably have forgotten all about defiance because I'll be to busy with gta 5 and dark souls 2!

jarodsin
06-11-2013, 07:57 AM
games take time i beta tested rift it went to press broken like all mmos do thier all the same 6 month to a year to get thier stuff together the way of gamming.

Strontium Dog
06-11-2013, 10:28 AM
Thats complete nonsense lol Rift was as smooth as the best mmo launches. It was one of the few releases without major issues at start.And yes i was there from closed beta till around 18 months after launch.

Worst thing was queues . Yes there were bugs but nothing new to the game just usual mmo ones. to say it took a year to sort out is just rubbish.
Rift was far more playable than this out the box, and obviously written by completely different guys (even though theres the claim its the same coders, theres nothing here to show that ie they dont know how to make a chat system!)


And saying they all take 6 months to a year means you dont mind spending money KNOWING it will be broken and accept that? Nice gig if you can get it but in the real word that would never work lol. Heres your car/laptop/phone/pen! it will work in a few months till then though just smile and accept it .Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

So yes a refund would be in order but not yet since theres never been a timeline stated. But if they give us cack n shtako then they might be facing ruin with lots of refunds.

Nicator
06-11-2013, 10:46 AM
What are the problems. I play Defiance with great joy. Haven't had a serious problem yet.

Ofc there is bugs and stuff - but its a computer game. I didn't expect less.

Jac
06-12-2013, 02:28 AM
Much as I hate to say it by incomplete games are actually par for the course these days. Largely because of deadlines but also if you think about it a testing team is only, what?, 200-300 people? They can only break so much compared to 1million plus.

Tatr
06-12-2013, 05:14 AM
Just curious. Regardless of the fact that they released it for 3 consoles. how is that our problem? does that clearly give them the excuse to just keep screwing up? Because that seems to be what you guys keep coming back to. just because it was released on 3 different platforms does not mean that we should have to deal with all of there glitches that they have had plenty of time to fix. Just saying

3d Plague
06-12-2013, 05:26 AM
Sad you cant give the game the time it needs I ptiy this impatient generation of gamers

hear hear!!

Tyger
06-12-2013, 05:43 AM
Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

No MMO is ever considered ' Finished ' ...ever. At best they will always be a polished Beta and if you need further explanation as to why & how then it's clear that you are a part of the burgeoning masses that sprouted up in the last 5+ years in the MMO community. If you only took the time to look past your nose you would probably have a different outlook on the matter, but it's ok. I understand. You probably never played an MMO till now. You've probably only rocked console games and as such you come here and use a grading metric for oranges and try to slap it against a stand selling grapes.

Maybe you'll wise up in time, maybe not. The only thing I do know is comments like this from posters like you are incredibly easy to spot as uninformed, overly-entitled gamers who have zero patience for the modern art form they consider themselves 'experts' of.

Kane
06-12-2013, 05:58 AM
No MMO is ever considered ' Finished ' ...ever. At best they will always be a polished Beta and if you need further explanation as to why & how then it's clear that you are a part of the burgeoning masses that sprouted up in the last 5+ years in the MMO community. If you only took the time to look past your nose you would probably have a different outlook on the matter, but it's ok. I understand. You probably never played an MMO till now. You've probably only rocked console games and as such you come here and use a grading metric for oranges and try to slap it against a stand selling grapes.

Maybe you'll wise up in time, maybe not. The only thing I do know is comments like this from posters like you are incredibly easy to spot as uninformed, overly-entitled gamers who have zero patience for the modern art form they consider themselves 'experts' of.

Just curious...why is an mmo never finished? you mean because of expansions or dlc? that is what all other games have also and they get sold as FINISHED product on the shelf, same goes for defiance, once you buy it it is considered a finished product that accepts improvement, would you buy a car that has no paint and only 3 wheels because they plan to improve on those and they tweaked the mileage but the brakes now somtimes don't work...would you buy a piece of crap like that? just because it has potential? no, defiance as it is now it is a finished faulty product that they are working on improving...

If microsoft released a semi finished windows, that didn;t allow you to log in to the internet from time to time, your settings reset each time you restart the computer, and a whole lot of other problems that can and will eventually be fixed via update, would you pay for that product and defend it as it is a work in progress?

Don;t get me wrong, i got my money;s worth from defiance, i will get to play the dlc's and i don't regret buying the pack but to defend this and call it whatever you will...it is a finished product that has a lot of problems...a faulty product...

And is not a question of self entitled gamers s you call the customers that got to a point where you will be in a short time when you do realize this is not a game that has content, (and here i don't mean fetch quests and crap like that, it has no stand alone history no lore nothing...i get more lore from other games in the first 20 minutes of play than in defiance) the only thing this game has going for it is the gameplay...nothing more

That is my opinion of the game, in conclusion i don't want a dlc refund but i doubt in a year this game will be more than it is now....

Kel Tso
06-12-2013, 05:59 AM
Understood, but seriously, the fixes are causing the most problems

baelrusk
06-12-2013, 06:05 AM
Just curious. Regardless of the fact that they released it for 3 consoles. how is that our problem? does that clearly give them the excuse to just keep screwing up? Because that seems to be what you guys keep coming back to. just because it was released on 3 different platforms does not mean that we should have to deal with all of there glitches that they have had plenty of time to fix. Just saying

That is very much a true point.
End of story is we bought a product. Anything to due with problems making it.....well that really the company's problem, not supposed to affect the customer.
Though this response will probably be flamed by fanboys.

Tatr......you have my deep respect.

Tyger
06-12-2013, 07:09 AM
...stuff

MMO's are never considered a finished product because from the very beginning they are designed to be an ongoing experience that grows and evolves during the life of the game. This is NOT a console game that has a start/middle/finish. Period.

Again with the car analogy... Seriously, enough with the copy/paste routine from you ppl plz. A car is not a video game, it's a personal conveyance. If you are having issues with understanding this than why should I even bother trying to defend an argument if it's main point is lost with you. It's like you're drawing a parallel between apples and tennis rackets.

Ya' know what, screw it, I'll bite:

When you buy a car that's it. You may get a lil' love and attention from the dealer but that's it. That car will never evolve from it's base form unless you choose to do so on your own terms. It's not going to go from a 4-door sedan to a 2-door jacked suspension rock crawler simply because the landscape's topography changes within the next 4 years. That is why the whole " I bought a car once waa-waa, and thats why this game waa-waa, so in conclusion I'm right and you all waa-waa" argument is just a whole lot of stupid from the get go. Do us all a favor and pass this on to the rest of the posters. Ignorance is one thing but this is just full on ******ed.


As far as your Microsoft analogy, wow... Really??? You are gonna' use that to defend your line of thinking when it's pretty much the biggest eye-roll joke in the Pc community to begin with? MS releases sh!t products every single time.... Always. If you took a moment to do a lil' research you would know why their stuff is continually used and it's definately not because they release a polished product from day 1. It's because of the BS move Gates played way back in the beginning of his solo career when he leased his semi-swiped product to all of the potential customers. Once the dust settled his monopoly on the PC market became so tight that any competitor that released a better OS was gobbled up and silenced to maintain his throne.

I'm sure you knew that, right? You wouldn't open your wordhole and start defending a situation with lil' to no actual facts to back it up, right?? Being forced to use a product because EVERYONE is forced to use it is not the same as something being purchased time and time again due to it's awesome factor.

Let's see... What other sparkling gems of confusion did you cite? Oh yea, the the lack of lore and fetch style quests. You must really be super new to MMO's to begin with if you're gonna' use the fetch quest complaint here. I won't even bother pointing out how slow on the uptake you are at this point. It's safer to just let you think your right atm than dig up the 'thousands' of game titles that do the exact same thing and plop the links down for you to peruse.

Dealing with the lore quibble - What part of it's a game and a TV show linked at the hip did you not understand the year or so leading up to release? Some of the lore comes from watching the show, some of it comes from playing the game.

...Look, I'm all for a spirited debate, especially when someone rolls in with an idea that I've not thought of. If it helps flesh out a better understanding of the situation then I'm appreciative and go on with my day feeling like I'm better off now with a reworked angular view I didn't previously possess. This, however, is hardly anything except a poster replying off of what I said and trying to push it off with lil' to no actual understanding of the source material.

TL;DR
MMO's by design are never released with the idea that there's a beginning - middle - end. Take your consolitis-crafted theories elsewhere.

Bobba Fitt
06-12-2013, 07:23 AM
I play Eve and that game has evolved not always but positively but it's evolved talk to any mmo player and they will tell you there's never been a perfect game.....I've played Defiance and my one gripe is the lack of social aspect but then I didn't really get it for that it's a break for me from Eve, one where I can explore the world at my own pace and if I meet other folks along the way great......the game so far to me hasn't seemed that buggy and trust me I've played some crap...the land is pretty, some of the missions are challenging though I couldn't imagine spending hours of my life in it every day like I do Eve because the social aspect hasn't allowed me to build bridges with new friends like Eve does, it's just to me a completely different experience and if different proposition as a game.....

Kane
06-12-2013, 09:32 AM
MMO's are never considered a finished product because from the very beginning they are designed to be an ongoing experience that grows and evolves during the life of the game. This is NOT a console game that has a start/middle/finish. Period.


As far as your Microsoft analogy, wow... Really??? You are gonna' use that to defend your line of thinking when it's pretty much the biggest eye-roll joke in the Pc community to begin with? MS releases sh!t products every single time.... Always. If you took a moment to do a lil' research you would know why their stuff is continually used and it's definately not because they release a polished product from day 1. It's because of the BS move Gates played way back in the beginning of his solo career when he leased his semi-swiped product to all of the potential customers. Once the dust settled his monopoly on the PC market became so tight that any competitor that released a better OS was gobbled up and silenced to maintain his throne.



So you dislike the idea of being sold a "finished product" that is crap? well my dear sir..THIS IS what people like me keep saying here on the forum...what you just said...trion released a crap product, and sold it as finished...but i guess it sounds better if you pick on someone while saying it so we'll go with your version of it :)) you just said the same thing i did only with another company and another product...

Oh and by the way, the ever evolving world that you talk about in an mmo evolves via other purchases of finished products like expansions, dlc or whatever...so no, you buy the disk, the disk contains x amount of content, fixes and patches are exactly that...not increased content...whatever extra you get is extra no one is entitled to it, dlc on the other hand, yes, you pay money you are entitled to get it...

and on the whole car ideea ever heard of a factory recall?

dwej1973
06-12-2013, 09:41 AM
I just did a double take a million threads about whining about wanting DLC and this one wants to give it back... Kids today man.....

I wonder how many of them have any job that has deadlines, and time limits, and creative input - do they understand how much time it takes to do something and that everything isn't poofed out of thin air?

There are REAL problems with Trion and the game, legitimate ones - DLC will only make it worse if it is released before the problems are fixed. This takes time.

Sigh so tired of it.


Dlc is being released and they haven't fixed the game. Do you really think a game like this was ready to be put out on release? To me it seems that most of these problem should of been fixed in what was meant to be extensive beta testing. And it seems to only be getting worst. I bought this game to play with friends only to find out it was region locked then to have the social problems that were suppose to be fixed yesterday, and are still not. Come on. People have the right to be a bit upset. More with the lack of communication than anything else. This is being generous but I will be surprised if the game is fixed in the next six months.

And that is not **** talking. I love the game and will be playing it for a while That is just being a realist. I have friends and clan mates that want to trade in their copies of this game already. One simply because we are on the same servers and can not play together and he got the game to play online with our clan.

Tyger
06-12-2013, 10:13 AM
So you dislike the idea of being sold a "finished product" that is crap? well my dear sir..THIS IS what people like me keep saying here on the forum...what you just said...trion released a crap product, and sold it as finished...but i guess it sounds better if you pick on someone while saying it so we'll go with your version of it :)) you just said the same thing i did only with another company and another product...

Oh and by the way, the ever evolving world that you talk about in an mmo evolves via other purchases of finished products like expansions, dlc or whatever...so no, you buy the disk, the disk contains x amount of content, fixes and patches are exactly that...not increased content...whatever extra you get is extra no one is entitled to it, dlc on the other hand, yes, you pay money you are entitled to get it...

and on the whole car ideea ever heard of a factory recall?

No, but I have heard of cynical Dbags that bum rides from their friends cuz' they are way too anti-establishment to get their own. Obviously you just want to p!ss & moan about how the 'MAN' screwed you over. Got it. Moving on >.> Let us know when you got something worth sharing that a Midol can't knock out.

Imani Hype
06-12-2013, 10:21 AM
So you dislike the idea of being sold a "finished product" that is crap? well my dear sir..THIS IS what people like me keep saying here on the forum...what you just said...trion released a crap product, and sold it as finished...but i guess it sounds better if you pick on someone while saying it so we'll go with your version of it :)) you just said the same thing i did only with another company and another product...

Oh and by the way, the ever evolving world that you talk about in an mmo evolves via other purchases of finished products like expansions, dlc or whatever...so no, you buy the disk, the disk contains x amount of content, fixes and patches are exactly that...not increased content...whatever extra you get is extra no one is entitled to it, dlc on the other hand, yes, you pay money you are entitled to get it...

and on the whole car ideea ever heard of a factory recall?

You are taking what what he said too literal and twisting it. Again, players who have played decent MMOs have been there. We have been in each and everyone on this thread's shoes. We've gotten riled up and heated because of issues during launch time and voiced our complaints on forums without the knowledge of what happens on the other side and behind closed doors.

I agree that MMOs will never be a "finished" product in a sense that there will ALWAYS be on going fixes and patches to try to achieve balance, which will never happen, (whether it be OPed weapons, difficulties, rewards, whatever the reason). Therefore instead, every MMO will strive to be as 'polished' as it possibly can get, but never “finished". This is not a single player game with multi player capabilities where things such as design and coding are just simply linear. Players can't glitch or break a gameplay if it was never meant to be "explored"


This is also why patching in MMOs takes time and complicated because one line of code that is out of place or even just a letter or a number can break a gameplay that's totally not even related to the patch or was never broken or bugged. Reverting can't be an option because it will cause more problems than currently, from what I remember the previous codes before a patch cannot be applied back into a current one because it becomes incompatible, but don't quote me. This is just from my years and years from reading dev responses in forums. Rerolling isn't also an option because even more players with rage will run rampant on forums and CS. They also can't give an exact date unless its within a week because if they find something wrong with the patch and fixes and can't release on the date they said, then well, more rage and disappointment.

There's just too many variables that makes MMOs so unpredictable. Too many players who have not matured do not realize the hard work and how MMOs basically just forever spin its wheels because it tries to make everybody who complains happy.

Edit::
If anything, the launch time of an MMO is the very beginning to a polished product. I hate to use WoW as an example, but its been around close to a decade and has withstood the test of time. It runs on a very old engine but yet still nets millions of players.

Conneri
06-12-2013, 10:45 AM
Cars would be more akin to the Xbox, PS3, and PC. Each one is a different model with PCs having hundreds of versions. Defiance would be like the programming in the electronic module (ECM) inside your car. Trion is trying to make one module work for every vehicle which is fairly complex and not something that is done in the industry at all.

Overall, I'd say that the console market is not ready for an MMO just yet. Now, Blizzard did something interesting by releasing Diablo 3 to PC first and letting them play/beta test the game for a year before marketing to the consoles which might prove to be the way to go for any future MMOs (even though D3 isn't an MMO itself). However, in the case of Defiance with it's show tie in, this probably wouldn't work as well.

Kane
06-12-2013, 01:20 PM
No, but I have heard of cynical Dbags that bum rides from their friends cuz' they are way too anti-establishment to get their own. Obviously you just want to p!ss & moan about how the 'MAN' screwed you over. Got it. Moving on >.> Let us know when you got something worth sharing that a Midol can't knock out.

Have you read my earlier post where i actually say that i got my money's worth from this game? oh and by the way, are you actually that challenged that you can't make any point without trying to insult? just curious, not offended in anyway by your inept attempt at...i don't know what but...really...is it hard to make a point in a civilized manner? or is that too much to ask?

Oh and not to degenerate more the topic, i will stop here with the discussion as it has become pointless unless you want me to start insulting also...

Tyger
06-12-2013, 01:55 PM
...moar stuff...

See... That's why you shouldn't poke your head into another person's reply when you got no business there in the 1st place.

P.S. Factory recalls are to keep ppl from dying in their cars.... Unless you're playing an NES Emulator of Howard the Duck you're not in any danger of immediate harm. Seriously... I would drop this whole car analogy process. You make it wayy too easy for me.

Lupis Volk
06-12-2013, 04:58 PM
Trion was given time. It is called development. When it hit the shelves, it is considered a finished product. Underneath this failed logic, I could sell a game in alpha, untested and barely running, and people should fork over their money just on the concept and hopes that eventually they will get content without major issues.

What I feel is truly sad is that people allow themselves to get walked over and smile while it is happening.

They did that with Minecraft and everyone loved it.

Whippersnapper
06-12-2013, 07:41 PM
No Refunds.

Here is why: The idea behind the Season Pass is "In return for giving us most of your money now you save $10, but you risk $40 if you dont like the game. If they gave refunds, what would be the point of this?

Option One: You buy DLC one at a time.
Pro: You can stop any time. If you don't like the game, you saved yourself the cost of the other DLCs.
Con: You have to spend $10 more.

Option Two: You risk it and buy the season pass (all 5 DLCs at once)
Pro: If you will play longterm, you saved $10
Con: You already gave them all your money so if you stop playing, you lose it all.

It is better to buy the DLC one at a time. A $10 discount is not enough IMHO to be in it for the long term. If it were...say...$25-$30, then its an interesting risk to take.

terkwashere
06-13-2013, 09:23 AM
Got my Steam season pass for $30.

Got shot down trying to get a refund, even though none of the DLC has come out yet. I figured that would happen but I tried anyway...

So if this late July rumor that just popped up is true, we are looking at the first DLC coming out 3.5+ months after release, so... a year and a half for all 5 DLC's to come out?

I hope the DLC's are good, but I've come to peace with the loss of my 30 bucks at this point.

baelrusk
06-13-2013, 09:29 AM
Got my Steam season pass for $30.

Got shot down trying to get a refund, even though none of the DLC has come out yet. I figured that would happen but I tried anyway...

So if this late July rumor that just popped up is true, we are looking at the first DLC coming out 3.5+ months after release, so... a year and a half for all 5 DLC's to come out?

I hope the DLC's are good, but I've come to peace with the loss of my 30 bucks at this point.

More like they better be friggin masterpieces by now.

mulcherman
06-13-2013, 09:35 AM
You think this game is bad? As far as bugs? Vanguard is the most buggy game Ive ever played it came out way to early. The one thing I do hate about this game is the chat. But other than that I really like this game and like someone said a lot people are not patient enough

Reverend Blood
06-13-2013, 09:37 AM
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m5y65bL1ik1qjehm8.gif

wolfenhunter2010
06-13-2013, 09:44 AM
This game was released a year too early. I have never played a game with so many problems and its still generating more as we go. Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister company

How far away from the truth can I be. Communication from them has been pee poor to say the least although they did try for a day or two

I will gladly walk away from this game if I can get a refund on the DLC pack I have brought in advance. The way its been going we will be lucky to see any and when we do I can safely say it will be bugged to hell guaranteed

Please offer us a refund on DLC subscribers or even credits towards Rift store and I am out of here with a hard lesson learned

But guess this will go unread like so many other posts

i think the game is amazing it is everything that i wanted from a game i am never board of the game because of the dynamic events and pursuits and large ego to fill. i am greatly looking forward to dlc and it will come out otherwise the company would be sued. so just be patient. i had to wait almost 3 months for black ops 2 to release its first dlc pack because xbox had a month early release contracted. so xbox got dlc first then month later everyone else. it hasn't been 3 month yet so nothing new for me if it takes longer then that i would be concerned. i do think i enjoyed playing marvel universe a lot more, but then i got to a point were it said must buy membership or your account money and features will be limited and i found that i couldn't repair my gear because i couldn't hold enough money to do so. thanks to defiance i bought the game now i just play no hidden repairing cost thank god!!! can't wait for charge weapons and i just wounder will we see the voluge attack in later dlc's and even more awesome guns. new modes yes new guns yes new ego powers yes. that is what i want as a gamer before i buy dlc pass.

Elric1
06-13-2013, 09:49 AM
No Refunds.

Here is why: The idea behind the Season Pass is "In return for giving us most of your money now you save $10, but you risk $40 if you dont like the game. If they gave refunds, what would be the point of this?

Option One: You buy DLC one at a time.
Pro: You can stop any time. If you don't like the game, you saved yourself the cost of the other DLCs.
Con: You have to spend $10 more.

Option Two: You risk it and buy the season pass (all 5 DLCs at once)
Pro: If you will play longterm, you saved $10
Con: You already gave them all your money so if you stop playing, you lose it all.

It is better to buy the DLC one at a time. A $10 discount is not enough IMHO to be in it for the long term. If it were...say...$25-$30, then its an interesting risk to take.

especially from a one hit wonder of a company that is pulling a Microsoft. I won't make that mistake ever again. Rather pay the extra then risk this sort of slop again.

JazzyJet
06-13-2013, 10:06 AM
The only real bug problem I've had in game is the chat service not working. Clan chat going on and off. It is quite annoying and I wish it would get fixed. I assume it hasn't been fixed because maybe the cross platform chatting is more complex than I understand.

In Defiances defence. The combat and gameplay has been fantastic and as smooth as any other mmo I've played. I would suggest listing real serious bugs if the author of the post is going to make such huge demands. From my point of view they've delivered everything they said they would. I don't see any reason they'd refund you.

Please do fix chat though!

Reverend Blood
06-13-2013, 10:09 AM
No Refunds.

Here is why: The idea behind the Season Pass is "In return for giving us most of your money now you save $10, but you risk $40 if you dont like the game.

If $40 is "most of your money" (your words, not mine) then you have much bigger concerns in your life than this video game, and its DLC schedule.

Timanski
06-13-2013, 05:36 PM
Thank you for starting this post and not being afraid to tell trion how you feel or being afraid of the people that foolishly knock you. Why does everyone get soo angry at ppl being mad they paid for broke game. Its like this on every single game and it will never change if people dont speak up. I own a retail store its a parts store and if people would buy crappy parts for good money i would sell tham crappy parts for less money and make more money. I mean really if there happy there happy. Do you people really feel that badly for the corporate aspect of game development that puts these restraints on the devs to go bash people like the fella that started this thread. Were paying for betas, open paid for betas, its garbage and i want my money back.

Imani Hype
06-13-2013, 08:59 PM
My head is starting to throb because of all these bad analogies.

Fancypants
06-13-2013, 11:59 PM
Being a massive Rift fan I really expected this game to be on par with its sister companyYou can go back to Rift since it's F2P now. Maybe since you've been such a loyal customer through two games, and you liked that game, instead of a refund Trion will give you Patron credit over there and y...

http://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intel/2012/09/26/26-mitt-romney-laughing.o.jpg/a_560x375.jpg

Tyger
06-14-2013, 09:54 AM
Thank you for starting this post and not being afraid to tell trion how you feel or being afraid of the people that foolishly knock you. Why does everyone get soo angry at ppl being mad they paid for broke game. Its like this on every single game and it will never change if people dont speak up. I own a retail store its a parts store and if people would buy crappy parts for good money i would sell tham crappy parts for less money and make more money. I mean really if there happy there happy. Do you people really feel that badly for the corporate aspect of game development that puts these restraints on the devs to go bash people like the fella that started this thread. Were paying for betas, open paid for betas, its garbage and i want my money back.

o.0

Not sure if you're new to MMO's....
....or just very ignorant.

los77
06-14-2013, 10:03 AM
I must be getting old too because i can remember when you would buy a game at the store, take it home, open it up, place in

gaming machine and IT WORKED!!! WOW! That was it, that was all you had to do. i mean as long as you had electricity and a tv and

some wall outlets.

Shada Mori
06-14-2013, 10:32 AM
I must be getting old too because i can remember when you would buy a game at the store, take it home, open it up, place in

gaming machine and IT WORKED!!! WOW! That was it, that was all you had to do. i mean as long as you had electricity and a tv and

some wall outlets.

I remember having to blow on cartridges to get them to work. Different strokes I guess. :P

Blewtooth
06-15-2013, 04:04 PM
In my experience, the best games get criticized the most. the last major game glitch caused me to lose gameplay for almost a week (voice chat PTT bind). Trion DID offer me a refund, by the way. I wasn't interested. The game is fun despite it's problems and they are working to improve it constantly.

baelrusk
06-15-2013, 05:43 PM
Thank you for starting this post and not being afraid to tell trion how you feel or being afraid of the people that foolishly knock you. Why does everyone get soo angry at ppl being mad they paid for broke game. Its like this on every single game and it will never change if people dont speak up. I own a retail store its a parts store and if people would buy crappy parts for good money i would sell tham crappy parts for less money and make more money. I mean really if there happy there happy. Do you people really feel that badly for the corporate aspect of game development that puts these restraints on the devs to go bash people like the fella that started this thread. Were paying for betas, open paid for betas, its garbage and i want my money back.

Agreed.
Too many people saying give it time.

Nyako
06-16-2013, 01:36 AM
Agreed.
Too many people saying give it time.

While I'll say this, I want the DLC right now even if it was buggier than the game is already.

I do remember that almost all the MMOs I've ever played started out extremely buggy to the point that it felt like a beta release of the game. However, after a few months (which I think we are kind of to that now with Defiance), the game got more stable and offered more content. I mean look at what AION started out as, Spirit masters couldn't even use pets in the air. Then after some time, it was granted if I recall. The same is the case with other games as well.

I would just expect TRION to go ahead and give us the first DLC to at least stop people from feeling as though they need a refund on the DLC content, etc. Although, if it isn't released until August 2013 or so, I'd likely be joining the refund crowd too.

Whippersnapper
06-16-2013, 04:57 AM
If $40 is "most of your money" (your words, not mine) then you have much bigger concerns in your life than this video game, and its DLC schedule.

This was taken out of context. Obviously I meant "most of the DLC cost."
5 DLCs x $10 each = $50 (full cost). The pass is $40. So..."most" of the cost.