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View Full Version : I think Bits (and by association outfits and ect) are overpriced.



Jamesericmason
06-24-2013, 08:06 PM
Now don't jump down my throat here. I like the game and play it a lot, and I would like to contribute some extra money. But I'm also half Jewish and I know a bad deal when I see one. The outfit I primarily want to buy would cost me $11, and another $5.50 for the matching headgear. I'm still not 100% sure if the cash shop has sales or not, as they aren't announced very well (at all) and I don't check it often.
The outfits you guys are selling, are nowhere near worth the $16.50 you're trying to charge for them. They aren't League of Legends quality and they are mostly palette swaps anyways. (and not very good palette swaps usually)
I want you guys and the game to succeed but you're really making it hard for me to contribute without feeling like I got swindled.

Have you thought about maybe vastly increasing the bits we get for the money, or vastly reducing the price of things in the cash shop, and sell quantity over general value? Do you need an example of how this works? See: Walmart vs Mom & Pop.

Edit:
@Fancypants: I feel that the high prices are preventing a lot of people from spending any money at all, so yes I can fault them for the prices being so high as they are driving away money in favor of people who don't know the value of a dollar or who are way way way to die hard and are willing spend more money then they really should be in support of the game.

Pricing virtual items at a premium such as they are currently doing ONLY works in Pay2Win games where a few cashcows will spend $500 EVERY WEEK on stuff so they can win (and several thousand spend $20s each week, to try to win as well, and like 10k spend $1-5 each week to feel like they are participating.).

Notturno
06-24-2013, 10:05 PM
You have basically hit the nail on the head, the quality of vanity items sold does not match the price tag.

The majority, if not all of, the outfits sold are simply palette swaps of the existing armor you get in-game through pursuits. I cannot justify spending fifteen dollars or more to have the same armor in a moderately different color. It doesn't speak to me, it doesn't make me feel unique, and it has no "wow factor" to me. The most I would be willing to spend for those would be $5 for both the helmet and outfit.

If Trion wants to justify a $16.50 price tag for those outfits, then they need to be worth my money. For that price, I would expect a new outfit entirely, one that cannot be achieved in the game. It should have some unique aesthetic to it, and stand out in some fashion. Whether that's having flared armor plating, horned finishes, robes, or anything that isn't standard. With those items, palette swaps are acceptable; it provides the same uniqueness, but in different color variations. Essentially, the goal should be to provide something new and not seen in the standard game.

xTomacyde
06-24-2013, 10:11 PM
deleted :)

Wtflag
06-24-2013, 10:39 PM
I agree.

That price range would be more suitable if they are originals.

Not when they are just palette swaps.

duction
06-24-2013, 10:58 PM
I agree. I have only bought 1 outfit as it was 180.. Ain't paying more then that for an outfit lol..


Bought both nomads.. Don't mind paying that much for them (960 scrip) when I got 2x 108% bits discount. Without that I prolly wouldn't of bought the trucks though!!!


Rest go on boosts.. Only loot boosts though as I've maxed my ego out lol.

Fancypants
06-24-2013, 11:07 PM
Prices are up but can you fault them? Why lower prices now? Makes no sense really.

The game AND the DLC both can now be had for the price of just the game at launch. They don't charge a sub fee so there's no cash flow coming in there. Trion is putting all it's money or most of it's money into the Rift F2P conversion and if it works, they might send some over here to help as sort of a aid subsidy in the cash shop. But they are already cutting prices to the bone.

Right now and especially after all those Def Team layoffs, I think this game was told in no uncertain terms "You guys are on your own for awhile, so make do." Cash shop probably has to stay where it is to remain solvent for awhile.

With fewer people coming in and more leaving (Debbie Downer), it doesn't make sense to lower prices while everyone is still trying to get items, because once most people acquire the best items, they usually don't stick around long after that because there's nothing else to get.

Aeothena
06-25-2013, 12:34 AM
I say:

*Shop items should be exclusive and not achievable in the game. As outfits don't add any ability to your character more than esthetics they have to be interesting enough to buy. Why spend that amount of money for something you can get by playing for a few hours? This goes for both vehicles and outfits.

*Lower prices, what about Apples 1 buck per item idea? How many more dollars would be spent on items if they were cheaper? If you think your shop work, show that you trust your idea and lower the price. Lower prices would certainly get more sales and the total would be bigger profit.

*Why not sell those "special" mods for bits? No, do NOT sell legendary weapons and such for bits, but please, sell mods. That way you CAN get that special mod that matches your weapon synergy. I've read about people getting a gun and have hunted for a special synergy mod for ages. It kills the idea and people are getting frustrated as hell. Both guns and mods not used is clutter the inventory just waiting to see if you get a match.

Don Nawetta
06-25-2013, 02:05 AM
I also think the shop is way overpriced.

I bought nothing from the shop but some inventory slots, and I bought my bits during the bonus time where I received 3450 bits for 24 .

Id probably buy a Nomad if there is another bonus offer some day, but Id never buy bits for the normal price.

Id also buy boosts, if they would count for ingame time only, but I wont pay for a 24h boost if I can only play an hour per day.

I wont expect them to sell mods in the shop, but some tools to remove a single mod from a weapon without destroying the mod and the weapon would be nice.

Ridiculousss
06-25-2013, 02:06 AM
Prices should be lowered

and they should come up with new fresh idea's for outfits, sick of the re coloring guys!

Mladenov
06-25-2013, 02:46 AM
Only items in store are Inventory Slots. Period.

Anzati
06-25-2013, 03:17 AM
Well this is my first post, I've been lurking for weeks, but thought I'd drop in my 2p worth on this one :)

I agree that the bits shop is way too expensive. Although I would like to buy items/inventory/boosts to help support the game there is no way that I can justify that kind of price. However if the prices were much lower, say starting at 50p per item and going up to no more than 1.50 per item, I'd drop money on bits on a regular basis...that's got to be better than the current situation where I'm not likely to ever buy bits?

Clear
06-25-2013, 04:53 AM
You would feel even worse about about spending 880 bits on the Drifter outfit because it does look kinda cool and then find a couple of weeks later they are being given away on Raptr for free! Thanks does not make a person happy! Granted it is only a limited number, but still....free...

Mladenov
06-25-2013, 05:15 AM
"Limited member"? Yeah right. They have more than 1000 available...
I will get it and orange duni too!

SYN BLACK XS
06-25-2013, 07:48 AM
Prices are up but can you fault them? Why lower prices now? Makes no sense really.

The game AND the DLC both can now be had for the price of just the game at launch. They don't charge a sub fee so there's no cash flow coming in there. Trion is putting all it's money or most of it's money into the Rift F2P conversion and if it works, they might send some over here to help as sort of a aid subsidy in the cash shop. But they are already cutting prices to the bone..

Yea, we kind of can fault them. Thats just poor marketing/planning/relations with your customer. We as Defiance gamers shouldnt be spending more so they can experiment with Rift F2P....

Theres really no point in buying the items anyway. None of us will be playing this when Destiny/etc, arrive. Save your money for something you'll actually benefit from/enjoy.

XxIndomitablexX
06-25-2013, 08:21 AM
While I hate to disagree with a friend, Notturno... and I can't believe I would ever agree with Fancy on anything, prices are, and should be, what the market will bear, the price will only go down if no one buys them at the current price, also its a captive market, you cant import clothes from other games, so I can understand why they are what they are. No one is making you buy their items and you dont really need them, they are by descriptions vanity items so...perhaps your ego wants a ferrari when your wallet says ford pinto. I bought my bits on sale so I paid half price for my vanity items...its was much easier for my ego to explain to my wallet

Jamesericmason
06-25-2013, 08:25 AM
@Fancypants: I feel that the high prices are preventing a lot of people from spending any money at all, so yes I can fault them for the prices being so high as they are driving away money in favor of people who don't know the value of a dollar or who are way way way to die hard and are willing spend more money then they really should be in support of the game.

Pricing virtual items at a premium such as they are currently doing ONLY works in Pay2Win games where a few cashcows will spend $500 EVERY WEEK on stuff so they can win (and several thousand spend $20s each week, to try to win as well, and like 10k spend $1-5 each week to feel like they are participating.).

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 08:28 AM
I say:

*Shop items should be exclusive and not achievable in the game. As outfits don't add any ability to your character more than esthetics they have to be interesting enough to buy. Why spend that amount of money for something you can get by playing for a few hours? This goes for both vehicles and outfits.

This wouldn't change. It's already a Trion policy set from Rift:

Arachne in RIFT Store? (http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/362721-arachne-rift-store.html)

The Rift players were upset that Trion was selling in the cash shop mounts that they had worked for in game to earn before the game went F2P, after doing some particularly hard saving of tokens. The OP's position was that since he already spent coins on the mount that he had earned in-game, he should be given a refund of in-game coins so that he could then buy the mount with real money in the cash shop, because he didn't have the option before.

Various opinions on the thread, but it seems the end result accourding to the OP was that Trion did indeed give him in-game coins back, and he went and spent his real cash on the same store mount.

I doubt you'll find Trion will like the idea of not allowing players who don't have as much time to grind content, pay extra for special CEs or generally missed out on Launch Day vehicles/gear the opportunity to buy it with real money at some point.

It is a very good business decision to do that.

3rdpig
06-25-2013, 09:09 AM
I've got no problems with Trion's cash shop prices, it's their stuff, they can ask anything they want for it. Of course my money is mine to manage as I see fit, and Trion has nothing in that cash shop, other than inventory slots, that I feel is worth me spending my money on and $20 has gotten me all the inventory slots I need.

Lockboxes? Not a chance considering the horrible drop rate of anything decent.

Vehicles? Once you have a roller and a runner what's the point of having more? Besides, you can get them in game for about the amount of scrip you can earn in an hour or two. Design something unique, with real in game utility, make it look and sound good, price it right and I might reconsider. I've got a half dozen rollers, 4 Challengers, the Nomad and about 3 Duni's, so it's going to have to be pretty darn good.

Outfits? Trion please, design one that doesn't look like it belongs on an action figure in a clamshell pack on the toy isle of the dollar store, price it reasonably and I might buy a few. Give it some utility, like extra inventory slots or some armor and I'll get my wallet out. Other than that, I'll stick with Nolan's brown bomber jacket and the cool shades. And for crying out loud, ditch the silly looking backpacks.

3rdpig
06-25-2013, 09:13 AM
This wouldn't change. It's already a Trion policy set from Rift:

Arachne in RIFT Store? (http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/362721-arachne-rift-store.html)

The Rift players were upset that Trion was selling in the cash shop mounts that they had worked for in game to earn before the game went F2P, after doing some particularly hard saving of tokens. The OP's position was that since he already spent coins on the mount that he had earned in-game, he should be given a refund of in-game coins so that he could then buy the mount with real money in the cash shop, because he didn't have the option before.

Various opinions on the thread, but it seems the end result accourding to the OP was that Trion did indeed give him in-game coins back, and he went and spent his real cash on the same store mount.

I doubt you'll find Trion will like the idea of not allowing players who don't have as much time to grind content, pay extra for special CEs or generally missed out on Launch Day vehicles/gear the opportunity to buy it with real money at some point.

It is a very good business decision to do that.

Good business decisions are usually accompanied by happy customers, filled coffers and increased employee levels. Just sayin...

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 09:25 AM
Good business decisions are usually accompanied by happy customers, filled coffers and increased employee levels. Just sayin...You are 100% right. I'm not defending Trion but I am defending a business' right to set product as it sees fit.

Some customers won't like things and a majority might. Some will stay because of changes while others will bolt. It's a number's game for businesses. You try to make as much money as you can without trying to piss off most of the people, not keep everyone happy. That's not realistic.

It's simply impossible to do what you are suggesting there, keep 'happy customers', coffers filled and increased employee levels 100% of the time (even if you didn't totally imply it). It's a juggling act and sometimes, a business can offset some small amounts of customers who leave by raising prices or in the case of a cash shop, keep prices high. But that can only be done if the core base (diehards/fanbois/whales/whatever ppl call them) will generate enough money for them by happily spending like a drunken sailor in the cash shop.

You figure a company has more leeway to lower prices when the game is full, not when it's starting to go dry.

DarknessEyes PT
06-25-2013, 10:19 AM
I checked it a month ago and i think it was 6 euros for a tier 4 box... no way that im spending 6 euros on a single tier 4 box...

Machighland
06-25-2013, 10:48 AM
I do not usually post, just lurk but I wanted my 2 cents in on this discussion. Mostly concerning the boosts and the time frame. Real time and not game time. I have spent a healthy sum since launch on everything but until something changes with the boosts and the time frame I will be holding my coin in my pocket. 24 hours real time is highway robbery, should be game time, that is my input.

cusman
06-25-2013, 10:54 AM
I agree that none of the costumes are worth the prices they are charging... but if someone really wants that different than what they can earn in the game, that is the choice they have.

theBreadSultan
06-25-2013, 11:43 AM
Yup - I got 780 MS points to spend - And I intend to spend the lot before Xbox1 comes out.

but here's the problem.
1. I can only afford to get 400 bits, because of the way that they sell them.
2. 400 bits doesn't buy you anything
3. The outfit I want costs 880 bits (which is balls greedy/stupid pricing seeing as you sell bits in quantiies of 400)

Enjoy not getting a penny of my money. and all 100 MS points you are not getting squat.

oh yea and good luck when Destiny comes out - you know the game that is not only filled with free to get custom armour - tons more of it

I'm gonna buy some DLC from somewhere - but it won't be Trion

Nerotic
06-25-2013, 12:04 PM
This is a very old issue, that being said it is an issue. I don't know about the economic situation in other countrys but I feel safe saying many gamers in the us are below the poverty line. I can barely justify paying 16 buck for an outfit for myself... paying that much for an outfit on a video game when it is just a pretty new color isn't smart, isn't financialy responsible and isn't something that should be thought of as acceptable if Trion see the players as anything more than an piggy bank. Bit prices are 80% of the reason I question Trions ethics and lets face it they give us reason to wonder. Adjusting bit shop prices and how boosts work would generate a lot more feelings of 'this game will be awsome in a few months' and less Trion is a bunch of greedy lazy liars who don't give a **** about us. Still thinking great potential myself but I am also spending less and less time on the game.

Elric1
06-25-2013, 01:29 PM
Now don't jump down my throat here. I like the game and play it a lot, and I would like to contribute some extra money. But I'm also half Jewish and I know a bad deal when I see one. The outfit I primarily want to buy would cost me $11, and another $5.50 for the matching headgear. I'm still not 100% sure if the cash shop has sales or not, as they aren't announced very well (at all) and I don't check it often.
The outfits you guys are selling, are nowhere near worth the $16.50 you're trying to charge for them. They aren't League of Legends quality and they are mostly palette swaps anyways. (and not very good palette swaps usually)
I want you guys and the game to succeed but you're really making it hard for me to contribute without feeling like I got swindled.

Have you thought about maybe vastly increasing the bits we get for the money, or vastly reducing the price of things in the cash shop, and sell quantity over general value? Do you need an example of how this works? See: Walmart vs Mom & Pop.

Edit:
@Fancypants: I feel that the high prices are preventing a lot of people from spending any money at all, so yes I can fault them for the prices being so high as they are driving away money in favor of people who don't know the value of a dollar or who are way way way to die hard and are willing spend more money then they really should be in support of the game.

Pricing virtual items at a premium such as they are currently doing ONLY works in Pay2Win games where a few cashcows will spend $500 EVERY WEEK on stuff so they can win (and several thousand spend $20s each week, to try to win as well, and like 10k spend $1-5 each week to feel like they are participating.).

Ok first off.

Duh.

Now that is done of course it is how else are they gonna make money on a game they won't even support?

Strontium Dog
06-25-2013, 04:25 PM
I agree. I have only bought 1 outfit as it was 180.. Ain't paying more then that for an outfit lol..


Bought both nomads.. Don't mind paying that much for them (960 scrip) when I got 2x 108% bits discount. Without that I prolly wouldn't of bought the trucks though!!!


Rest go on boosts.. Only loot boosts though as I've maxed my ego out lol.

Why bother even boosting loot when its all the same in the end. try a starter gun at an arkfall and theres very little difference.Sad really.

JxSiN
06-25-2013, 04:39 PM
I made some suggestions about outfits on another post, but in case you guys missed it:

"I would love some new outfits, and not just recolored ones. I've only purchased one from the store, which is the predator one, because why wait til EGO 4000 to get it when I can just get it from the store. Others in the store are cool and I like some of the colors, but c'mon, I don't want to pay 560-880 bits just to have a different color on an outfit I already have. A lot of these you can get in-game and even tho the color may be a lot better in the store, you already have the outfit.

Also, when I first started, I was excited to see the vendor at Mt Tam have headgear. I searched everywhere after that to find a vendor selling clothing...... and none.

Here are my suggestions:

1) Exclusive store outfits (not colors)

2) If a person already owns an outfit in a different color, reduce the price of color options for that outfit. Put them in a category based on style. Let's say I won harmony preacher completing the co op pursuit. That could be category "badlands attire" or whatever. Then each additional color in the store should be a few hundred bits, and not 880 each for the lone wolf or the drifter. However, if I don't have the harmony preacher, but I really like that style, I could pay the 880 bits for drifter, then the lone wolf would only be a couple hundred and I still would have to finish the pursuit to get harmony preacher. It may look like you are losing money, Trion, but in reality I think people would buy more of the same style outfit for different colors if they only have to pay a smaller amount for additional colors to something they already own. It does make it where you need to put in more outfits (but then again, refer back to #1). Ex: I bought the collective predator for 880 bits. While I also really like the Ekaru, I am not paying another 880 for the same uniform. I would, however, pay 150-250 for the color option, then another 150-250 for a 3rd color option.... see where I am going here? And I don't think I am alone.

3) Clothing vendors for scrip. Doesn't have to be great items. But its variety, and it can make people feel like scrip is a little more useful

4) The Nolan lawkeeper and the Irisa outfit with the knives on the back would be AMAZING!

5) More armored styles, as well as civilian styles. I also agree with the guy who said more military style uniforms (both dress and bdu)

6) More episode mission reward clothing: I actually felt like I got a reward for doing the episode missions when I got Nolan's, Irisa's, and Rynn's outfits. Did any other episode missions have rewards? Cuz I really don't remember those at all. It was just junk. ADDENDUM: yeah, I remember getting a white infector grenade cuz it was a new weapon entirely... but white"

Jamesericmason
06-25-2013, 05:32 PM
Ok first off.

Duh.

Now that is done of course it is how else are they gonna make money on a game they won't even support?

Did you not read my post?

I said they would be able to make more money by selling more virtual items (which have no production costs) as opposed to selling fewer at a higher price, the exact same way Walmart works and is successful, sell more things cheaper to more people.

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 07:34 PM
3. The outfit I want costs 880 bits (which is balls greedy/stupid pricing seeing as you sell bits in quantiies of 400)

Marvel Heroes does this too.

If you want to buy extra bank space (which you definitely will want to), it's 550G. So you buy 1,000G for $5, but you can only get one space. So as you are left with 450, the only other space you can buy is crafting mat bank space and guess what that costs?

Yep. 350G. In order to get the other bank space you have to spend $5 more to get another 1,000G.

It's designed that way so with much of what you buy, you're left with an oddball balance that is jusssssssst a bit too low, requiring you to buy more game gold to use what's left.

It's almost price fixing among most F2P games or games with cash shops in general, because they know most people will cha-ching that credit card twice to be left with no weird game gold balance.

They must have statistical studies someplace that show that whenever someone has a small balance on their card to low or odd to buy something, they are likely to buy more gold in order to get the next item, so as not feel as though they are wasting money... even though it works out to .25 cents or something left over.

Atticus Batman
06-25-2013, 07:41 PM
Edited for spelling = My problem is ONE Nomad will cost me 11.00 but for ONLY 10 dollars I could buy ONE of their DLCs when released.

Do the math people. 1 truck for 11.00 or several items by gettin ONE DLC for 10.00? IS it really that hard to realize the 5 dlc (with MORE stuff) is cheaper than 4 full outfits from their store?!

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 08:08 PM
My proble is ONW Noamad will cost me 11.00 but for ONLY 10 dollars I could buy ONE of their DLCs when released.

Do the math people. 1 truck for 11.00 or several items by gettin ONE DLC for 10.00? IS it really that hard to realize the 5 dlc (with MORE stuff) is cheaper than 4 full outfits from their store?!http://store.steampowered.com/app/224610/

Well, people can buy the 5 DLC Season Pass for $29.99 on Steam, instead of buying them all $10 at a time which would be $50.00 which you seem to be suggesting.

So yeah, it's highly likely there are things people don't know regarding better value and pricing.

Atticus Batman
06-25-2013, 08:17 PM
[/URL]
[url]http://store.steampowered.com/app/224610/ (http://community.defiance.com/en/2013/03/05/the-defiance-season-pass-is-here/)

Well, people can buy the 5 DLC Season Pass for $29.99 on Steam, instead of buying them all $10 at a time which would be $50.00 which you seem to be suggesting.

So yeah, it's highly likely there are things people don't know regarding better value and pricing.
It is 39.99 on consoles for the season pass. It is wonderful that pc players save 20dollars for buying the pass through Steam but last I looked console players only save 10 dollars but fifty dollars for all that is STILL better than 50 dollars for FOUR outfits! Afterall some will NOT buy the season pass for different reasons and only buy the DLC as it is released.

edit: http://community.defiance.com/en/2013/03/05/the-defiance-season-pass-is-here/

http://www.gamestop.com/ps3/dlc/defiance-season-pass/108143

http://www.gamestop.com/xbox-360/dlc/defiance-season-pass-xbox-360-live-marketplace-3200-points/108145

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Defiance-Season-Pass/6a5a4455-4204-4312-aae2-11be3a8e1297

Obviously I am NOT the only one who should check prices before commenting!

JxSiN
06-25-2013, 09:23 PM
Marvel Heroes does this too.

If you want to buy extra bank space (which you definitely will want to), it's 550G. So you buy 1,000G for $5, but you can only get one space. So as you are left with 450, the only other space you can buy is crafting mat bank space and guess what that costs?

Yep. 350G. In order to get the other bank space you have to spend $5 more to get another 1,000G.

It's designed that way so with much of what you buy, you're left with an oddball balance that is jusssssssst a bit too low, requiring you to buy more game gold to use what's left.

It's almost price fixing among most F2P games or games with cash shops in general, because they know most people will cha-ching that credit card twice to be left with no weird game gold balance.

They must have statistical studies someplace that show that whenever someone has a small balance on their card to low or odd to buy something, they are likely to buy more gold in order to get the next item, so as not feel as though they are wasting money... even though it works out to .25 cents or something left over.

This is spot on. If someone has ever bought and used bits on Defiance (or any game that does this), it is very very rare for you to break even on bits. Even if you make multiple transactions and have an odd number of bits saved up, you still don't have that great of a chance "breaking even". It's a marketing strategy and a sales ploy with a little psychology in place. If people see they have bits, but not enough, it makes them more likely to purchase more.

I'm not sure how Xbox is set up, but even Sony is set up like this in the store. The minimum amount you can "purchase" to go into your Sony wallet is $5. How many add-ons are 1.99, 2.99.... heck, even the lowest amount of bits you can buy is 4.99. So no combination is ever going to make it to where you break even, UNLESS you buy something for greater than $5 (which then there is no limitation as to the "minimum" you have in your wallet).

If this wasn't a ploy/marketing strategy, then they would cut the "wallet" out entirely and let you purchase directly (as in use a PSN card or debit straight for the purchase and not have to add the funds to the wallet first).

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 10:20 PM
It is 39.99 on consoles for the season pass. It is wonderful that pc players save 20dollars for buying the pass through Steam but last I looked console players only save 10 dollars but fifty dollars for all that is STILL better than 50 dollars for FOUR outfits! Afterall some will NOT buy the season pass for different reasons and only buy the DLC as it is released.

edit: http://community.defiance.com/en/2013/03/05/the-defiance-season-pass-is-here/

http://www.gamestop.com/ps3/dlc/defiance-season-pass/108143

http://www.gamestop.com/xbox-360/dlc/defiance-season-pass-xbox-360-live-marketplace-3200-points/108145

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Product/Defiance-Season-Pass/6a5a4455-4204-4312-aae2-11be3a8e1297

Obviously I am NOT the only one who should check prices before commenting!Oh wasn't considering consoles with HIGHER different pricing. I thought the point of your post was to show people CHEAPER prices, not more expensive alternatives.

Not sure why anyone would want to pay extra to play on a lesser platform but .. meh, have at it chum. :cool: Why would I want to check for HIGHER prices to report so people could pay those?

Which kind of goes to your point anyways.. why people would pay more when they could be paying less, amirite?

Fancypants
06-25-2013, 10:25 PM
This is spot on. If someone has ever bought and used bits on Defiance (or any game that does this), it is very very rare for you to break even on bits. Even if you make multiple transactions and have an odd number of bits saved up, you still don't have that great of a chance "breaking even". It's a marketing strategy and a sales ploy with a little psychology in place. If people see they have bits, but not enough, it makes them more likely to purchase more.

I'm not sure how Xbox is set up, but even Sony is set up like this in the store. The minimum amount you can "purchase" to go into your Sony wallet is $5. How many add-ons are 1.99, 2.99.... heck, even the lowest amount of bits you can buy is 4.99. So no combination is ever going to make it to where you break even, UNLESS you buy something for greater than $5 (which then there is no limitation as to the "minimum" you have in your wallet).

If this wasn't a ploy/marketing strategy, then they would cut the "wallet" out entirely and let you purchase directly (as in use a PSN card or debit straight for the purchase and not have to add the funds to the wallet first).Yeah, so many companies do this now that it's basically an industry standard because most consumers aren't aware of what's happening. It's pretty obvious it's intentional and again, I'm sure they had expert number finance people run studies and found out this was the most effective way to get people to keep spending.

Again, those oddly shaped balances of 75gold or 135credits or something in an account looks to most people like they are wasting money because they can't afford the bits/items they want, and don't need/want what the leftovers can actually buy. They end up charging more money on the card to make up the difference and are never the wiser.

A lot of people might be shocked to find out a company that made a game with Rift's reputation for treating customers right tolerates this, but it goes to what I said all along: Trion is really no different to any other gaming company other than their Public Relations department deserves to be paid more than the devs, since they are really the ones who keep the income coming in.

And btw: they do the same exact thing in the Rift store, but those subbers don't care they are getting treated that way because to the average Rift fan, Trion wouldn't dare do that.. they respect them too much, lol.

Indra Echo
06-26-2013, 06:56 AM
Marvel Heroes does this too.

If you want to buy extra bank space (which you definitely will want to), it's 550G. So you buy 1,000G for $5, but you can only get one space. So as you are left with 450, the only other space you can buy is crafting mat bank space and guess what that costs?

Yep. 350G. In order to get the other bank space you have to spend $5 more to get another 1,000G.

It's designed that way so with much of what you buy, you're left with an oddball balance that is jusssssssst a bit too low, requiring you to buy more game gold to use what's left.

It's almost price fixing among most F2P games or games with cash shops in general, because they know most people will cha-ching that credit card twice to be left with no weird game gold balance.

They must have statistical studies someplace that show that whenever someone has a small balance on their card to low or odd to buy something, they are likely to buy more gold in order to get the next item, so as not feel as though they are wasting money... even though it works out to .25 cents or something left over.

This is exactly how all game devs are doing it. People are pissing and moaning over Trion (and yes, I agree things are over-priced but I'm forced to buy exactly none of it). Well, where were all of you when this crap started? EA tested this stuff in Dead Space (the freaking first DS game). They had it actually so that you felt like you had to buy the alternate weapons and armor because they were in some ways better than what you could get in game. And once Bioware was under EA's control, Mass Effect 3 was created and micro-transactions were in its multiplayer-and they tried to make it so you were forced to play MP in order to get all the endings in the single player. That is, until fans protested (that was part of the whole ME3 ending debacle).


Games are being created so that what you can earn in game might be able to be used to buy things in game, but it takes "too long" for those who just need stuff now. And the micro-transactions all but force you to spend more real money than is needed to buy the item you want. If you want a particular outfit (or some gear or equipment) it costs an odd amount. Hell, Microsoft does this themselves with xbox live points.

And EA was the company whose CEO said he wants people to pay for bullets in the game.


Well here's the other problem. Do you want to pay for stuff that's necessary in the game or vastly different from what you can get in the game or do you want to pay for extraneous stuff or stuff that's similar to what you can get in the game?


I'd be very pissed off if the only way I could get ahead in this game was the way it's done in EA games like Mass Effect 3. You actually do have to either earn credits or pay real money to get a chance at the ammo you want that is better than standard ammo, and for med kits to revive yourself and other stuff. I do think things are over-priced here but it's all stuff I don't need in the game except maybe inventory slots.


Imagine playing this game and instead of weapons that carry certain effects on them like syphon, you had to keep using scrip or salvage or real money in order to possibly get syphon to add to your weapon. As it is real money is used for wanted items. And I'm fine with it. Also, from time to time bits do go on sale.

Fancypants
06-26-2013, 07:50 AM
This is exactly how all game devs are doing it. People are pissing and moaning over Trion (and yes, I agree things are over-priced but I'm forced to buy exactly none of it). Well, where were all of you when this crap started?

EA tested this stuff in Dead Space...

And EA was the company whose CEO said he wants people to pay for bullets in the game.Does it really matter who 'started it first'? Nope.

The point is that if a shady company (EA) does this and no one sees them or the EA PLAYERS DON'T CARE about getting ripped off, a 'good' company like Trion isn't supposed to say 'Hey, look at that shady business practice EA started. They are making suckers buy more game money by shortchanging/mismatching prices in their store. Let's do the same thing!". EA has no excuse because everyone already KNOWS they are leeches.. you expect it.

What's Trion's excuse? "Hurr Durr.. everyone is doing it, so why can't we fleece our players too?" They are supposed to be better than that or at least should stop claiming that they are better than the other nickel-dimer companies.

That's the point, not who was the Father Originator or where was someone who wasn't aware of this because they didn't play X/Y game when it was done.

It's "What are players going to do now that they know?

Shogo_Yahagi
06-26-2013, 10:06 AM
At the current prices and under the current system, there's no way I'd buy anything from the cash shop.

These aren't microtransactions. When a single outfit that has no effect on game play costs more than a whole DLC pack that adds a new race, an exclusive story mode and game mode, and items, you know someone has no idea what they're doing.

Even if Trion fixes their pricing, I wouldn't buy them using bit purchases that further inflate the cost by forcing me to waste bits no matter what I want to buy.

If they were real microtransactions that I could make through the PSN store using a credit card so that I am actually charged the purchase price for what I want to buy and no more than that, I'd consider it. However, their overpricing and distasteful practices have seriously discouraged me from making future purchases even if the greedy bastards correct them.

X64
06-26-2013, 10:08 AM
I completely agree with these guys.

Atticus Batman
06-26-2013, 12:53 PM
Which kind of goes to your point anyways.. why people would pay more when they could be paying less, amirite?

That is pretty much it yes. Why pay more for less? No matter wich Dlc purchase one chooses, whether its the 30 dollar choice or the 50 dollar choice it is still a better value than just buying 1 - 4 outfits for that same price.


At the current prices and under the current system, there's no way I'd buy anything from the cash shop.

These aren't microtransactions. When a single outfit that has no effect on game play costs more than a whole DLC pack that adds a new race, an exclusive story mode and game mode, and items, you know someone has no idea what they're doing.

Even if Trion fixes their pricing, I wouldn't buy them using bit purchases that further inflate the cost by forcing me to waste bits no matter what I want to buy.

If they were real microtransactions that I could make through the PSN store using a credit card so that I am actually charged the purchase price for what I want to buy and no more than that, I'd consider it. However, their overpricing and distasteful practices have seriously discouraged me from making future purchases even if the greedy bastards correct them.

This guy gets EXACTLY what I was talking about. I do however get why they make you buy bits. Most online games use their OWN rl cash sytem afterall.

Jamesericmason
06-27-2013, 12:00 AM
It would be nice if Trion would comment on whether they are willing to budge on the inane pricing options they have.
But they probably won't sadly, even if Trion is decently open about themselves, anyone in charge of financial decisions like this are too big of cowards to come on and defend their current prices or admit that they really don't know what consumers want.
It's sad that the game will fail simply because the company wouldn't lower the prices of the products they sell to reach a bigger consumer audience.

Jamesericmason
06-29-2013, 07:28 PM
Bumping.... because...