Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by XBLairdawg
As far as "earning" items in game and developing skill, both require time put in. That's kinda the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maitreakow
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Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by XBLairdawg
As far as "earning" items in game and developing skill, both require time put in. That's kinda the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maitreakow
No, the point is in whatever format, games have, should, and will continue to reward dedication. RPG's do this via equipment. CoD and Battlefield do this by map knowledge, equipment, and long-term experience.
Well, for me the point of a game is fun. Different things are fun for different people so it's hard to balance things for everybody (can't please everyone.) I'm already skilled at TPS games so I didn't have to invest time to become skilled at playing Defiance.Quote:
Originally Posted by XBLairdawg
Rewards I get for investing time are just a bonus for me. I have fun shooting things and I like shooting things in Defiance. That's why I play it. I really don't care about titles, awards, rankings, etc. I'll take them if I get them, but that's not my goal. Shooting things with along with lots of people (sieges were perfect for this) is my goal and what I find fun.
Going to have to disagree with you on this 1 thing out of them all, power should not come from Time invested, Time invested should but be the means by which you cause destruction and how you look while doing it should be more spectacular/ represent you as a high level player. Higher level players should have access to more variety, but it by no means should dwarf what any player just starting can get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
Defiance ALMOST nailed this concept, and they ALMOST had the perfect PVP atmosphere for this game going, except after 1K EGO, we are all literally the same player, same stats, same weapons, same looks. Nothing looks different. I don't have giant robotic armor, or a ridiculous looking machinegun, I got the same sh*t that the guy who just bought the game yesterday has. Hell in some cases his sh*t might be better then mine. "I.E. got lucky with a random legendary EGO 100 Grenade drop." Not to mention the lack of IMMEDIATE weapon balancing caused a massive exodus of players who just plain ran out of things to do, and PVP was no longer viable due to "cloak/shotty/infectors" constantly bringing the engagement of a fight down to a mere 1-2 second encounter.
Also Trion Dev's/marketing are going about the method of money making with this game 100% wrong. The formula they have, does not go with what they are trying to do to make money. Nor does the price of items they are trying to sell, hold that much value as what they are making them out to be.
If they wanted to make money off costumes, they should have no less then 10 different color variants for each of the armors we already have. Period.
We also should have no less then 30 costumes to choose from.
The above also applies to Vehicles.
None of these costumes should cost more then $3-$4 for the complete set.
Lock boxes should GUARANTEE at LEAST a purple, there should be 1 kind of lockbox, and it should have 3 drops. The box should cost no more then $3. RNG is RNG, but this game, it is not RNG, it is RNGWR (with restrictions). We are also talking MILLIONS of combinations of what you can get from a handful of weapons. 400bits for 1 T4 box, that can give you 4 greens, is utter BS.
Bit's should be much much cheaper.
Boost should be based off time played, not server time.
Higher level EGO players should have access to multiple purchasable costumes that lower level EGO players don't. These costumes should not be able to be acquired in game, and should be bit purchase only. They also should have flare, or lights and moving gadgets, (When I see the high level players, I should say "Holy f*ck!!! That's crazy." -Guranteed Sell for long term players-
Defiance's current item mall is a greedy one/and will only cater to short term money gains. You have but a handful of items, that by purchasing 2 of them in most cases, you have already spent enough to buy the game again. This is just plain wrong.
correct, thats why consoles get a lot of negative comments from pc gamers, cause they don't have the time or patience to learn the game, to grind the game for items, to invest a lot of time into a game and not see good items or rewards for several weeks, months or even years..Quote:
Originally Posted by Moa
guess its like, if you cant beat it, nerf it..
and they wonder why this newer generation don't want to work hard, don't know how to invest time into doing something and not get a big reward right from the start..
short attention spans and lower INT means companies have to constantly add patches and dum down these games so the majority of the complainers can try and enjoy a game..
meanwhile hardcore gamers, who spend real money on these games, have a lot of friends and big groups of clans have to just deal with it?
balance is something humans are not good at,, the animals are good at balance, notice how many of them are left and how many of them we have made extinct?
guess hardcore gamers are being pushed out and going extinct to make room for the lazy part time gamers who come in and ruin and game then leave it for a game like state of decay, because they to get bored with lack of content or a challenge..
yea not all surf breaks are the same, some are for hardcore surfers only, this game had, HAD sections of it for hardcore gamers, now it just punishes the hardcore gamer with nerfs, high ark salvage fees and no depth..
my state gets hit by hurricanes, everything here is intense and a challenge and if you cant grind, then you don't make it..
Grind of die, or either cry over it..
looks like this company rewards the latter, that crying, not the grinding..
this is 2013, need to get over baby sitting ppl, time to earn it, cant always buy everything you want, even tho most tend to think they can and really get pi ssed off when they cant..
know how many racial remarks I have heard because I don't or wont sale my items for that crap you call scrip?
Plenty of people play games with no rewards, the majority of games people pay now-a-days are "time-wasters". Almost all the game sold for phones or tablets are and I know quite a few people who play them for hours on end. Prolly not the population you should shoot for in a serious On-line game, but I was only addressing this post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moa
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by XBLairdawg
This is a shooter, plenty of people have developed skill at such games in other shooters. After a minimal amount of time to adjust to Defiance specific portions I would expect them to be just as skilled in this game. Trion has already explained that they do not want items to be the focus of how well you can perform in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by MoaAs far as "earning" items in game and developing skill, both require time put in. That's kinda the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maitreakow
Once again not the best of arguments. I am not trying to be condescending at all, I am just wondering if you have really thought through why you are having the reaction you are having.
You talk about games needing imbalance. Well, it's just possible that Trion is considering a constant change in the balance of the game. And that would be the best thing to do since there's no real way to fully balance everything. Once weapons get certain mods they are meant to become powerful when coupled with certain perks, especially. So it makes sense to let their usage play out, where people have figured out magical combinations and then knock them back to keep the player off balance. It makes no sense to have an MMO shooter or any shooter for that matter devolve into a one weapon only universe. Ever play any CoD game where everyone is a sniper?
The game was headed towards a SAWs and/or Immunizers only kind of play style. Well, BORING. I may not agree with nerfing the SAW and I may rather that the real balance of all weaponry would be to apply real world mechanics to them in some way and to offset any overpowered effects with some vulnerabilities, but I do think that a constant change or alteration in just what guns do might be fun. I have no idea if this is what they're doing, but there are some hints that it may be.
So by your 'logic', the only incentive to level up is so I can play dress-up with new outfits? You sound dumb. I level up because I want to wreck ****. Borderlands embodies this to the fullest, my level 61 toons' melt faces, and they should. Why? Because I put in the hours, learning the gameplay, the nuances of every weapon to become the biggest baddest MFer in the Wasteland. Why should you at EGO 20 have access to the same stuff? You shouldn't. Plain and simple, cut and dry. You earn your ****, so start putting up. This self entitled, pompous, self deserving attitude is exactly what is wrong with society.Quote:
Originally Posted by IAMVILELENT
rule of thumb for everything in life..
time = money
money = power
no other way around it,,
diablo 2 was a perfect example of this and thats why d2 was one of the best games ever..
yes it sucked when ppl duped items and got stuff, and that took no time, but yes, there should be a balance of time and power,
its not right for a new player to come into this game and beat a ego 2500 at anything, unless they saved items from there main and muled them over, then sure they should be competitive,
thats what keeps ppl in a game, its no fun to just lose over and over, but most ppl never get better because they cant lose.
I was one of the best skinners in the world, I got that way, because no one made it easy on my, it took a lot of time and yrs to get to that point, ppl helped me when they seen I was willing to put the time into skinning to become good and not just another re skinner..
guess this is where the old world have been lost to the new world..
the old world, the one that build most of everything, train tracks, highways, sky scrapers all were built with hard labor, that took time and lil to no money or rewards..
train tracks down here in the south were built by a man named Flagler, and he got rich on the backs of slaves..
for him he didn't have to invest much of his own time in labor, he just bought slaves and made them do it..
guess thats a thing for most ppl, they want to just buy there way or have others do the dirty work for them, as in the players who cried about the infectors, they let the devs do all the work for them , instead of learning how to beat that player..
and what you said about the outfits and what prices should be, is correct..
thats why It botherd me when trions Dm's told me they wouldn't fix the infantry hero outfit we earn before adding new outfits to the store, no, they just added more lame captain America outfits to the store and told players like me, 'use another one of the outfits you earned'
seriously, that's how you roll Trion?
want to see time, effort and giving back to this community for a non profit, non selfish reasons?
check here
@totaldefiance
helping ppl when trions own twitter account won't..
If you want to get into economics we can, you'll lose, but we can. The problem with society is actually the people who have been working for 20-30 years, and feel they are entitled to everything and should be paid more because they put in more time. Sadly the people I know like this arent worth a damn, and I've fired people with low performance, so that I can have someone who has been working for 2 years, does triple the amount of work, and pay them accordingly, but back to the game kid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntpowder
Defiances formula does NOT work with "the more you play, the stronger you are" thus why I mentioned what they need to do to get on track with what it seems they are trying to create. A leveled playing field for all people who pick up the game. aka Semi-Casual. While still at least offering SOMETHING to make high level players feel high level. Right now there is nothing but a number.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maitreakow
Two good points. In case people missed it most more limited games (not MMOs) feature short campaigns and then MP that is as repetitive as heck. Mind-numbing, time wasting. And so are a lot of the mobile apps. I mean how many different ways can you create obstacles to fling birds into? But they are supposed to be fun-that's the reward. As well as the challenge to yourself. I want all the stars I can get on every level of Angry Birds. But that won't be life-changing.
I do also think it makes sense for this to not be a game where items determine success. Imagine that-it's about your actual skills maybe and not the power of your weapon. And it makes sense in this way. Ultra rare items have things that make them potentially more powerful. But they're ultra rare. So that means only a few will ever have them. If Trion had made success in this game dependent upon owning an ultra rare gun then imagine how many people would just give up.
I do honestly believe Trion took some lessons from Demon's Souls and Dark Souls for this game. In those games (swords, bows, magic, and all) your success was not dependent upon the weapon you used, but on your tactics and strategies. The armor and items you had could help but they often had some downside that meant the player had to adjust. Sure in those games there were hindrances to what you could do at lower levels. But you still could go through them with a really low level character and succeed if you were patient and used strategy rather than brute force.
Nim in particular is very similar to bosses in those games and he can be beaten using almost anything, if you use the right strategy. I wouldn't want someone to get to Nim and find out they need an Orange Super Soaker in order to defeat him and then have to grind forever for the chance that one day they might find one. He can be beaten using only a BMG or an Infector or whatever. And I think that makes sense.
It's similar to other shooters in that you shoot things, but that's where likeness ends. I didn't have a game manual on breaking stuff down, adding mod slots, removing mods, changing perks, rolling to stop fire, where to shoot enemies. I didn't have a game manual on nano effects. Did you? I didn't have someone leading me around by the ear showing me everything, did you? I had to figure **** out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maitreakow
The whole reason I was trying to EGO up was to earn perks, I'm only 1650, now it's all done. Sure I may unlock more perks to choose from, but I can use all nine slots. They literally took the challenge away from me. And for what? For WHO? In fact with the added salvage costs, they are punishing me for raising in EGO. How does that make ANY sense?
what do you mean headed towards a saw or immunizer kind of play style?
are you that new? showing 1040 replies at the forums so I assume you have been around defiance for awhile..
maybe the saw is needed and maybe, just maybe the immunizer is fun for players who have lvl 20 weapon skills in almost all the other weapons,, oh but its okay for snipers to cloak and snipe from roof tops, but yet when someone brings in a skill level 20 in infectors and a immunizer and counters that, oh no, thats a problem now, cause the original sniper is now on these forums with all his mates who just got pwned, crying..
this game since release was a saws world. its a needed weapon and ppl have learned to use diff weapons and come to enjoy them..
my saw, det & ar skill level has been 20 for weeks now, why should I not be able to enjoy the OTHER weapons of the game?
oh thats right cause they own in pvp when I use them, or when me and my friends actually play pvp together, then it don't matter what weapons we use, cause we play as a unit and kill most of everything..
im more frustrated about the weapon changes cause I enjoy them in PVE, pvp don't even matter in this game, theres no scoreboard on even xbl for this, theres no TWL either..
do any of you know what TWL even is?
and if they have serious competition ladders to play these games with real rewards and payouts then why should I not be able to be a hardcore gamer who uses everything at my disposal?
oh thats right, cause once again its not fair for the mediocre players,
either way, I belive ppl like my wife should be able to come home and enjoy this game, she works hard and likes to unwind by playing this game, with the perks open now she can some more, but if you take away the saw and certain weapons she will just spend all of her time dieing, cause she isn't a hardcore shooter fan,, she likes fighting games, but enjoys the open world, free roam of this game..
So, basically what your saying is that you need handycap to beat a player that just started playing, BUT because he is a noob he must be a shtako player...right!?Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
I understand the lvl up sistem, but in fact you are saying that because you played so many hours, then you should own evry player that is under your level...right!?
Even if that player can kick yur shtako sorry ***, just because is skilled.
I`m sorry to say, but 95% of the player base on this forum, and i say forum, are pure whiners.
Ps:***=arse
Right! Because you are the only person here who owns a company, great job on that assumption. I've fired more 20 somethings because they were lazy and expected the world on the platter.Quote:
Originally Posted by IAMVILELENT
and if trion didn't want the focus on this game to be items, then why is everyone a fiend when it comes to these so called legendary items?
because real gamers in this community laugh and make jokes about the so called legendary items being orange, just a color,,
and why does trion sale lock boxes for real money, and on top of that why did @defiancegame reply to me saying ppl where farming keys way to fast on the NA xbl servers?
why if weapons and items where never suppose to be the focus, then tell me why all patches have been made, or the bulk of these patches made to favor nerfs?
to not favor game play issues, yes as of late, trion has been fixing some of them, last perk leaving fixed, the annoying reload over and over glitch fixed,, but yet these fixes from something like that came late in this game and came after nerfs were made to SAWs ROF, certain shotguns mag size and everyone who actually played this game since launch,
how many of you all rem the north star flare and what it use to be?
trion sent our nerfs and patches early in this game that was solely directed at weapons and pvp, it made a lot of ppl quit, because none of the real game play issues where being dealt with..
true trion seems to be doing some good things, but just like this, its another community joke as well, when trions sends out a patch that does fix one thing, they mess up two other things in the process..
I have enough energy to fight the world, and right now I don't mind doing it, cause I enjoyed this game, spent a lot of time and effort in it, sold it to a lot of friends and ppl I didn't know, and for what?
if everyone was silent and just went with the flow, everyone would be a lemming, sorry but I have a name and I stand for something, sorry if I don't just fall In line and follow everyone else's lead.
na bro, I have plenty of screenshots with ego 64, ego 250, 700, smoking arkfalls, smoking pvp out.Quote:
Originally Posted by drackiller
im saying I enjoy the weapons and perks I worked for, I don't enjoy new players or ppl like you flaming and talking smack when you can see I don't have thousand of replys on these forums,
I accept defeat with open arms if I can learn from it, but what trions doing and trolls like you do, I don't learn anything from, except for, walk away cause its pointless, and in time thats just what I will, giving you the whole field to play with your lil friends and you childish a ss PS remarks..
Judging from that reply, you own nothing, and have never fired anyone, let alone even been a manager of something lol. Such an exact number, "20 somethings" lol...Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntpowder
Thanks for acknowledgeing the rest of the reply though.
That's the age of the workers. Fresh from trade school, hot to trot in the industry. They don't last 6 months, because school fills them with pipe dreams and hopes. Exact number? 8, and I can name every one of them. I don't enjoy it. But I have nothing to prove to you, I don't need justification. I know who I am and what I do.Quote:
Originally Posted by IAMVILELENT
As to the rest of your comment, you merely stated what you believe to be the long term goal of the developers. Could be right, don't really care.
Grinding isn't challenge. It's boring.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntpowder
They adjusted it because they noticed people most likely stopped playing around the 1000 mark, because grinding above that to 2000+ to get just one more slot feels futile and painful to the normal gamer (one that doesn't career game/play 16 hours a day 7 days a week).
Completing pursuits to rank up, I do not consider that grinding. To me that's level progression. But it's all perception.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lollie
Repeat content (especially when confined to the same map) is grinding. Killing the same mobs over and over again = grinding. A goalpost (such as an extra perk slot) that takes too long to reach = grinding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntpowder
If you didn't enjoy it, you wouldn't have mentioned it. Saying you have nothing to prove only furthers my previous comment into being more probable. I'm sure you know who you are and what you do, but you would never really say here on a forum, because you have nothing to prove and don't need justification. Funny how you took a comment of me putting an example of what REALLY is happening in society, and blew it out of proportion as if this was some sort of "My life is better then yours, and I'm going to prove it, but not really." scenario. To compare what is going on in games to real life society further proves you have no idea what you're talking about, and if your company or where you supposedly worked was regulated by OSHA,FDA,GBA,EPA, or even the SBA or BBB, you would know this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntpowder
Back on topic:
Defiance was never intended to reward long term players, at least not now, we all knew this when we went from BETA to day 1 and realized on day 5 we had done EVERYTHING this game had to offer. We all know this now as we reach the 3k-5k ego range and realize we are picking up the same sh*t and doing the EXACT SAME THING from when we first started almost 3 months ago. If you think otherwise, you're fooling yourself into thinking this is an actual sustainable long term mmo that won't fizzle out by next generation console launch.
Trion knows they are in trouble, the Defiance development teams knows they need to start making moves and fast, and we're talking a month to 2 months fast, during and before DLC launch. If this DLC launch turns out to be a failure, "Steady Decline in player base." You can rest assured they will start looking for ways to salvage what is left of this sinking ship, the remaining DLC will be nothing but a few recycled projects that never made it to game, along with a few costumes, as to minimize development cost, and as long as you get 5 things labeled as DLC, no one gets a refund. Hell once you get the first DLC your f*cked if you're trying to get your money back.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAMVILELENT
Right, because you were the one who likened my comment on young society to the workplace and firing people, and you were the one who assumed you are the only business owner, and yet again you assume more that I enjoyed firing people. It is regulated by OSHA, and the EPA, and the joke of a BBB, and I do work with the SBA/Chase because no I couldn't afford to buy into this on my own. No, my life isn't better than most, but I try. Sounds like Blu has the right idea, a home in Costa Rica.
I didn't play the beta. I wasn't even going to give this game a fair shake until a group of friends pestered me into trying it. And even then it was a least a month or two after release.
and this handicap you speak of it just what im fighting about, handicaps for new players..Quote:
Originally Posted by drackiller
never seen a game developer coddle its ppl so much..
anyways, I had to go and do this real quick, its blurry and my toons ego is only like 828, same toon I used at ego 64 to dominate with, same ego 64 toon I used to get both kill shots at arkfalls, same toon that let me know, back in the first few weeks this game came out, how easy it was and how little egos and perks really meant, they didn't mean nothing then and don't mean much now, only when you go against another great player like blu will you truly need them,
don't be jelly..
http://imageshack.com/scaled/modthumb/163/4dzz.jpg
link for bigger size . http://imageshack.com/scaled/large/163/4dzz.jpg
You guys must be new to no subscription MMO's. They lack funding, and staff for fast new content, so they release it at a crawling pace.
As a MMOFPS, w/e you may call this type of genre, its very hard to make it "Competitive". Exspecially as a open world game. It would be very hard to do PVE, exspecially Arkfalls. If this was a WoW type system with "Raid weapons" You could probally down a Arkfall in seconds at a "lower lvl zone". I believe trion tried to make it, as realistic as possible, in a terraformed world. Everyone is the same level, no "raid" weapons or overpowered weapons. A new player, can group with a max ego player, and still have difficulty in a dungeon, rather than a high level doing a low level dungeon run in 3 seconds (AKA WoW).
Lol, obviously you like to say whatever you want, but don`t like the replies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
And no, i`m not a new player, i play from almost the very beggining.
No, i don`t troll, i made only one reply to something that i thought it was pertinent
I never single out any user with bad mouth lingo and my childish PS remark like you said, was only to state that it was not an insult.
Last, the part that you say, and those are your words : I dont`t enjoy new players or ppl like you flaming... to me this says a lot about you.
Have a good life m8.
Why would i be "jelly" ? Good for you, i can do that with my EGO 50. In fact i did that a few days ago, it`s not about the perks or equipment it`s about the way you play, and when i say YOU, i mean people in general.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
The problem is the PVP, it shouldn`t be so unbalanced, and i can give you an example with COD games.
In any Call of Duty that i have played, any new player can enter the game and go against high ranked players and win the game.
I`m primarily an HCTDM player and i can only say that when i start to play from lvl1 i can compete with any one in the game.
It`s not easy at first for a noob but there`s a chance for any skilled player to go against high ranking players and make good scores.
Here in Defiance it is completly unbalanced, and it`s that lack of balance that some don`t want to lose.
Sorry if i was a little abrupt at first, wasn`t my intention, i`m here only to play and have fun not to make enemies even that may be virtual.
Peace bro.
What you're talking about is fundamentally changing the foundation of this game to be based on one singular variable (time played) rather than having the players skill determin a victory. It's simple, if you're good then you're good. Not, if a number denoting the amount of time spent in game is 5000 then you're good. Honestly I was hoping this game would have been more RPGish, unfortunately it isn't because I think the games potential would have been so much more with progression. However I've come to terms with the game, it is what it is.
Wow. You really are a c**k aren't you? More often than not, when one "boasts" about their lives it's usually bullsh*t. Like idiots who tell people that they're "so crazy", or continue to press to others "I don't care what people think", when clearly they do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
By the way, just because your wife's parents live in Costa Rica doesn't constitute as you having "homes " (plural) all over the country. 150 mph? Come to the UK. We all drive that fast. But does anyone feel the need to mention it...ever? No. Why? Because it's really, really, not a big deal. Certainly never warrants mentioning by anyone over the age of 17. But then you're just so "crazy" though, aren't you?
One last thing. I hate to be the "grammar Police", but perhaps if you spent less time playing games when you were a kid and more time a school, you wouldn't come across as a barely literate 12 year old. You might be perfectly happy with people's perception of you. After all, you no doubt "don't care" what people think (even though you wrote a post telling us how wonderful you and your life are), but as we all know that's not the case...yes, you do come across as a major moron.
Could be a suitable gamer tag for you...'Major Moron'.
The way I see it the guy with maxed skills should have an advantage, but a new player who has more skill should be able to kill them first. Gear should help, but skill must be more important.