I am an infector user, here is all the bugs, now please nerf shotgun damage

Infectors are OP as anything. I will tell you the bugs that make it OP. Just please nerf shotguns since they are far worse.

1. Infector burst +1 mod does not give you full burst, it gives you full auto
2. If the first hit is a crit all of the infector damage over time is a crit
3. This one is HUGEEEEEEE, the bugs DO NOT deal the damage it says i.e. 34 damage they do up to 700 damage each. This bug has not been revealed on the forums.

This is why you die in 2s flat from an infector. Now understand that the shotgun is even more overpowered than the 40 range 2s killing immunizer that is full auto with bugs that deal insane amounts of damage.

Nerf both these weapons so we can have fun please.

-The bug damage stat is actually the dot damage. Bugs are supposed to do that much damage.
-The dot damage can crit?!
-A real bug is that none of the added damage perks/abilities actually add damage to infector's bugs and or dot damage

1. yeah this is a bug. someone posted on the forums they reported it a dev and it's getting looked at.
2. haven't noticed this, although maybe it's intended?
3. i think this is more of a tooltip error than a bug. reason being is that if the bugs actually only did 34 damage infectors would be by far the lowest dps gun in the game. i doubt that is the intention.

Yeah the bug damage on the tooltip actually has nothing to do with the damage the actual bugs do. I dont know why they named it that. I have an FX Tactical Innoculator that does 0 bug damage on the tooltip, but it spawns bugs and they do a lot of damage.

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Originally Posted by Ravzar

Infectors are OP as anything. I will tell you the bugs that make it OP. Just please nerf shotguns since they are far worse.

1. Infector burst +1 mod does not give you full burst, it gives you full auto
2. If the first hit is a crit all of the infector damage over time is a crit
3. This one is HUGEEEEEEE, the bugs DO NOT deal the damage it says i.e. 34 damage they do up to 700 damage each. This bug has not been revealed on the forums.

This is why you die in 2s flat from an infector. Now understand that the shotgun is even more overpowered than the 40 range 2s killing immunizer that is full auto with bugs that deal insane amounts of damage.

Nerf both these weapons so we can have fun please.

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Don't cry about shotguns. They are shotguns, CQC. You have an infector, stop getting close. Do shadow wars.
No valid stats/feedback about shotguns? Probably because you haven't used them.

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Originally Posted by Arache

Don't cry about shotguns. They are shotguns, CQC. You have an infector, stop getting close. Do shadow wars.
No valid stats/feedback about shotguns? Probably because you haven't used them.

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If you do your own research and want to tell me why you think shotguns are balanced, I would be happy to talk it over with you. However, merely stating that close quarters weapons should be good in close quarters does not mean that shotguns are not overpowered. I have many shotguns and one of them does the same damage at medium range as it does close range and has 0 recoil or bloom and a 15 mag. It's not very balanced. I have shotguns that one shot people from cloak. I have shotguns that fire a 3 round burst in rapid succession doing 900 per hit. The scatterguns are only half the story. I can normally survive a scattergunner even if they come up from cloak (running 5 defensive perks and a rhino shield). The other shotguns around are completely insane as they don't have individual reload and can do similar damage like 71x16 with full mag reload etc and a very tightly packed ball of pellets.

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Originally Posted by Arache

Don't cry about shotguns. They are shotguns, CQC. You have an infector, stop getting close. Do shadow wars.
No valid stats/feedback about shotguns? Probably because you haven't used them.

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Even in shadow wars, a supposedly open world pvp, shotguns are dominant. Might be a sign that the weapon type needs a second look as a whole.

Shotguns should be handled from a falloff damage angle. They should suffer the worst from falloff damage yet they are on par with smg and pistol. AR/LMG need a buff in regards to falloff damage while they are at it since it is pathetic that they barely out range smg's. Trion didn't do a good job of giving weapons a niche or range at which they are effective. Their CQC is too big and mid range is non-existant, while long range is out of the question because of draw distance and the current maps. So some better calibrating the effective ranges of weapons would go a long ways.

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Originally Posted by ChaosOneX

Even in shadow wars, a supposedly open world pvp, shotguns are dominant. Might be a sign that the weapon type needs a second look as a whole.

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Because it's capture and hold. And nothing says 'Get off my flag' quite like a shotgun to the face. But that's mainly due to a lack of teamplay and sniper skill. If you had a sniper clearing a point, Shotgunners would ragequit.

But since most player do it like:

"Hop on ATV. Drive to point. Stop on point regardless if people around. Dismount and try to kill defenders in close range" - there's no surprise shotguns are dominant in Shadow War too. Shotguns will always be dominant if people purposefully drive into other peoples face before starting to shoot.

Ranged weapons were the biggest influence on warfare. When the first dude brought a bow to a sword fight, they were all like "Waaaahh??? Dude, that's OP! Someone nerf that bow!". But alas, the bow nerf never happened. So, not being idiots, the other dudes got bows of their own. The first bros, not to be outdone, made bigger bows, the long bow. Then the dudes were all like, "What?? Oh come on, a long bow?! NERFz0r!"...but a nerfz0r did not come. And so the arms race continued for centuries, each side building bigger weapons and better weapons, with no nerf in sight (unless you count the biological weapons ban from the Geneva convention, et. al.).

The lesson here: adapt or die. Don't like shotguns, don't charge blindly into battle where you know they're at. Stop 100 meters before the capture point, scope out the terrain, see where their at, and kill them from distance.

I agree with the players approach. I.e driving to point A getting off ATV and trying to kill as many people as you can around the capture beacon. However, the main reasons Shotgun seem more OP is because all the TDM are mostly made for close range combat. YWaterfront has very view and good clearings to snipe or battle long distance, this is a close quarters map. Observatory, has a few spots to snipe but is srongly a close to mid range shooting ground. I Freightyard map the best, it allows all player to play how they want i.e short range, mid range and long range combat, I wish this was a TDM map and a 16 vs 16 map or more. However, most people prefer to play close range combat, as mid range and long range combat is more challenging.

Do some guns need to be slightly balanced... of course, but I don't think weapons need to be greatly nerfed. I would rather see additional perks for an ego skills that causes weak spots against certain ego powers. Deco has one perk that allows you to detect cloakers, etc need skills like this.

go shadow war ther u can snipne n do ur ranged stuff - as said before infects or atleast the pre launch ones should be rolled to the one u find now in store that does the decent amount of dmg , and why would u nerf shooties. Atm 2of3 pvp maps are melee - place ur skills right and its not hard to kill down a shotgun maniac :)

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Originally Posted by Cerealkilla

Ranged weapons were the biggest influence on warfare. When the first dude brought a bow to a sword fight, they were all like "Waaaahh??? Dude, that's OP! Someone nerf that bow!". But alas, the bow nerf never happened. So, not being idiots, the other dudes got bows of their own. The first bros, not to be outdone, made bigger bows, the long bow. Then the dudes were all like, "What?? Oh come on, a long bow?! NERFz0r!"...but a nerfz0r did not come. And so the arms race continued for centuries, each side building bigger weapons and better weapons, with no nerf in sight (unless you count the biological weapons ban from the Geneva convention, et. al.).

The lesson here: adapt or die. Don't like shotguns, don't charge blindly into battle where you know they're at. Stop 100 meters before the capture point, scope out the terrain, see where their at, and kill them from distance.

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lol i can't tell you how many times i see somone tof ar away for me to kill with a shotgun run right up to me and try to ADS with a LMG from 5 feet away. of course there gonna got owned, bad players are bad players

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Originally Posted by Ravzar

Infectors are OP as anything. I will tell you the bugs that make it OP. Just please nerf shotguns since they are far worse.

1. Infector burst +1 mod does not give you full burst, it gives you full auto
2. If the first hit is a crit all of the infector damage over time is a crit
3. This one is HUGEEEEEEE, the bugs DO NOT deal the damage it says i.e. 34 damage they do up to 700 damage each. This bug has not been revealed on the forums.

This is why you die in 2s flat from an infector. Now understand that the shotgun is even more overpowered than the 40 range 2s killing immunizer that is full auto with bugs that deal insane amounts of damage.

Nerf both these weapons so we can have fun please.

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I am an infector user too almost maxed out infector skill i usually pvp 80 percent of my gameplay time

its homing
it puts annoying stuff on ur screen so u cant see that well
sometimes when it hits u in the head it gets a crit

but honestly 90 percent of the time from a guy with full hp and shields it takes me a clip and a half to kill him does it really need a nerf or does a one shot shotgun in the back not even a headshot needs a nerf

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Originally Posted by Cerealkilla

Ranged weapons were the biggest influence on warfare. When the first dude brought a bow to a sword fight, they were all like "Waaaahh??? Dude, that's OP! Someone nerf that bow!". But alas, the bow nerf never happened. So, not being idiots, the other dudes got bows of their own. The first bros, not to be outdone, made bigger bows, the long bow. Then the dudes were all like, "What?? Oh come on, a long bow?! NERFz0r!"...but a nerfz0r did not come. And so the arms race continued for centuries, each side building bigger weapons and better weapons, with no nerf in sight (unless you count the biological weapons ban from the Geneva convention, et. al.).

The lesson here: adapt or die. Don't like shotguns, don't charge blindly into battle where you know they're at. Stop 100 meters before the capture point, scope out the terrain, see where their at, and kill them from distance.

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I like your story ^^ does it end with one button nuclear bombs WhAAAAA NErFzoR ^^

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Originally Posted by ChaosOneX

Even in shadow wars, a supposedly open world pvp, shotguns are dominant. Might be a sign that the weapon type needs a second look as a whole.

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Yes, as if people won't go abuse another weapon type which will end up overpowering a shotgun in PvP. You can nerf you gun, but you won't change childish actions. Again I wonder why so many of you care, there's no PvP K.D ratio, so I honestly think everyone should just stop crying.

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Originally Posted by Escalith

Because it's capture and hold. And nothing says 'Get off my flag' quite like a shotgun to the face. But that's mainly due to a lack of teamplay and sniper skill. If you had a sniper clearing a point, Shotgunners would ragequit.

But since most player do it like:

"Hop on ATV. Drive to point. Stop on point regardless if people around. Dismount and try to kill defenders in close range" - there's no surprise shotguns are dominant in Shadow War too. Shotguns will always be dominant if people purposefully drive into other peoples face before starting to shoot.

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I use a TACC Rifle, and I usually try to keep my distance, thing is, shadow wars is full of blur/shotty and cloak/shotty

and detonators... see them more in SW than Competitive

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Originally Posted by Arache

Yes, as if people won't go abuse another weapon type which will end up overpowering a shotgun in PvP. You can nerf you gun, but you won't change childish actions. Again I wonder why so many of you care, there's no PvP K.D ratio, so I honestly think everyone should just stop crying.

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I run with three other people, we have a pretty good setup.

But there are so many people running round with the cloak and blur setup in shadow wars that it doesn't matter how you plan it, there's just too many damn shotguns. I don't give a flying **** about KD, but I play pvp to have fun. Thing is, with so many people running around with a low skill weapon and ways to remove its weakness, that I don't have fun anymore.

And part of why it bothers me is that all the shotty users kept saying do SW, do SW because it's more open

and it was a load of BULL ****. Right now, in pvp, shotguns are the easiest to use weapon, and given cloak or blur, one of the hardest setups to avoid.

Shotguns in shadow wars are more balanced since the maps are so big.

This game just isn't worth playing until they 1. fix infectors 2. nerf shotguns 3. fix ADS but then nerf carbine burst to compensate for the fixed ADS.

It's just not fun in pvp with shotgun and/or infector play and there is no pve content left. We did that. We did the side missions and the story and there is nothing left to do. Without good pvp it's just lame. I am sick of getting one shot. I have even been one shot by people using their stupid 1 mag shotgun to regenerate their shield so they can have near perma shield. They do not mean to kill me, I just did since I may drop down off a building as they are firing etc. Shotguns need their damage nerfed and should be point blank, like in halo. In halo shotguns one shot point blank and sucked any other time. People still did well with them even though the maps were like 2 - 6 times the size of the maps in defiance.

Shotguns aren't SO bad... I've used them a decent amount, though generally I like to run with an assault rifle and a sniper (either bolt or semi depending on the mood)

Problem with sniping is the shot register. I've had games in Shadow War where I've held up at a point and been able to defend it fairly well from range with a sniper and a little team work. But then I've had matches where no matter where I shot them, half of my damn bullets wouldn't register. It was as though I was shooting a holographic image, the bullets would pass right through.

Granted I'm nowhere near the best sniper, but there is room for improvement in the hitbox/synching arena for those of us that prefer a ranged game.

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Originally Posted by Ravzar

Infectors are OP as anything. I will tell you the bugs that make it OP. Just please nerf shotguns since they are far worse.

1. Infector burst +1 mod does not give you full burst, it gives you full auto
2. If the first hit is a crit all of the infector damage over time is a crit
3. This one is HUGEEEEEEE, the bugs DO NOT deal the damage it says i.e. 34 damage they do up to 700 damage each. This bug has not been revealed on the forums.

This is why you die in 2s flat from an infector. Now understand that the shotgun is even more overpowered than the 40 range 2s killing immunizer that is full auto with bugs that deal insane amounts of damage.

Nerf both these weapons so we can have fun please.

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You can't be critically hit on a damage over time.

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Originally Posted by Slay

You can't be critically hit on a damage over time.

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Yes you can. Take your infector (an immunizer will make it easier) and aim higher than you normally would, so the head is still in aim but nearer to the bottom part. You want the first shot to hit the head. I have seen 723 damage over time on a crit. Bug damage always does a standard 538 damage and cannot crit, while damage over time does 538 damage normally and 723 on a crit. If the little attacks of 4 crit and turn into 5, you will get crit dot damage too. I think too the gunslinger perk effects it since I remember getting 6xx without it and 7xx with it.

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Originally Posted by greatdividers

1. yeah this is a bug. someone posted on the forums they reported it a dev and it's getting looked at.
2. haven't noticed this, although maybe it's intended?
3. i think this is more of a tooltip error than a bug. reason being is that if the bugs actually only did 34 damage infectors would be by far the lowest dps gun in the game. i doubt that is the intention.

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yeh that was me that was talking to lance the community manager, he replied after a couple of days telling me it is working as intended. so i told him i will make a private video about it showing exactly why it is rediculous and he is looking forward to it since im pretty well known on youtube for mixing around with professonal players across cod,cs,lol,wow ect. Altho ive gotten myself bored of the game so i havnt bothered to do it just yet.

Also to add about shotguns being "OP" they arent OP its just that combined with the cloak its OP, Although a simple fix to anyone reading this. Use whatever primary you want, and have a saw off showgun as your secondary, once a cloaker opens on you with the shotgun, jump in the air while swtiching to the saw-odd and have fun 1 shotting him. Very easy defense ive been using lately and still have no problem pulling off 20 kill games in observ with AR's/Snipers ect.

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Originally Posted by Ravzar

Yes you can. Take your infector (an immunizer will make it easier) and aim higher than you normally would, so the head is still in aim but nearer to the bottom part. You want the first shot to hit the head. I have seen 723 damage over time on a crit. Bug damage always does a standard 538 damage and cannot crit, while damage over time does 538 damage normally and 723 on a crit. If the little attacks of 4 crit and turn into 5, you will get crit dot damage too. I think too the gunslinger perk effects it since I remember getting 6xx without it and 7xx with it.

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That is not the dot affect. Dot stands for damage over time. What you are referring to does not do damage over time but rather damage applied to the target after it has been hit three or more times. There are 3 stages of damage: hit 3 or more times burst, dot affect (usually around 50 dmg unless 0 or cranker), and lastly bug damage.

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Originally Posted by Jigglypuffs

That is not the dot affect. Dot stands for damage over time. What you are referring to does not do damage over time but rather damage applied to the target after it has been hit three or more times. There are 3 stages of damage: hit 3 or more times burst, dot affect (usually around 50 dmg unless 0 or cranker), and lastly bug damage.

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Well fine, if the first burst hit crits they all crit until you run out of ammo.

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Originally Posted by Ravzar

Well fine, if the first burst hit crits they all crit until you run out of ammo.

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I can confirm this. In fact, during hellbug arkfalls I'll wait till the skitterling bites the crystal, and get a full 3-stack dot rolling as a crit with my canker which i maintain until I run out of ammo. I think it's an unintended side affect that if the dot is applied from a hit that crits, the dot is crit damage until it falls off. This is easy enough to duplicate, and you can confirm it with perks such as the one that gives you a crit multiplier bonus when crouching.

And I just saw the dam dot critting. The stupid small damage thing? That crits too. The 5 damage crits, the little dot that ticks for 30x crits, and the burst thing crits. This should not be hard to reproduce if you wanted to. I shouldn't need to resort to the trouble of making a video.

Interesting thread.
In my experience the infector (immunizer) varies a lot in effectiveness depending on how well my opponents play against it. I can go 8-0-9 in one Waterfront and literally 0-4-2 in the next one.
And why shouldn't it be able to crit? All other weapons can crit, right?
My personal little addition to this thread would be that the distance nerf of all the other types of infectors have done nothing other than effectively removing them from the game. I mean homing range 10... fat chance of me using that.

Imo, in conjunction with a shotgun nerf, they should make the burst mod just add the +1 shot per volley like its supposed to do and reduce the bug speed a little more. Not much more, just a little more. Often I kill people I have never seen and did not even though were there just from bugs.

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Originally Posted by Jigglypuffs

That is not the dot affect. Dot stands for damage over time. What you are referring to does not do damage over time but rather damage applied to the target after it has been hit three or more times. There are 3 stages of damage: hit 3 or more times burst, dot affect (usually around 50 dmg unless 0 or cranker), and lastly bug damage.

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The cankers dot can crit if u hit them in the head I've done it tons lol

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Originally Posted by Fiox

The cankers dot can crit if u hit them in the head I've done it tons lol

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Yes dots can crit. The canker uses nothing but dots. Immunizers and such dots can crit too im assuming. Just the dot damage on immunizers is insignifigant like 51 when critting not 250-400 like on cankers.

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Originally Posted by ChaosOneX

Even in shadow wars, a supposedly open world pvp, shotguns are dominant. Might be a sign that the weapon type needs a second look as a whole.

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This, I usually go around 30-50 kills to 3-10 deaths on Shadow War just Using Nano Fragger+VoT Grind Fragger+Cloak, and theyre only so "overpowered" because all the other guns are shockingly bad, like smg's that you can put 2 clips into somebody and they don't die, if they sorted out the other guns shotguns wouldnt be so OP :L

Everyone always complains about things being OP in PvP. If it's so OP, then perhaps you should be using it too. Cloak and shotgun is a blast to play. If I had to change one thing about PvP, it would be the bunny hopping, not because it's hard to do, but because PvP should be more than a hopping match. It looks ridiculous. I hardly do it and really enjoy killing those silly clowns who do. I agree that jumping is a defensive tactic to cause the enemy to miss, but come on people, lets dial it back a bit. Maybe some diminishing returns would be in order.
And as for the "OP" weapons, I say this: Get one and quit crying. Then get a good build with a mix of defensive and offensive abilities. There's plenty of builds posted out there.

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Originally Posted by Quickhatch

Everyone always complains about things being OP in PvP. If it's so OP, then perhaps you should be using it too. Cloak and shotgun is a blast to play. If I had to change one thing about PvP, it would be the bunny hopping, not because it's hard to do, but because PvP should be more than a hopping match. It looks ridiculous. I hardly do it and really enjoy killing those silly clowns who do. I agree that jumping is a defensive tactic to cause the enemy to miss, but come on people, lets dial it back a bit. Maybe some diminishing returns would be in order.
And as for the "OP" weapons, I say this: Get one and quit crying. Then get a good build with a mix of defensive and offensive abilities. There's plenty of builds posted out there.

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Since the dawn of time people have been calling things OP, and since then others have told them to use the same thing! Some players prefer not too use the OP things (not saying I agree with the OP label), or even enjoy whatever playstyle comes with it.

Not everything can be balanced, but sometimes it is obvious that certain perks, egos, weapons etc are outperforming others. I have no solution though :(

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Originally Posted by Quickhatch

Everyone always complains about things being OP in PvP. If it's so OP, then perhaps you should be using it too. Cloak and shotgun is a blast to play. If I had to change one thing about PvP, it would be the bunny hopping, not because it's hard to do, but because PvP should be more than a hopping match. It looks ridiculous. I hardly do it and really enjoy killing those silly clowns who do. I agree that jumping is a defensive tactic to cause the enemy to miss, but come on people, lets dial it back a bit. Maybe some diminishing returns would be in order.
And as for the "OP" weapons, I say this: Get one and quit crying. Then get a good build with a mix of defensive and offensive abilities. There's plenty of builds posted out there.

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So your solution is to make a game that never evolves or changes? You want to play a game where there is only one option?