Trion needs to do somthing quick or there hardcore players are leaving,

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Originally Posted by Anderson

I've heard you say this quite a bit, and I've been thinking about it.

I don't think this is a game that necessarily should be or was intended to be super challenging.

I think this game is a "shooter" in the same sense that GTA or the various knock offs are. And those games weren't super hard because that wasn't really the point. The shooter aspect was there so you have a way to make fights entertaining because you have to have some sort of combat in a game to keep it interesting.

But the shooter part was ultimately secondary to the exploration aspect of an open world. The ability to go around and mess with stuff at your own pace.

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Unfortunately, as this is a service and not simply a game that lives inside a box (like GTA) the developers don't have the option to provide only one "box" of content and leave it at that. They'll hemorrhage players otherwise. Games, just like movies, books, or comics, are driven by conflict in some way. "Conflict" in the case of games is a problem that needs to be solved in some way by the player.

Create an objective with a trivial method of reaching it and you'll end up with the same reaction as someone reading a book and guessing the ending thirty pages in-- boredom, possibly coupled with flipping to the last page and setting the book aside. Or on fire.

Games must continuously focus on a loop of objective-action-solution of ever-increasing difficulty to stay engaging. This does not mean raids are essential, nor is any specific type of content-- just as long as that ever-increasing difficulty is preserved in some other way.

The way Defiance is structured right now, there's a series of these cycles at each new tier of AI: Mutant, raider, 99er, scrapper, Dark Matter. That's great. What's not so great is Dark Matter gets old quickly, and we're left with an intermediate (at best) challenge/solution cycle as the ultimate tier of content. For this game to earn the right to be a live game, we new tiers of increasingly-difficult AI to justify it being a live game.

As it is, there's no reason they needed to make this an MMO. They could've just made a lobby shooter or a drop-in co-op game like GTA. Harder instances could help, but I'm hesitant to suggest raids until they show me they can create legitimate co-op content.

In summary:
1. New tiers of enemies. Even for solo. Solo/duo would be great.
2. Prove this is an MMO and a TPS with legitimate co-op.

I am higher than all currently stated EGOs in this thread,i'm still here.That said,i fully understand most of the complaints and the reasoning behind them.One thing i don't understand (and i have said it before) is why people who claim to want a title to work seem so happy to kick others out the door.The last thing you should want is the games community to drop,moreso for a MMO.

This isn't one of those F2P games that can afford to take there time fixing stuff and dribble in new content.This game needs to keep its player-base happy so they will keep putting money in the pot and keep bringing new players in with there praise of a great game.If that doesn't happen then the game will be dropped.I really hope Trion can pull their **** together and find a rythem for getting things fixed in a timely and satisfactory manner because i would be devasted if this game fails.

On topic,i would love some more meaningful and fun group content but i want a fully functional game first,so i can wait a while longer.And please stop with the PVP is the be-all and end-all comments.This game (like many others) has 2 sides and not everybody will enjoy both.I don't mind a little PVP but i am here for the PVE content first and foremost.As far as the PVP goes though,you have 1 cool game-mode that can be a pain in the **** to get going and 2 tiny CQ TDM maps.I personally find TDM boring (and it has nothing to do with skill as i am usually 1st or 2nd even if on the losing team,i just prefer objective modes),as such i was excited to see FY C&H was at last making it in only to get ripped back out before we in the EU even got to try it out.

Sorry for the long post,i got a little carried away it seems.

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Originally Posted by OMGBEES

We are all quitting. Even the streamers are quitting... there are only 62 people total watching Defiance streams right now. Its a ghost town.

Its a shame really.... Defiance could have been something special.

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I'm pretty sure we ALL aren't quitting (yet). Although most of us will quit over time. The longest I've ever played any game (DAoC) was 12 years. Some I only played a few hours and knew they weren't for me.

I enjoy Defiance and will continue to play for some time. I want to see what this game is when the devs get it fleshed out.

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Originally Posted by FrostEffect

The average butthurt player just because he doesn't have the time to play a game and earn his ranking yet crys about others who have devoted their time into it. Do you honestly think devs read this sh**? Do you even know how pathetic it sounds to hear a random tell a dev their sh** sucks after they've spent 5+ years in the gaming industry? Can you model? Can you code? You may have the ideas for them to implement but damn... its easier said then done. Sure the game should still be in beta and things could have been released better but they're fcking trying their hardest to appeal to the player.

Sorry but you and everyone else that flames devs want sh** spoon fed to them and its so damn pathetic, get your head outa your ***; let them do their job and support them for what they are doing or walk.

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I can tell that you are a fan of this game. I am too. However, telling people who's opinion disagrees with yours to walk away from the game is NOT in Trion's best interest. Trion needs to keep players in order to make money so they can afford to continue developing content to support those of us who do enjoy this game.

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Originally Posted by Schwa

I don't need to model or code because I paid Trion to do that. They haven't delivered, and continue to drop the ball.

I stick around because I support the idea of Defiance, not on their piss-poor implementation of that idea. I intend on being the best thorn in their side I can possibly be until they deliver, or the game collapses under Trion's inability to support its own game.

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Well said. Trion needs to hear from the 'thorns'. It's also permitted, IMO, to remind em when they do something we like, no?

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Originally Posted by MacDeath

Well said. Trion needs to hear from the 'thorns'. It's also permitted, IMO, to remind em when they do something we like, no?

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Of course. Even I like the hellbugs they added this event-- it's a huge step up from paper lanterns.

I already did

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Originally Posted by MacDeath

I can tell that you are a fan of this game. I am too. However, telling people who's opinion disagrees with yours to walk away from the game is NOT in Trion's best interest. Trion needs to keep players in order to make money so they can afford to continue developing content to support those of us who do enjoy this game.

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I don't think it was necessarily justified here, but when you've got someone who is a huge drama queen and is using their leaving the game as some sort of huge threat but never actually does leave, then telling them "just leave already" is justified. And the point isn't that you think the game is better off without them, it's more about calling them on their BS. You're telling them to put up or shut up.

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Originally Posted by FrostEffect

Truth is; forums were made in the first place for the gamers to bi*ch and complain so that the GMs and Devs didn't have to listen to it in their inboxes/in game first hand. Its a place for trolls to troll, cry babies to cry, and allow players to basically talk to a brick wall. 1 out of every 5 devs will actually read a logical thread and think "hmm maybe something SHOULD be done" they will read over the general discussion sections (occasionally), ideas (occasionally), bug reports (often), offtopic (hardly ever), shops (when they are playing their character and need something).

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While you are probably correct that most devs never read the forums, they don't need to. It's the job of the Community team to scan the forums and bring issues to the devs. My guess, is the community team would have weekly (if not daily) meetings with the dev leaders to tell them the 'state of the forums'. Of course, there are many other forms of player feedback too, but forum raised issues do count.

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Originally Posted by fatoldguy

<---Baby boomer and I play several shooters :p

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I'm also a baby boomer. I'm retired and have plenty of time for my hobbies, two of which are 1) Playing/testing MMOs and 2) Playing MMO forums.