Infectors WAAAAAAAAY OVERPOWERED

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Originally Posted by Turantula

They should have left the shottys alone, the only reason they were nerfed was cuz of the damn cloak. Imagine if there was cloak in battlefeild or COD; oh the hilarious insanity that would occur! Funny thing is no one said a damn thing about HALO's cloak and shotty combo, well im sure they have but bungee didn't cave. Then again its campaign wasnt running with its multiplayer simultaneously. Anyway you allready know somethings coming, pretty doon every gun will be doing 1 damage per shot, and pvps will start lookin like soccer scores. ...gooooooaaaaaalllll!!!!

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In Halo i can see someone in Cloak. In this game, cloak wipes you from the face of the Earth.

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Originally Posted by fang1192

Your simplistic example does nothing for your argument because it is of a completely different genre.

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The keyword which is causing me to become reluctant to reply to almost anything you post. This is no arguement. But I'll show mercy as I'm well aware of how a minority in a forum can destroy a game for the silent majority who are too busy enjoying themselves to worry about such a trivial thing.

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Originally Posted by fang1192

You do realize there is more than one type of balance right?

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I'm aware of the differences in it. However, explain how a game can be won through having everything being equal where they essentially do identical damage? This is what most who cry OP want and I know that as I've left BF3 for the same reason, one reason for which I doubt I'll even consider wasting my money on BF4 as I know the same will happen with that after the first few months.

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Originally Posted by fang1192

Chess has symmetric balance - both you and your opponent have equivalent pieces and legal moves.
Defiance has asymmetric balance - at any given time, you and your opponent have different pieces and different moves.

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I didn't mean in the literal sense as to how chess is played in regards to its balance. My example was to show that you should think before your next move in regards to PvP. As in, take a look at your perks: modify your setup so that it benefits you exactly how you want it to. Think about what the map layout is like, what weapons would be more dominant as opposed to another?

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Originally Posted by fang1192

The problem is that the infector has little to no weaknesses, shotguns can have their weakness nullified, but ARs, LMGs, SRs, SMGs to a lesser extent, have more weaknesses than strengths. Weapons should be superior and inferior qualities and perform better or worse in different situations, there should not be a clear winner in terms of effectiveness in all situations - thats how you make a game boring.

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That's how it works unfortunately when it comes to weapons, there's always going to be one that you won't like because it'll best you regardless. This is what I meant by disturbing the yin and yang of balance that weapons have always had.

Once you nerf one weapon, everyone who used that is going to move to another. Due to the increased use of that new weapon, the same idiots that cried over the shotguns dominating (which they should have) will start crying over the next and then the next one, the one after that and before you know it every single weapon is useless and can't be used to overpower what it should overpower. Honestly, how people don't realise that nerfing weapons is going to lead to this is disappointing.

Mark my words, if Trion doesn't realize it's the map design that determines what's 'OP' you who is reading this, your weapon will eventually be next - mine has already been done. Infectors are the next to possibly lose to this idiotic behavior, however I'm hoping Trion doesn't follow the footsteps of DICE.

You mentioned that ARs, LMGs, SRs, SMGs have more weaknesses now, right? Let me show how this is going to unfold if this continues. One by one, each and every weapon will gradually be reduced to uselessness and you see those weapons you just considered to have more weaknesses? They'll be the 'OP' ones when their time comes and then they'll get the same response and treatment as their predecessors.

What do you get? A game that had great potential but was run into the ground because of its forum.

This is why nerfing will never fix this.

The devs at DICE actually played their game...a lot. Defiance im not so sure. With all the tomfoolery thats happened with these patches you would think they would be itching to have a "game with devs" weekend or something, which DICE has had plenty of.

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Originally Posted by Adrena Chrome

Only thing I can kill an infector noob with is a grenade, another infector. Or get on your atv and run!!! Super lame. I started a thread about this too right b4 I read yours.

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And this would make YOU a noob...if you can only "kill an infector noob with" a grenade or another infector---then I'm sorry bud but you should probably try playing this game a bit differently, or longer at least.

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Originally Posted by Dave Blackwell

The keyword which is causing me to become reluctant to reply to almost anything you post. This is no arguement. But I'll show mercy as I'm well aware of how a minority in a forum can destroy a game for the silent majority who are too busy enjoying themselves to worry about such a trivial thing.

You made a point and you are defending it. That is an argument. But please continue to be condescending.

I'm aware of the differences in it. However, explain how a game can be won through having everything being equal where they essentially do identical damage? This is what most who cry OP want and I know that as I've left BF3 for the same reason, one reason for which I doubt I'll even consider wasting my money on BF4 as I know the same will happen with that after the first few months.

I'm not arguing for everything to be the same or do the same damage. I'm arguing for weapons to fill niches.

I didn't mean in the literal sense as to how chess is played in regards to its balance. My example was to show that you should think before your next move in regards to PvP. As in, take a look at your perks: modify your setup so that it benefits you exactly how you want it to. Think about what the map layout is like, what weapons would be more dominant as opposed to another?

More than half the perks are useless in PvP due to mechanics, and due to how PvP is played. Not much thinking is required.


That's how it works unfortunately when it comes to weapons, there's always going to be one that you won't like because it'll best you regardless. This is what I meant by disturbing the yin and yang of balance that weapons have always had.

I don't mind balancing weapons as long it actually makes the user aim and actually out think and out shoot me. The game shouldn't do the majority of the work for a player.

Once you nerf one weapon, everyone who used that is going to move to another. Due to the increased use of that new weapon, the same idiots that cried over the shotguns dominating (which they should have) will start crying over the next and then the next one, the one after that and before you know it every single weapon is useless and can't be used to overpower what it should overpower. Honestly, how people don't realise that nerfing weapons is going to lead to this is disappointing.

So at risk of losing obsoleting a weapon, we obsolete entire weapon classes. Brilliant.

Mark my words, if Trion doesn't realize it's the map design that determines what's 'OP' you who is reading this, your weapon will eventually be next - mine has already been done. Infectors are the next to possibly lose to this idiotic behavior, however I'm hoping Trion doesn't follow the footsteps of DICE.

Map design is a part, weapon mechanics also play a part in it.

You mentioned that ARs, LMGs, SRs, SMGs have more weaknesses now, right? Let me show how this is going to unfold if this continues. One by one, each and every weapon will gradually be reduced to uselessness and you see those weapons you just considered to have more weaknesses? They'll be the 'OP' ones when their time comes and then they'll get the same response and treatment as their predecessors.

Seriously, has the slippery slope argument ever worked anywhere? It's a horrible fallacy that needs to die.

What do you get? A game that had great potential but was run into the ground because of its forum.

So Devs shouldn't listen to their players?

This is why nerfing will never fix this.
Balancing can though.

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Bolded replies.

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Originally Posted by Dave Blackwell

Half of these posts don't even make sense.

Weapons are meant to be unbalanced, if every weapon was balanced they would all do the exact same amount of damage as each other regardless of what 'role' or purpose they're meant to serve. Explain to me how, if this was the case, that if all weapons were balanced (AKA. Useless.) how exactly the outcome of games would be determined? The only way to truly balance weapons is by having them unbalanced.

This idiotic notion that certain weapons that overpower another weapon which is inferior to it being bad is quite simply moronic. They all have their strengths and weaknesses. You are meant to use what's the most effective setup in order to best an opponent in.. well, anything.

Here's a simplistic example for those of you who will fail to understand what I'm saying:

How do you win a game of chess?
There's your answer.

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Sorry, but I am starting to believe that you don't actually PvP in this game.

When you have a gun that does great dmg at a huge range, and you don't have to use any precision aiming, then your weapon needs to be tweaked. Yes, there will always be weapons best in certain situations and ranges, but they should still require effort!

I have used all weapon types in the game to PvP, and no weapon requires as little effort as the infectors (mainly immunizer) to get kills.

Either way people will get better over time. Its all about finding your balance, the problem is people are scared to post bad scores in a game where it doesn't even matter. PVP is only good till the pursuits are done; its not what this game is even revolved around. Once folks can get out of the COD/BF3/HALO mindset and just play it for what it is (a mode needed to fulfill pursuit check boxes) youll probably have a lot more fun. The fact people take Defiances PVP mode so seriously is too funny. Why not play a game where your stats actually matter?

lol infectors op? they seem about as balanced as shotgun + cloak to me , both are annoying but theyre guns , if theyre not killing you then theres something wrong (assuming the person is actually shooting you). seriously ive never had that much of an issue fighting them either , i just toss on a shotgun and have my way with them. im left hurting after i get them usually but they shot me , id be surprised if i wasnt hurting after being shot at.

Infectors already got nerfed once. If they do it again it will make the gun practically unusable.

Another butthurt infecter thread. I can go to CVS and get some Preperation H if needed.

They're are annoying but so are spanners IMO The old saying goes if you can't beat them then whine and whine some more until they get nerfed and we all run around with potato guns.

Yeah you can't stop the whining...

And what you got against potato guns? I had a 7ft propane powered one when I was younger, I put a hole through my neighbors shed. Need I say more?

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Originally Posted by TurboSquid

Yeah you can't stop the whining...

And what you got against potato guns? I had a 7ft propane powered one when I was younger, I put a hole through my neighbors shed. Need I say more?

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You my friend have too much spare time :D, I feel if I said water gun then I would get another comment about a nuclear powered water pressure cannon that can carve through diamond lol

When I was young I just juggled fire bricks and spat fire for fun I think I missed out :(

Well when you have an uncle who specializes in industrial high pressure boilers, you kind of get carried away with a simple recreational project.

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Originally Posted by TurboSquid

Well when you have an uncle who specializes in industrial high pressure boilers, you kind of get carried away with a simple recreational project.

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Yeah I can understand I used to strip my TV apart and re build it as a kid lol boredom but I now seem to have a tendency to build static lol Few too many shocks

I took apart my first engine when I was 14. Father and grandfather were a mechanic by trade. I'm planning on getting certified when I get the money.

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Originally Posted by TurboSquid

I took apart my first engine when I was 14. Father and grandfather were a mechanic by trade. I'm planning on getting certified when I get the money.

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That's awesome and smart I always tell my learners to get a trade or skill set that will always be in demand. Plus it's always better to do a job you love rather than working for the sake of working. Good luck with your certification :)

If you use an infector in pvp I automatically think you have no skill what so ever.

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Originally Posted by Kessler

If you use an infector in pvp I automatically think you have no skill what so ever.

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Why? I use a shotgun/sniper and Cloak does that not mean I have no skill either? The weapon has some homing issues but it's not a skill less weapon.

Thank you. Funny how we turned a thread about infecter whining into a casual convo. I'm watching the morning news and 24 tornados spawned out west over the course of the night. A new virus that killed 30 ppl and is incurable has been found in the middle east. Chinese hackers stole 29 blueprints including the f35 and rail guns from the us military. My end of the world theory needs revising...lol

Lmao well it was easy to convert it just takes a few non aggressive comments. I already have a road full of End of the World stores (basically a load of shops with all I need to survive if needs be lol) They cover everything as a collective and I shall be more worried at people being able to print guns on 3d printers as that's insane and not fair :(

You mean Wal-Mart and Cabellas? Check. Both within 3 miles of eachother. And I did hear something about the military wanting to use 3d printers for drones.

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Originally Posted by DOOM996

I use a Immunizer and it definitely is OP, especially with Tier 3 attachements, but i give a rats *** who kills me or with which gun.

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That's the only way it seems OP. With the mod that makes it full auto. I also think the infection time should be lowered slightly. Those bubbles stay on you forever. Besides that, they are fine.

Another thing, its funny how you think PvP in this game requires, "skill". Thanks for the chuckle.

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Originally Posted by TurboSquid

You mean Wal-Mart and Cabellas? Check. Both within 3 miles of eachother. And I did hear something about the military wanting to use 3d printers for drones.

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No I mean I have lumber yard, stone masons, Land rover show rooms, super market, gas bottling store, caravan show rooms, garden centre etc and I am not surprised about the military I am concerned that they have half a million plastic coffins near Atlanta airport.

Hi there!

As this topic has quickly escaped it's intended discussion, we feel the time to say goodbye to this magical thread has come. In the future, please ensure your posts are constructive, and on-topic for the thread. For discussions about stolen blueprints, super tornadoes and 3D printers....

We'll just leave this here.

Thanks!