Easy way to get players to come back and attract new ones...

Add more achievements.

No EGO reward needed, use salvage and script as the payout instead

Even if there is no new content, players still want to keep themselves motivated with goals and play the game. So how about a bounty board?

Seeing how society is more on the badlands side, I'm sure there are lots of criminals that law keepers need help with... Make them like emergencies that spawn when the player gets close, or make it a phased event. This is a good way to add more achievements and action. Also a great way to keep the interest level up.

More achievements is a way to keep people here, but people will know it's a not so fancy way to create content, so they will complain regardless.

Although I don't condone the idea since I for one welcome more achievements, but as an overall 'staying' thing I'd rather that there be more daily quests of a larger variety, and each faction have purchasable tier boxes in them so you don't feel like you're earning them for something you don't need. (When you get 500 of the points you can pretty much buy the one or two things you wanted anyway; excluding the 1000 point title)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JBoneFX

Add more achievements.

No EGO reward needed, use salvage and script as the payout instead

Even if there is no new content, players still want to keep themselves motivated with goals and play the game. So how about a bounty board?

Seeing how society is more on the badlands side, I'm sure there are lots of criminals that law keepers need help with... Make them like emergencies that spawn when the player gets close, or make it a phased event. This is a good way to add more achievements and action. Also a great way to keep the interest level up.

---

no best way is 1. give a full refund to all players. 2 delete the game and start from scratch, and hope in 5-6 years when they come out with defiance 2 people will have forgotten this game.

Make it 100% Free to Play?
With a game shop of course.

There are many successful free to play games out there.

Edit: Rift BECAME free on June 12, 2012. It didnt stop being free on June 12th 2012

Just correcting a mistake.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Whippersnapper

Make it 100% Free to Play?
With a game shop of course.

There are many successful free to play games out there.

Edit: Rift BECAME free on June 12, 2012. It didnt stop being free on June 12th 2012

Just correcting a mistake.

---

You mean, Rift became free on June 12, 2013, right?

give me a million contracts and i'd probably never log out except to sleep. they don't even need to give rep since i'm already maxed on it anyway and never have wanted anything from the rep vendors. oh look another gun(rep vendors). i got 300 blue guns already so what do i need another gun for? for the buy 10 items from rep vendors i just bought 10 of the 50 rep guns and salvaged them on the spot. achievement done.

or mabey just let me gain weap xp on arkfalls. i could do them all day to if there was a reason to but atm no weap xp means waste of time and i dont need key codes since it just gives me 3 more lousy guns to salvage on the spot cause i never ever get a orange ever like that matters anyway since a white is just as good as a orange pretty much. wow weee 20 more damage so what

achievements by themselves won't make me stay logged in. they will get done when they get done. i need reasons to actually shoot at things. although only achievements i have left is social and pvp both of which will probably never ever get completed by me personally. i just do my contracts(except the pvp ones cause i couldn't be bothered to even try at them) then go play rift

1. Free Weekends again. That's how I joined Defiance.

2. Fix Defiance so we want do the marketing for you, instead of you spend all your money on marketing and leave your current playerbase in the dust.

3. Stop trying to do a tie-in with the show. Interesting idea, failure in execution.

4. Fix your damn social system.

"Easy way to get players to come back and attract new ones... "
*** **** **** **** ***

Free To Play.

/thread

Ya know...it would be a kick in the nuts to us who already paid for the game, but if that means I get free **** if they do go free to play, I'd be okay with it. Because subscription based games or microtransaction games are better models businesswise for longevity of a game. Paying once makes me think like....okay, I paid the game....I can play at my own pace. Nothing will be different....now what? But sub based means I only have a short time to play, and I better squeeze my enjoyment out of it for that month or however long I have. Microtransaction games have some min-maxers, raising competition and thus longevity, and it still applies to the pve crowd who could, say, buy a quick self-revive recharge for cheap when soloing or a good bmg gun for parties or something I dunno.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wuffletronics

Ya know...it would be a kick in the nuts to us who already paid for the game, but if that means I get free **** if they do go free to play, I'd be okay with it. Because subscription based games or microtransaction games are better models businesswise for longevity of a game. Paying once makes me think like....okay, I paid the game....I can play at my own pace. Nothing will be different....now what? But sub based means I only have a short time to play, and I better squeeze my enjoyment out of it for that month or however long I have. Microtransaction games have some min-maxers, raising competition and thus longevity, and it still applies to the pve crowd who could, say, buy a quick self-revive recharge for cheap when soloing or a good bmg gun for parties or something I dunno.

---

The problem with this game is that it's a hard model to sustain without subs. You have to depend on three things to keep funding the game:

1. More box/digital sales
2. Cash shop sales
3. DLC sales

First one is easy. That's a finite market. Most mmos get their bulk box/DD sales first month. After that it's a scramble for loose change in the couch for them. After six months, they've almost completely dried up the well and after a year, it's pretty much a trickle. People will come try your game after they've exhausted something else, but think about this game's graphics/design, etc. Why would anyone in a year's time come play this when they could play "The Division", "Destiny" or anything similar?

Second one: Cash shop sales. This one can make very nice money if handled right. As much as people hate SWTOR for moneygrubbing, they successfully figured out how to itemize almost everything and charge/double dip people there and the game now is doing fine. Subs and F2Pers there are paying good money and their content keeps coming (they have six week schedule for content releases now). Time will tell if people really want to spend money here beyond the $60 and DLC packs for reskinned cars or something.

3.DLC sales. Companies like DCUO do this well. Each DLC is $10, but they release the DLC very quickly. There is very little time in DCUO where people are like "Where is the DLC content??? I'm bored!" Trion seems to be very slow putting this content out, which makes people hesitant to buy it in the future... especially if when it's finally released, it's buggy or boring. (which we don't know yet until all have been out).

Because this game has no subs, it's not easy keeping cashflows balanced right I wouldn't think. There has got to be huge gaps of nothing, then huge spikes of income (if the content is any good). F2P would allow people to come/go buying things as they came in, but it's hard to get them to get past that initial price point of $30-60.

Maybe a $10 box might help, idk. But definitely need players now as I don't see an upside to the game being run solely on the population playing now; not sure how much deeper their pockets are.

I do agree it needs a new surge of players, but first I believe it needs to fix all it's current issues as that's why many people left, although a lot more left due to little content, that I will admit. I dunno, man.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wuffletronics

I do agree it needs a new surge of players, but first I believe it needs to fix all it's current issues as that's why many people left, although a lot more left due to little content, that I will admit. I dunno, man.

---

I think it was a bit of both.

Yeah, pretty much. If the new DLC comes with new content AND fixes the game, fantastic! But also if that's the case then Trion REALLY should not have bided their time with the patch, as it's now like feeding starving children after promising them food for weeks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JBoneFX

Add more achievements.

No EGO reward needed, use salvage and script as the payout instead

Even if there is no new content, players still want to keep themselves motivated with goals and play the game. So how about a bounty board?

Seeing how society is more on the badlands side, I'm sure there are lots of criminals that law keepers need help with... Make them like emergencies that spawn when the player gets close, or make it a phased event. This is a good way to add more achievements and action. Also a great way to keep the interest level up.

---

If they were serious about this game they'd replace management with the Rift team. It's that simple. The C squad has been in charge of Defiance and it shows.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

Second one: Cash shop sales. This one can make very nice money if handled right. As much as people hate SWTOR for moneygrubbing, they successfully figured out how to itemize almost everything and charge/double dip people there and the game now is doing fine. Subs and F2Pers there are paying good money and their content keeps coming (they have six week schedule for content releases now). Time will tell if people really want to spend money here beyond the $60 and DLC packs for reskinned cars or something.

---

Good point, GW2, from the beginning, also has a successful cash shop model and probably does it better with their RNG system that makes players furiously rage while still emptying their pockets. The lack of real varieties of, not reskinned, outfits and cars in Defiance's shop currently will not cut it in the long run, but the game is only a baby.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

3.DLC sales. Companies like DCUO do this well. Each DLC is $10, but they release the DLC very quickly. There is very little time in DCUO where people are like "Where is the DLC content??? I'm bored!" Trion seems to be very slow putting this content out, which makes people hesitant to buy it in the future... especially if when it's finally released, it's buggy or boring. (which we don't know yet until all have been out).

---

Keep in mind that the first DLC that DCUO launched was 8 months after the game's release and was buggy as **** for the first few months. Then they started releasing DLC every few months.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

Because this game has no subs, it's not easy keeping cashflows balanced right I wouldn't think. There has got to be huge gaps of nothing, then huge spikes of income (if the content is any good). F2P would allow people to come/go buying things as they came in, but it's hard to get them to get past that initial price point of $30-60.

---

IMO, until this game releases a couple of DLCs, the current content is not enough for the hardcore and semi hardcore players, who many are, because they'll just burn through them. This game is a great play casually because it does not emphasize much on progression to play "harder" contents and the min/maxing aspect is very little which will make it a great pvp centric game, given the current weapon issues are addressed and more maps and modes are implemented.

Achievements won't cut it because although it does count as content, there are only the minority who will care about trying to 100% a game, unless they add very good incentives such as having more unique outfits or vehicles that can only be obtain through achievements and will never been featured as a reskinned somewhere else.

Again, too many speculations. Only time will tell. Given the MMO pattern, it's much too early to say this game will be a lost cause.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Imani Hype

Good point, GW2, from the beginning, also has a successful cash shop model and probably does it better with their RNG system that makes players furiously rage while still emptying their pockets. The lack of real varieties of, not reskinned, outfits and cars in Defiance's shop currently will not cut it in the long run, but the game is only a baby.



Keep in mind that the first DLC that DCUO launched was 8 months after the game's release and was buggy as **** for the first few months. Then they started releasing DLC every few months.



IMO, until this game releases a couple of DLCs, the current content is not enough for the hardcore and semi hardcore players, who many are, because they'll just burn through them. This game is a great play casually because it does not emphasize much on progression to play "harder" contents and the min/maxing aspect is very little which will make it a great pvp centric game, given the current weapon issues are addressed and more maps and modes are implemented.

Achievements won't cut it because although it does count as content, there are only the minority who will care about trying to 100% a game, unless they add very good incentives such as having more unique outfits or vehicles that can only be obtain through achievements and will never been featured as a reskinned somewhere else.

Again, too many speculations. Only time will tell. Given the MMO pattern, it's much too early to say this game will be a lost cause.

---

Good replies, thank you.

I agree the game has room for improvement, a lot to improve on and that it's only a baby (mmo years wise). But just like those baby turtles that are hatched, only so many baby ones make it and the rest get eaten or die if they don't get off the beach fast, this one has to learn how to swim very fast and right now, it's kinda moving slow.

There are a lot of predators out there waiting to feast if it doesn't.
http://images.designntrend.com/data/...-jpg.jpg?w=610

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wuffletronics

Ya know...it would be a kick in the nuts to us who already paid for the game, but if that means I get free **** if they do go free to play, I'd be okay with it. Because subscription based games or microtransaction games are better models businesswise for longevity of a game. Paying once makes me think like....okay, I paid the game....I can play at my own pace. Nothing will be different....now what? But sub based means I only have a short time to play, and I better squeeze my enjoyment out of it for that month or however long I have. Microtransaction games have some min-maxers, raising competition and thus longevity, and it still applies to the pve crowd who could, say, buy a quick self-revive recharge for cheap when soloing or a good dmg gun for parties or something I dunno.

---

I think free would work, a downloadable packs (weapons, armor, vehicles, companion that fights with you) and the micro-transactions could help the game. Those who already paid for the game get in game currency credit equivalent to the value of the game they paid for. You can probably create in-game events with xp, game currency and new titles to reward participating players, and have the shows stars do a in-game live cameo. I think if you utilize steam, xbox, ps3, and origin special price deal you could draw more in. The other option is to set up player run guild/coalition run cities and create pvp war situation. The guild/coalition city that wins controls the city and its assets until the losing coalition of players can beat the opposing city. You can have control towers that need to be destroyed then repaired by the players if you repair the tower(s) you gain a percentage back of your city. The final idea is a marketplace to sell player made items and introduce crafting into the game I know it takes the fps away but why not turn it into a first fps-mmorpg?

Balance PVP and increase view Distance
Make decent Control/Choke/Rersource points
Make Shadow War a proper PvP On or Off switch

Easy way to get me back, fix the damned engine for PC. I run a lot of better looking games (inc. mmos) at much higher gfx settings and have no problems whatsoever. This game lags, jumps and stutters appalingly with a terrible draw rate to boot. Hellbug, they don't even need to work on the engine, just give me better control over the graphics settings. I'll work with the terrible rendering and poor framerate, if they give me chance.

Til then, the game is unplayable for me. I can get through it ok, but it's just an immersion-broken chore.

For those advocating F2P, stop.

It will only do more harm than good.

Unbannable bots and spammers? Checked.
Pay 2 win items? Checked.
Insulting current user base who paid $100 for game and DLC? Checked.
PC only? Checked.
Slower ticket resolution? Checked.
More trollish in game behavior due to lack of consequences? Checked.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Whippersnapper

Make it 100% Free to Play?
With a game shop of course.

There are many successful free to play games out there.

Edit: Rift BECAME free on June 12, 2012. It didnt stop being free on June 12th 2012

Just correcting a mistake.

---

Rift can indeed be played for free now, but of course there are restrictions. I expect that MOST players will continue to be subscribers. Subscribers, now called Patrons, get MANY benefits.

its not about the money we spend, its about the money they spend! why don't they spend some of the amazing amounts of cash that they spend on advertising for more devs! this game needs more content bad! most of the players I know can drive to places without looking at the map...they know it by sight, its too small a world, some of the ideas are great but think bigger. it needs clan battles, how about 16 man pvp raid groups for shadow war and freight yard? how about more than a few minutes of play in the weekly updates...and where is the dlc? The players are bored, hear them roar!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

For those advocating F2P, stop.

It will only do more harm than good.

Unbannable bots and spammers? Checked.
Pay 2 win items? Checked.
Insulting current user base who paid $100 for game and DLC? Checked.
PC only? Checked.
Slower ticket resolution? Checked.
More trollish in game behavior due to lack of consequences? Checked.

---

F2P might work for Defiance if it is working for other MMO's, MMORPG's, and why not this game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XxIndomitablexX

its not about the money we spend, its about the money they spend! why don't they spend some of the amazing amounts of cash that they spend on advertising for more devs! this game needs more content bad! most of the players I know can drive to places without looking at the map...they know it by sight, its too small a world, some of the ideas are great but think bigger. it needs clan battles, how about 16 man pvp raid groups for shadow war and freight yard? how about more than a few minutes of play in the weekly updates...and where is the dlc? The players are bored, hear them roar!

---

You now got my vote.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tercept

F2P might work for Defiance if it is working for other MMO's, MMORPG's, and why not this game.

---

It may, but they need way more things to spend money on than what they currently have in the store to be remotely successful with it...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JBoneFX

It may, but they need way more things to spend money on than what they currently have in the store to be remotely successful with it...

---

That and we need to give this game a solid year before we see any giant leaps in improvements (fixing bugs, bringing in content, and etc).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tercept

F2P might work for Defiance if it is working for other MMO's, MMORPG's, and why not this game.

---

Because this game was never a subscription model to begin with. Usually F2P seperate users with premium service or contents. F2P players would only get limited contents and services while the subbers will get the whole shebang. Though this game does not have much content atm to begin with let alone separating them for F2P model.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JBoneFX

Add more achievements.

---

Nope, achievements should be there to track and reward progress through the content of the game, not be the content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

For those advocating F2P, stop.

It will only do more harm than good.

Unbannable bots and spammers? Checked.
Pay 2 win items? Checked.
Insulting current user base who paid $100 for game and DLC? Checked.
PC only? Checked.
Slower ticket resolution? Checked.
More trollish in game behavior due to lack of consequences? Checked.

---

Firstly, prices you paid already are immaterial.

I paid $2,000 for a flat screen two years ago. Then I went down and saw the same flat screen for $1,000. I probably should have asked for my money back. Or for anything that has diminished value, which your DLC packs had the MINUTE you bought them. Not sure how you don't know that. You also paid $60 at launch. You want they should pay $60 too instead of $10 or $20?

Bots? Good thing we don't have that in game now or the PvP would be som.. uh oh. ;)

Pay to Win items? Are you serious? Games like DCUO and TSW are totally F2P and don't have those. Even crappy SWTOR doesn't have Pay To Win PvP gear so .. please stop that. Even Rift doesn't have Pay To Win items.. you know.. the same company that makes this game?

PC only? What makes you think that? Besides, more people is more people. Doesn't matter if it's PC or console.

Slower ticket res.. really wait. You weren't serious about this list, were you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XxIndomitablexX

why don't they spend some of the amazing amounts of cash that they spend on advertising for more devs!

---

Because you don't have to pay a print ad or commercial a salary, benefits and healthcare for years on end.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tercept

F2P might work for Defiance if it is working for other MMO's, MMORPG's, and why not this game.

---

Don't mind him. You get a few of those in every failing game.

Then the game finally goes F2P after bleeding too much money (usually almost far too late), and people like him start talking about 'the good old days' like now when everyone had to pay.

Only they forget THIS part. The crappy part where things were broken and not working as intended.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Imani Hype

Because this game was never a subscription model to begin with. Usually F2P seperate users with premium service or contents. F2P players would only get limited contents and services while the subbers will get the whole shebang. Though this game does not have much content atm to begin with let alone separating them for F2P model.

---

And that's why this game needs it even more. Where does the revenue from this game come from now that launch day has come and gone?

1. Box/digital sales
2. DLC
3. Cash shop

Forget 1. That ship has long sailed. The only thing Trion can do now with that is what they did already, put the game up for $30. Then $20. Then $10. They aren't getting $60 for this anymore. There also aren't as many potential people to pick from given all the other F2P games out. People will want to know why they have to pay for this buggy, incomplete game when they can play a lot of others F2P instead?

2. DLC. The price for DLC will be in-line with what the other F2P games do: $10. No one is paying $20 for a Castie and a dagger. For SWTOR they can charge F2P players that because of Star Wars fans. This game has no pre-existing base though so I doubt people are going to buy a box/ddload for $30 then $20 for one DLC. That's insane. It's almost as insane as buying DLC pre-order.

3. Cash shop. It's already been said this cash shop is really lackluster. I don't think I've ever seen anyone but a fan love what's in there and shelling out a ton of money. But eventually even those players will run out, or find nothing else they want for another few months. Then you figure in the other half of players steaming because the DLC is slow and they don't want to fork over more money in the meantime.

Where does anyone see revenue coming in for this game based on that? Again, and I really hate to harp on this last point, but other games are coming out. People are going to be buying the PS4 (screw the Xbox) and they aren't going to be having extra money to buy the console, new (NEW) games and still spend for this game. I'm pretty sure Trion knows all this.

F2P is just a matter of time here but the thing is, the sooner you convert the more people get into the game for us to keep us interested. Right now there are a lot of people who have already written the $60 off and looking/playing other things and we know it's hard to get back into anything after you leave long enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

Because you don't have to pay a print ad or commercial a salary, benefits and healthcare for years on end.

---

huh? not sure what you meant there

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maledict

Balance PVP and increase view Distance
Make decent Control/Choke/Rersource points
Make Shadow War a proper PvP On or Off switch

---

+1

I log-in wait 30-mins for one map in pvp to finally que, then find the entire other team using infectors, which in turns causes me to laugh about how pathetic this game is and shut it off.. I need to uninstall and write this game off as a bad experience/memory.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XxIndomitablexX

its not about the money we spend, its about the money they spend! why don't they spend some of the amazing amounts of cash that they spend on advertising for more devs!

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XxIndomitablexX

huh? not sure what you meant there

---

TLDR: Less money. No reason to hire more.

See, you've already spent your money, lol. DLC packs in advance aren't something any players should ever be supporting. It's like hiring contractors to come fix your house. Sure some will say "We'll do a great job sir. We'll have this up in three months! You can believe we will do a good job. We just need half the money down in advance."

Paying in advance for DLC means you are captive. So when they put it out, they put it out. You already paid and unless they say "you aren't getting it" you have no recourse.

They have no incentive to hire more people because you aren't going anywhere and there aren't specific dates tied to the content promised. Makes more sense to push advertising to bring more people in that will pay $30 plus DLC in advance too. All they can get from you is maybe a cash shop purchase or two for $10. The real money is in people still coming in game, and advertising doesn't need a salary/benefits, etc.

If there were specific dates (We Trion, promise that by June 30th, content specificied as DLC #1 will be in game or refund) then they'd have to hire more devs. As such, you're S.O.L. and just have to do a few more pursuits.

I mean, it's not like you'll cancel your sub or anything, amirite? :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

And that's why this game needs it even more. Where does the revenue from this game come from now that launch day has come and gone?

1. Box/digital sales
2. DLC
3. Cash shop

Forget 1. That ship has long sailed. The only thing Trion can do now with that is what they did already, put the game up for $30. Then $20. Then $10. They aren't getting $60 for this anymore. There also aren't as many potential people to pick from given all the other F2P games out. People will want to know why they have to pay for this buggy, incomplete game when they can play a lot of others F2P instead?

2. DLC. The price for DLC will be in-line with what the other F2P games do: $10. No one is paying $20 for a Castie and a dagger. For SWTOR they can charge F2P players that because of Star Wars fans. This game has no pre-existing base though so I doubt people are going to buy a box/ddload for $30 then $20 for one DLC. That's insane. It's almost as insane as buying DLC pre-order.

3. Cash shop. It's already been said this cash shop is really lackluster. I don't think I've ever seen anyone but a fan love what's in there and shelling out a ton of money. But eventually even those players will run out, or find nothing else they want for another few months. Then you figure in the other half of players steaming because the DLC is slow and they don't want to fork over more money in the meantime.

Where does anyone see revenue coming in for this game based on that? Again, and I really hate to harp on this last point, but other games are coming out. People are going to be buying the PS4 (screw the Xbox) and they aren't going to be having extra money to buy the console, new (NEW) games and still spend for this game. I'm pretty sure Trion knows all this.

F2P is just a matter of time here but the thing is, the sooner you convert the more people get into the game for us to keep us interested. Right now there are a lot of people who have already written the $60 off and looking/playing other things and we know it's hard to get back into anything after you leave long enough.

---

http://www.defiance.com/en/buy-now/p...PQO2r3UVGC-cas

They just dropped the price for standard and deluxe. I think the DLC should be at $5 a pop have a armor color kit, vehicle color kit, weapon pack, outfit pack, armor pack, and etc There is plenty of DLC to create but with the price reduction I hope will increase the number of players for this game. They need the increase in players before anything else can be done, or before the proper amount of staff can get dedicated to fix and upgrade content in a game that just started out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Anim

Nope, achievements should be there to track and reward progress through the content of the game, not be the content.

---

No, it's not content, it creates interest and purpose and exposes existing feats for the player to accomplish.

Here's an example: They track how much time you're vehicle is airborn. That means they know how far you jump in the air each and every time and theres a number attached to it.. Guess what you can do with numbers? wow!

Creating an achievement to state : Jump 100m in the air 3 times within 1 minute (totally hypothetical) gives the player awareness that the game will reward them for doing something that could already do before, but had no incentive or knowledge to do previously.

Get it now? I sure hope so...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

Forget 1. That ship has long sailed. The only thing Trion can do now with that is what they did already, put the game up for $30. Then $20. Then $10. They aren't getting $60 for this anymore. There also aren't as many potential people to pick from given all the other F2P games out. People will want to know why they have to pay for this buggy, incomplete game when they can play a lot of others F2P instead?

---

Aight, I see your point, but only Trion will know, through their monitored statistics, when and how much they will currently drop down their retail price to try and attract more players. We will know when that will happen and we will know if population is really going down through their action, desperate or not. There are many F2P choices yes, but they face the same problem this game is facing and this game is very much playable compared to others out there. Let's not exaggerate too much. Incomplete? Maybe, but an MMO is never "complete" in a sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

2. DLC. The price for DLC will be in-line with what the other F2P games do: $10. No one is paying $20 for a Castie and a dagger. For SWTOR they can charge F2P players that because of Star Wars fans. This game has no pre-existing base though so I doubt people are going to buy a box/ddload for $30 then $20 for one DLC. That's insane. It's almost as insane as buying DLC pre-order.

---

Not much arguments here and you're right, some MMOs can afford to up their DLC because of their brand. Through seperate DLCs, this is where F2Pers will get their bang for their buck because most games that started out as subscription base and transitioned to F2P allows F2Pers to separately purchase DLCs and that will be theirs to keep forever. However, for subbers, they will have access to all DLCs released as long as they continue to sub along with "unlimited" premium service and contents. So it's an incentive for players, but the problem for this game is, it cannot do that. IMO, the model of purchasing DLCs before they are put out is starting to be more common than you think.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

3. Cash shop. It's already been said this cash shop is really lackluster. I don't think I've ever seen anyone but a fan love what's in there and shelling out a ton of money. But eventually even those players will run out, or find nothing else they want for another few months. Then you figure in the other half of players steaming because the DLC is slow and they don't want to fork over more money in the meantime.

---

Okay, I agree, the cash shop is garbage atm. I spent $20 in bits to get an outfit I want and still have half leftover because I don't know what else to spend it on. I know players at a current moment, will denounce this game and "refuse" to buy anything else that will come out, whether it be DLC or something else, but IMHO when it comes out many will come back running just to try out the new content put forward. That's how we are. We might move on for a little bit, but if nothing else is interesting, we'll come back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

F2P is just a matter of time here but the thing is, the sooner you convert the more people get into the game for us to keep us interested. Right now there are a lot of people who have already written the $60 off and looking/playing other things and we know it's hard to get back into anything after you leave long enough.

---

More players will BE good, but the population is not a replacement for the current lack of content. It will just become a revolving door because the vets have played through everything and leave for a while, whereas the new players will replace the vets and the wheels go round' and round'.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fancypants

Firstly, prices you paid already are immaterial.

I paid $2,000 for a flat screen two years ago. Then I went down and saw the same flat screen for $1,000. I probably should have asked for my money back. Or for anything that has diminished value, which your DLC packs had the MINUTE you bought them. Not sure how you don't know that. You also paid $60 at launch. You want they should pay $60 too instead of $10 or $20?

Bots? Good thing we don't have that in game now or the PvP would be som.. uh oh. ;)

Pay to Win items? Are you serious? Games like DCUO and TSW are totally F2P and don't have those. Even crappy SWTOR doesn't have Pay To Win PvP gear so .. please stop that. Even Rift doesn't have Pay To Win items.. you know.. the same company that makes this game?

PC only? What makes you think that? Besides, more people is more people. Doesn't matter if it's PC or console.

Slower ticket res.. really wait. You weren't serious about this list, were you?

Because you don't have to pay a print ad or commercial a salary, benefits and healthcare for years on end.

---

1. Going f2p in two months is an insult to all early adopters. Especially when they didn't even have the first DLC out. Give us a reason not to cancel the season pass if they announce f2p today.

2. Hacks and bots are different things. Don't get confused. All f2p games are plagued by bots because banning accounts, the last resort of disciplinary actions is made meaningless. The only reason gold farmers are not active here is because of the $60 box price and the low monetary value of scrip. If there is not barrier to entry, you will start seeing gold spammers in chat. Have no doubt of it.

3. If Trion is desperate enough to go F2P after a mere two months, what makes you think they wouldn't? Especially given that the original business model was not F2P.

4. How many free console games have you played?

5. Not just slower ticket resolution. Slower servers and massive lag due to influx of unlimited bots.

We can try this topic again after all 5 DLC had been released and I may change my mind. Not while Trion is still owning me things I paid for.

If they want to attract new players and keep current ones, they need to do a few things.

1. Fix the game.
2. Communicate better overall between the dev team to the player base about why things being are done.
3. Setup a Beta test server and listen to the feedback.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

1. Going f2p in two months is an insult to all early adopters. Especially when they didn't even have the first DLC out. Give us a reason not to cancel the season pass if they announce f2p today.

---

Again, I can understand the angst, but if the choice is between the game closing (in which you don't get to play anymore) and going F2P after six months, which choice would you take? I'm not saying that's the timeframes but it's going to happen so what difference does it make if it's six month or a year if very few new players are coming in?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

2. Hacks and bots are different things. Don't get confused. All f2p games are plagued by bots because banning accounts, the last resort of disciplinary actions is made meaningless. The only reason gold farmers are not active here is because of the $60 box price and the low monetary value of scrip. If there is not barrier to entry, you will start seeing gold spammers in chat. Have no doubt of it.

---

Again, that's going to happen. There isn't really any stopping that from coming. It's a corporate decision of 'Do we let the game die or do we allow some spam?" Just about all choose spam unless the company is rich like EA and can let games like Warhammer Online stay open with just three servers. Highly doubt with all the things on Trion's plate they are going that road. But we'll see I guess.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

3. If Trion is desperate enough to go F2P after a mere two months, what makes you think they wouldn't? Especially given that the original business model was not F2P.

---

Because they don't have Pay To Win in Rift. If they were going to do that, their flagship mmo would have that first, long before the backup mmo since they have a bigger audience to glean from. And also, Rift's original model wasn't F2P either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

4. How many free console games have you played?

---

Odd polling question but I've played DCUO (Lifetime PC sub though). Point of this question is...:confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

5. Not just slower ticket resolution. Slower servers and massive lag due to influx of unlimited bots.

---

Again with the bots. It's just part of the price of profitability. You'll see.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wtflag

We can try this topic again after all 5 DLC had been released and I may change my mind. Not while Trion is still owning me things I paid for.

---

Well, good luck with that. My saving grace is I was smart enough to not buy DLC on a promise at launch; I've played too many mmos and other games where it's proven it's not only a bad idea just to save $5 or $10 bucks, but it encourages more companies to do this type of delaying tactics. Consumers only have themselves to blame when they fall for these things.