Upcoming Balance Changes

[Keevan]

I do apologize, I don't recognize your name, sorry. More than anything, I don't really stay that long on the score chart/leaderboards.

It is and I certainly recognize your name. Not to be a d*ck but if you don't spend time looking at those scoreboard what makes you think you even have a clue how scoring works.

See my above edit with screengrab if that does not convince you how they are actually scored I do not know what will.

Maybe this.. I will challenge you to get even over 200 kills. I cant hold others to my standards afterall, do as much damage as you can. Overcharge/Madbomber is what I would recommenced but your choice. Do not shoot at crystals(splash dmg is fine), or the boss. Kill all the little things you can as fast as you can, using as much effort as you can. And at the end look at the scoreboard and note how low you will be.

[KTCAOP]

It is and I certainly recognize your name. Not to be a d*ck but if you don't spend time looking at those scoreboard what makes you think you even have a clue how scoring works.

See my above edit with screengrab if that does not convince you how they are actually score I do not know what will.

Maybe this.. I will challenge you to get even over 200 kills. I cant hold others to my standards afterall, do as much damage as you can. Overcharge/Madbomber is what I would recommenced but your choice. Do not shoot at crystals, splash dmg is fine or the boss. Kill all the little things you can as fast as you can, using as much effort as you can. And at the end look at the scoreboard and note how low you will be.

As I said, now days I don't really care. I used to and I have a few screenshots from a last week of relatively high scores.

I really don't understand the perseveration with getting kills. I did not say *anything* about kills in the beginning. I have agreed with you over and over again that kills don't add anything to your score. If anything, I'd rather just have a scrapper forger pop up and hit its critical points, won't get me any kills, but that'll give me a ton of damage, which will boost me up the rankings. I wouldn't be damaging the arkfall conduits or anything like that but it'll probably boost me up in the damage category.

Also, note that if you are alone at an arkfall, you can get kills much faster but you would deal less damage due to the scaling. So sure, you might've killed more things, but still not dealt as much damage. I mean, if anything, the proof of concept here are the blue arkfalls, where again, damage is the number one thing. The number of kills doesn't put you to the top of the boards, just how much damage you have done. So... yeah... again, it's the total amount of damage done.

As I have said, again, if you hit the weakpoints of the crystal, that will give you more damage per second than anything else. When it comes to the bosses, every single hit that you put onto them is a critical hit, so that's why wolfhounds are great for them. You get a ton of damage very quickly doing that.

Oh, and no big deal, you seem to be a smart enough person and seems to enjoy the game. If you ever want to party, feel free to send me an invite, it'd be fun.

[Pyth]

Glad to see the Development team is being consistent at least.

[fgbrooks]

Double Post

[Don Nawetta]

I have been playing computer games since the dawn of the computer (I am 70 years old), and in just about every game where weapons were involved, one weapon typically becomes the fan favorite. In Defiance, it is currently the SAW. All that will happen if Trion nerfs the SAW is that the second most popular weapon will move up to become number one. Nerf that one and the next in line will become most popular, and so forth. Nerfing solves nothing except making a new weapon the FOTW.

...

^THIS !

Additionally, you will lose players with every nerf. Maybe not the first or the second time, but at the third nerf people will start leaving because they realize the direction the game is going.

Personally, the SAW nerf is the last straw for me. At the shotgun nerf I thought "Ok, somewhat over the top, but maybe it´s necessary". At the vehicle nerf I was grumbling noticeable but finally I could live with it. But the SAW nerf is pushing it over the top for me. Since this announcement I barely have the motivation to log in, because I know this change will come and I also know at that time I will stop playing Defiance.

[Fakinell]

I have been playing computer games since the dawn of the computer (I am 70 years old), and in just about every game where weapons were involved, one weapon typically becomes the fan favorite. In Defiance, it is currently the SAW. All that will happen if Trion nerfs the SAW is that the second most popular weapon will move up to become number one. Nerf that one and the next in line will become most popular, and so forth. Nerfing solves nothing except making a new weapon the FOTW.

The problem in weapon balancing lies in balancing BETWEEN weapon classes, and WITHIN a weapon class. In the Real World, different weapon classes have different uses. The short barrel, light weight ARs like the M4, are ideal for house-to-house warfare, while the LMGs, like the M249 SAW, are ideal for sustained firepower against large numbers of enemy troops, usually from a fixed position using a tripod. I can't imagine anyone carrying a 15lb SAW into a house-to-house battle scenario. However, as Defiance is not a realistic combat simulator (I am able to run around carrying 6 SAWS, and 12 ARs), there is no provision for weight or stamina. So everyone runs around with a SAW (except for the Wolfhound adherents), using it in situations that would be silly in real life, like putting a scope on it and using it as an automatic sniper rifle. Trion is not going to totally change the combat mechanics. So, how about we make weapon usage a little more realistic, balancing between classes, and treat the LMGs like the Mini-gun: hip fire only and walking speed only. Suddenly, ARs become much more attractive in active, run-and-gun scenarios.

As for balancing within the LMG, class, I propose the following: increase the Critical Multiplier for the Thunder and the Disruptor to that of the SAW, 1.5x; lower the reload times of the Thunder, the Disruptor, and the Rocker (which use a box magazine) to 3.8, which is substantially lower then the SAW's 4.5 (uses a belt magazine); increase the damage of the Thunder from 200 to 250; increase the inherent accuracy of the Disruptor, and remove the burst fire restriction; and lower the bloom for the Rocker from 0.75 to 0.60.

I believe that buy BUFFING the non-SAW LMGs as proposed (or something similar), Trion will go a long way to achieving weapons balance within the class, while adding the movement/aim restrictions will go a long way to achieving balance between the classes.

I wish you were a member of Trion's staff.

[Silent Scope]

Keep this fire burning...

[Silent Scope]

Rockets should do Massive Damage...
Then Detonators...
Then Sniper Rifles,
Then Shotguns,
Then LMGs,
Then ARs,
Then SMGs,
Then Pistols

Seeing how none of these do the damage the really should...

We use the only gun that works... The SAW.

NERF that gun without restoring the natural Damaging order of guns as above...

Well we'll just find a game that will.

[Keevan]

Also, note that if you are alone at an arkfall, you can get kills much faster but you would deal less damage due to the scaling. So sure, you might've killed more things, but still not dealt as much damage. I mean, if anything, the proof of concept here are the blue arkfalls, where again, damage is the number one thing. The number of kills doesn't put you to the top of the boards, just how much damage you have done. So... yeah... again, it's the total amount of damage done.

As I have said, again, if you hit the weakpoints of the crystal, that will give you more damage per second than anything else. When it comes to the bosses, every single hit that you put onto them is a critical hit, so that's why wolfhounds are great for them. You get a ton of damage very quickly doing that.

Oh, and no big deal, you seem to be a smart enough person and seems to enjoy the game. If you ever want to party, feel free to send me an invite, it'd be fun.

No offense there guy but you are completely utterly and totally wrong and incorrect.

Let me show you why using basic math and the screengrab provided.

1. Edgalis Thorali has 29 kills and registered 2105543 damage. That is an average of 72604 damage per kill.

2. Keevan has 332 kills and registered 1150568 damage. That is an average damage of 3465 damage per kill.

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.
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8. Hanover Fist has 22 kills and registered 543782 damage. That is an average damage of 24717 damage per kill.


Are you really trying to convince everyone that I had more than tripled the nearest person in kills (more than 5-6 most other people) yet had did an average damage of less than 1/20th of the person above me and 1/7th as the person 6 spots below me. No that math does not add up and the only logical conclusion left to draw is the damage registered ONLY counted for actual Arkfall goals, that being the crystals themselves AND the boss. Nothing, I repeat NOTHING else counts towards your scoreboard.

The proof is in the pudding so to speak.

[Keevan]

Rockets should do Massive Damage...
Then Detonators...
Then Sniper Rifles,
Then Shotguns,
Then LMGs,
Then ARs,
Then SMGs,
Then Pistols

Seeing how none of these do the damage the really should...

We use the only gun that works... The SAW.

NERF that gun without restoring the natural Damaging order of guns as above...

Well we'll just find a game that will.

SAW is and was a subpar weapon, agreed so is nearly every other one too. But why not use a Wolfhound. they are leaps and bounds better than a SAW anyway. The only clutch is ammo conservation but they are now getting rid of that which pulls the Wolfhound so far in front of every other single weapon in game why would anyone use anything else?

I also think another area of correction should be ammo types. The fact that a SMG uses the same ammo type as AR or LMG is sooo freaking laughably pathetic, that the person who designed this seriously had no clue. Firstly the ammo a AR uses would not fit a SMG. That is like saying an Uzi and AK-47 use the same ammo. Not even close but an Uzi does use the same ammo as a 9mm pistol. Further they have 3 weapons using one type (SMG, LMG, AR) and only one using the other type (Pistol), even for game play mechanics that makes no sense.

I for one am convinced no one at Trion bothered to do any research what so ever or even pick up other popular FPS games and note how different weapons and ammo functioned.