dlc makes defiance the worst pvp game

[twitch reflex]

I am interested in why you say this because I do use a bolt action in pvp and I never said that bolt action does not one shot. With shadow strike and using the surge bolter, I can one shot any build as well. Also the weapon shoots 10+ bullet spread making it trivial for accuracy.

You were making it seem like you could one shot most people with the surge bolter without charging it or cloak.
Most people won't have a perfect roll surge bolter anyways. I've played this game for a while and have never found a perfect roll anything.

[Nefarious]

All I think is that the rate of fire needs to be toned down and have spread and recoil when firing from the hip. The Surge Bolter needs to be good at what IT does. Sure, it might not be the strongest or have the fastest ROF but its has those things enough and a whole lot more to make other snipers obsolete. That's why that is all we are seeing in terms of Sniper Rifles.

One sniper rifle comes out and everyone uses it. No other rifles, just the Surge. Because the other snipers are hard to use, they are good at what they do where as the Surge is lenient for making up for players lack of sniping skill by being good at everything. The Surge has to much get and not enough give like other snipers do.

Think of it this way, the Surge Bolter has a rating of 70 in all the things sniper rifles do along with special abilities like its charge shot and zero recoil/spread from the hip. The only Snipers that are better then the Surge Bolter at something are the FRC Repeater because of its naturally high crits and the Derailer for destroying vehicles. Other then that they don't compare to the Surge Bolter because they are better at 1 thing because they get crushed in all the other categories in comparison.

Semi Autos don't even come close to the Surge Bolter in terms of use. The Vot Bolter is in the Surge's shadow never to be seen. I cant think of one other sniper that would be better to use over the Surge Bolter. The thing is in a league of its own. A Super Hybrid Sniper Rifle.

With Semi's you need to be nailing shots off and hitting them. With bolt Action you need to make shots count. With the Surge Bolter you can OHK and 2-piece ppl no matter what distance, its adaptable in all ranges. You can stay in scope, shoot from the hip, charge a shot for easy hits. Cant say that about other snipers.

ROF decrease considering its a Hybrid sniper and hip spread and recoil like every other Bullet Gun in the game for the Surge Bolter. That's not drastic its expected.

[Nefarious]

Also, another thing you should have on your list of nerfs/buffs is the disruptor. I feel like everyone forgot about this lmg weapon. Maybe increase the fire rate by 1.8x and maybe it will be just as good as the thunder or the saw.

Trust me, the Disruptor is fine. It just doesn't get its shining moment because of how muffed up PvP is. Cloak has destroyed the distance and approach aspect of the game. Infectors and Detonators, you already know what they do.

The Disruptor really is good at mid-long ranges. Even holds its own a bit up close. Its like a far hitting shotgun. Its not the strongest but its good for laying down fire and hitting rolling/hopping/staffing targets, pretty much anyone who is running away. You can tag them all day.

But like I said it doesn't get to shine. What good is laying down fire when players can just turn utterly invisible and run away? What good is it to be hitting moving targets when those targets are shooting you with guns that don't need to be aimed?

The Disruptor is really good as is. The game just needs to fix the obvious things first for it to catch up. So a lot of things can catch up.

[ironcladtrash]

One thing I wonder is if the gun is bugged because it does more damage when charged. Doesn't seem like it should because the particle repeater doesn't spread and has to be charged to do more damage. I don't think the gun would be as bad if it only did something like 100x10 when charged. I'll test it later to get exact numbers on damage unless some one already knows.

[chilipino]

One thing I wonder is if the gun is bugged because it does more damage when charged. Doesn't seem like it should because the particle repeater doesn't spread and has to be charged to do more damage. I don't think the gun would be as bad if it only did something like 100x10 when charged. I'll test it later to get exact numbers on damage unless some one already knows.

Fully-charged, it'll fire 10 projectiles that do 20% damage each.

[sammael]

what you get from a surge bolt at long-mid range is a sniper that good damage, rapid fire in zoom (3-4 surgebolt shoots vs a bolt action sniper) low-no recoil or bloom and you can charge up to get the same damage as a bolt action sniper, so the semi auto sniper is useless, surge bolt is way better and it pretty much makes the bolt action useless, if you miss a shoot with it your dead, so you need pretty much 100% acc on moving and jumping targets for this to be effective.

at short range you can hip fire rapidly, low-no recoil or bloom and do high damage, this pretty much makes shotguns uselss, a surgebolt can outdamage them on shoort range with higher acc (if your aim is not totally **** that is)
pretty much sums up the surge bolter
so what they gonna do for the next DLC? an assault riffle with homing bullets? or maby a scope for the surge bolt that gives it auto aim? must even the game out for the players who lacks skill

[Skullsuku]

I was sniping before and still am. I use what I need for the area. I use a surge a lot and u still have to aim, just try to hit one of the bunny jumpers w/t one. Since the last patch the surge isn't as strong as it once was, most will do more damage. The way I c it the way they have most of the guns now it is all just relitive. I have a org. Thunder at about 250 dmg., and a Saw at about 400 dmg. the thunder fires 2x's as fast so witch would u concider the best. They come out to b around the same, just like the sniper rifles do. I'm 360 also and the biggest problem is the people that have almost unlimited cloak, I die more from a shot gun to the back of the head than any thing else. Now w/t the people using the "leave SW" and then re-entering when it is safe is the new problem. Like I said w/t the new patch all of the weapons r evened up much more than they were, it's just u have to use the right one for the job. I'm w/t u on the BMG's there is no auto aim for any other weapon in SW, so y should the BMGs' and bug guns get that advantage.

[duction]

because with infectors you need pretty much a whole clip + to hit them to kill them, probably more.. you wouldnt kill anyone without the aim assistance

[Milkandcookies]

what you get from a surge bolt at long-mid range is a sniper that good damage, rapid fire in zoom (3-4 surgebolt shoots vs a bolt action sniper) low-no recoil or bloom and you can charge up to get the same damage as a bolt action sniper, so the semi auto sniper is useless, surge bolt is way better and it pretty much makes the bolt action useless, if you miss a shoot with it your dead, so you need pretty much 100% acc on moving and jumping targets for this to be effective.

All I have to say is I hope you don't miss a shot using a surge bolter, once you do miss a shot, it looks like I found my breakfast/lunch/dinner today.

[Vikingkid3]

The main argument for the Surge Bolter is that it is balanced out by it's lower DPS. My question to you is have you actually tested it's dps? It does not have less dps than other semi-autos, and at least equal dps to a bolt action.

Headshots:
Any level of charge will OHK on a headshot. A non-charged headshot will not kill but you can quickly rattle off a single body shot, fast enough to counter another sniper, for a 2-hit kill.

Body Shots:
The Surge Bolter does marginally less damage than a bolt action sniper but has a high enough ROF to make up for the disparity, as well as the ability to maintain the target in the scope (if you even felt like ADS in the first place), and hip-firing like a super accurate shotgun further increasing the chances of landing that second shot.

Since the last patch, it is more difficult to survive headshots from bolt actions (consequentially it is also more difficult to survive headshots from a Surge Bolter), but it is still very possible, even though the math does not add up. For instance, using a modded Top Notch Frontier Repeater (level 20 bolt action skill), I scored a headshot on Surge Bolter user, the purple (shield damage) numbers matched the opponent's Rhino shield. The yellow (health damage) number was 2625 yet the player did not die (it is not possible to have that much health. I assume Thick Skin still kicks in on single shots, and that 2625 was actually cut in half, thus he survived). In those circumstances the Surge Bolter has higher dps than the Bolt Action, because the time between shots for the Bolt Action is far greater than the time between shots for the Surge Bolter, thus the Surge Bolter user would win that duel (assuming equal skill of the players). To clarify how the Surge Bolter user has higher DPS: we see each other, I score the headshot and he does not die. He instantly fires a non-charged shot and gets a headshot. He is still scoped and fires again, while I am loading (not reloading) and lining up my next shot. He hits, I die before I have a chance to fire again.

Bottom line, there should be no debate on whether or not a semi-automatic sniper rifle has the killing power of a bolt action sniper rifle. It should be clear cut, the semi auto may match dps on a mob, through ROF, but the bolt action wins on single-shot. When applied to PvP, the semi auto user wins by landing more shots than the bolt action user i.e. two headshots, not a headshot and body shot, before the bolt action user is able to land one (winner of such a duel would be the one who had superior movement and aim).

In theory, a weapon like the Surge Bolter fills a neat niche in the sniper category (highly mobile, quick-firing, high hit radius - a supression sniper), however, as it does twice as much damage as every other semi-auto sniper rifle, to rival that of the bolt action, it goes beyond that niche to something imbalanced. If the Surge Bolter's damage was halved (equal to all other semi-autos) it would still be a valid weapon however there would actually be a tactical choice behind it.

Is the bolt action sniper a better weapon for it's OHK capacity, if you are a good sniper? Yes, as it should be. But the point of the debate is that the Surge Bolter, a semi auto, should not encroach on that OHK territory as confidently as it does (no charge, the Surge Bolter hits equally as hard as a VOT Bolter, harder when charged). Weapons like that lessen the tactical weight of the decisions in your loadouts.

Side Note: It almost seems as if the Surge Bolter and the Particle Repeater had their base damage numbers inadvertently mixed. If that were the case, then the intended Particle Repeater, on a non-charged shot, would do about the same damage as a VOT Bolter, however if you took the time to charge it, and had the accuracy to land the shot, you would get the OHK (as opposed to doing the damage of a semi-auto on a non-charged shot and a bolt action on a charged). My experience with the Particle Repeater is limited so I am not sure how well it accomplishes that job, from what I have seen though, it seems to be less effective at filling that role than the Surge Bolter.