The new surge bolters are overpowered and need to be nerfed asap

[royal]

Ah, the good old days, when Volge were a challenge.

(PS3 NA) Was rare to get past stage 9, never got close to clearing 10 back then on the mainland; just could not kill the elite at all.

Now? 13, 14, 15--the only problem is, they don't spawn fast enough now.

[Bentu]

Honestly you only need a reasonable AR blue/purple with syphon/rad and the 40k is reachable with a bit of work.
SB is the lazy way to get there.

[Heartlight]

This alone makes it clear you are completely clueless about the mechanics of Volge Sieges. It's a zero sum game.

To be accurate, it's not true zero sum. The faster you kill, the more waves you get through, the more volge appear, the more for everyone to kill. While the kill from each singular volge is no longer available to you, it only appears zero sum if you consider each volge in a vacuum. Even with people using SBs, I can still get 40 & 50k with my saw.

And truly, getting a high score on a SB-infested volge siege is really quite satisfying to me. SBs have made people lazy but it's given me an amazing opportunity to become an even better player.

Not saying they don't need a nerf - nor saying they do - just noticing my integration of their role in my existence

[vizibledog]

SBs have made people lazy but it's given me an amazing opportunity to become an even better player.

I'm interested to know why Surge Bolters have made you a better player?

[Heartlight]

I'm interested to know why Surge Bolters have made you a better player?

Because I have to work harder to get my 40-50k at a volge siege with my regular weapon. It's a non-stop, awesome crazy time; making me think and react faster.

[Deunan]

To be accurate, it's not true zero sum. The faster you kill, the more waves you get through, the more volge appear, the more for everyone to kill. While the kill from each singular volge is no longer available to you, it only appears zero sum if you consider each volge in a vacuum. Even with people using SBs, I can still get 40 & 50k with my saw.

It is a true zero sum game. A zero sum game is one in which there are a limited amount of resources (points) that dictate that for one player to get more, another player has to get less. That holds true regardless of whether a Volge Siege gets to Wave 5 or Wave 15.

Your experience is limited and uninformed as to what will eventually happen to your score with the presence of enough players using Surge Bolters at each cap point. A handfull of Surge Bolters may help your score because it increases overall killspeed and wave progression, but if you have 3-5 players with them at each cap point, higher wave counts and more Volge won't yield a higher score since the majority of them will be annihilated by Surge Bolter shots before you can even get 400 points worth of assist damage on an Elite Viscera and significantly less on any other target.

You're score increase is entirely dependent on the ability to be able to shoot Volge long enough to get a decent score off of them whether it be an assist score or a kill score, and once true Surge Bolter infestation becomes the norm at Volge Sieges, that will cease to occur and the reverse effect will take its place.

[ten4]

I think this thread should be closed, the points have already been made a 100 times now; yes SBs are OP for sure and the WILL get nerfed utterly into the ground to the point they are worthless to make yall happy (for 5 minutes).

Then it will be off to the next weapon to cry about! Yay!

[Heartlight]

Your experience is limited and uninformed...

...and once true Surge Bolter infestation becomes the norm at Volge Sieges, that will cease to occur and the reverse effect will take its place.

My experience is current and, because it is mine, it is and can only be informed.

Thinking about it even more, I realize it is a further non-zero sum because many people are making points on one volge, not just the kill shot.

However, my point was made and I have no need to banter, argue or otherwise justify anything with you so carry on...

[Fuzzle]

I'm not taking any sides on anything but I wanted to give some information on siege scoring that might benefit people in this thread.

You get points based on the damage done to the creature. There is a bonus if you land the kill shot. Surge bolters definitely help your score because you do the entirety of the damage to the volge you are shooting (usually) and get max points for it. It's pretty annoying when you do almost all the damage to a Volge and then someone gets the kill shot on it, you both get screwed on points when this happens, but it is encouraged due to the kill shot bonus (The person with the kill shot has very few points to get a bonus on, and the person who did the damage doesn't get the bonus at all). In that aspect there is a very limited number of points you can gain by killing volge, as there are limited volge. In that manner, the points possible increase as the waves increase.

There is an exception to this though. Using the BMG to heal steals points from no one. They are bonus points, and you don't even need to actually do healing to get them. If I remember right, you get half the points that the kill shot gets as long as you recently used the heal on the person doing the kill shot. Following a surge bolter user should net you half their score, without stealing any points for "assisting" with damage.

It'd be amusing to see, but I'm certain if you were organized enough, you could take 2 people with surge bolters to a siege, have 40 people with BMG's follow them around healing as they kill all the volge, and wind up with 42 people with tier 10 scores.

So, someone do this please, and make a video of it! XD

[Bonehead]

For the record Trick has admitted the splitshot/surge bolter is overpowered due to a mistake and will be "fixed".
The only question that remains is what will "fixed" look like and when will it occur?