If cronk being removed doesn't open the devs eyes....

[heartbreak_courier]

And this is what defines a Pay to Win game. When it's significantly more efficient to spend 2 hours earning money IRL, than farming currency in-game, THAT is bad for business. (in the long run anyway.) When a 100% AF boost is the only way for the average player to compete with those who choose to buy AF, you know there is a problem. When the main method these players were using to compete, is removed, then it's a serious problem. You can't honestly be viewing this as anything other than a cash grab.

There are much better ways from Trion to make money. Just take a look at some of the most popular free to play games: Their primary source of income is through cosmetic items. (League of Legends, Runescape, Team Fortress 2, ect.)

I tend to disagree. The definition of P2W has become unreasonably fluid, but it came about because there were some early mobile games where you literally could not progress through the game without paying, and no amount of grinding would help that.

Defiance is not P2W. If anything, it's Pay for Convenience. Every F2P MMO I've played has monetized currency, and AF is Defiance's. With the exception of Runescape (which locks you out of a lot of content unless you subscribe), none of the games you listed are MMOs. It's tough for games like this to thrive on cosmetic purchases alone because they're one and done. AF, lockboxes, and boosts are probably their bread and butter, and I know similar items are usually bestsellers in other MMOs. SWTOR is practically kept afloat by them.

The drop rate for AF is another issue entirely. I consider myself a super-casual player, but I've never had problems staying competitive. I don't know if it's cynicism (probably is!) but I'm usually prepared to do some decent measure of grinding in MMOs, and compared to others, Defiance's AF grind doesn't come close to the levels of monotony I saw in EQ or early WoW. It's always seemed pretty reasonable to me, but that's my opinion.

[Abaddon2013]

You might be lucky to get that 20 AF from your lockboxes and reputation supply crates but not everyone is that lucky. I myself have recieved maybe 100 AF from around 500 lockboxes and supply crates. I know AF is considered a premium in game curreny but the cost is rediculous. And 500 to upgrade 1 weapon to oj is a bit much.

[Tex_Arcana]

By my rough calculation under the normal arkforge return system, I earn on average over 160 Arkforge a week.
This on a week where I do few Incursions or Sieges.
Based on that number, I am able to earn 640 or more Arkforge a month.
While I understand that many folks are re-rolling/upgrading; it would seem that the base supply of Arkforge is damned reasonable.
It should be noted that having become part of a solid Clan with members who help out each other in regard to getting maps done etc.: My Arkforge earning has improved vastly.
And Trion can color me happy in regard to this particular currency.
Ark Salvage on the other hand...wtf am I supposed to do with this ever-growing sack of shtako?

[SirServed]

You might be lucky to get that 20 AF from your lockboxes and reputation supply crates but not everyone is that lucky. I myself have recieved maybe 100 AF from around 500 lockboxes and supply crates. I know AF is considered a premium in game curreny but the cost is rediculous. And 500 to upgrade 1 weapon to oj is a bit much.

Owning a Legendary weapon is a privilege, not an entitlement. The steep Arkforge cost reflects that they want this to be a meaningful decision on your part.

[Fallen_Aingeal]

Owning a Legendary weapon is a privilege, not an entitlement. The steep Arkforge cost reflects that they want this to be a meaningful decision on your part.

Agreed.

I mentioned in a thread, back when arkforge was first talked about, that upgrading should be stupid high to do.

If I remember correctly, I said the cost should require all 4 forms of currency. Scrip, salvage, arkforge, and cores.

I still think it needs to be looked at. Legendary's in this game are ridiculously easy to obtain. Either that, or introduce a T5 weapon and allow us to upgrade a T4, requiring all 4 currencies.

[Dixie Cougar]

I would be more inclined to agree with the above comments if it weren't for the sheer amount of RNG-screw going on. 500 AF can get you a unicorn or a white elephant. 1000 AF can get you a good mastery or an endless circle of garbage ones. That, and not the drop rate or the nominal cost per transaction, is the real annoyance. I would happily pay 1000 or 1500 AF to oj a weapon or 150 to remaster if I could choose the bonus. All this exploiting, speedrunning, and other crap is merely a symptom of RNG disease and the overreliance on dicerolls as an endgame mechanic. The 'sploiters feel "cornered and desperate" and a trapped sploiter is the most dangerous... sploiter.

When I first heard of the amount of AF people were farming, I was jealous. Then I did some rough math and found out they were effectively working for $10 an hour. Not so jealous anymore, lol.

Nevertheless, the perception of artificial scarcity is not entirely unjustified and it can probably be corrected without leaving the game lacking for a revenue model. There are proven ways of monetizing a game that don't involve such a heavy reliance on randomness at critical points. Hell, people pay through the nose for TF2 crate keys that only contain cosmetics--got no problem with the randomness there.

Or, as I have said elsewhere, paraphrasing Clive Towers:

Attention. Anyone who is not with metal must report for amputation and rebirth at once! The RNG. We must all be released of our humanity and meld flesh with metal. Only then can we farm without sleep... the RNG... without fatigue, and without fail. The RNG. We're not waiting for orange weapons. RNG is now. Nothing will keep us from our mission. The RNG. This clan must function like a machine. We must all be a piece of the machine. Become the machine. Become the RNG. The RNG. The RNG!

[Major Crapshot]

I would say that some eyes were definitely opened today.

[Bacon Overlord]

AF levels are fine. Drop rates are more than generous and just because you're having to work a little harder at getting a weapon or some gear shouldn't be cause to come on here and start the prozac wars.

Just deal with it or find a nice, new, shiny game to play.

[Thorax The Dark]

its funny because the people who dont have enough time to play the game everyday make en excellent point which is never countered. people that have a life cant make promises to games like this. trion caters to both parties sometimes

[Holy Bahamut3]

I'm dying as I'm reading all of this.

Back for my every-so-often check in on my beloved Defiance. When my friend told me Cronkite was removed, wow, I knew it would be a good read.

Looks like everything is same-old, with rewards that stayed nerfed. I can't tell if I think it is funny or just plain sad.

Oh, Defiance, the joy you could have continued to bring me.

I'm sorry, y'all, that you are still dealing with nonsense. I used to spent too much time, I think, feeling wound up and frustrated at some of the procedures in this game. I'm over it now, but I wish the people who stuck around could still enjoy it.

Hey, glad to see you're still poking around the forums. At least they don't disappoint in giving you new song material. Lol