Defiance PvP?

[BleakPanther]

Still not understanding. You are looking for a game that will have 24/7 open world PvP? The likelyhood of that happening is slim because it removes a larger segment of gamers from the playerbase. The "carebears" outnumber the hardcore amongst potential customers. Big budget games want all players to be able to pick up the game and play when they want, how they want. No fear of getting ganked or being too weak to progress through story mode. While the players you talk to may be more vocal trust that they don't outnumber those that you don't. I am a guy that tends to PvP when the family is not around and PvE when they are. My wife on the other hand will only play PvE to better her PvP performance. She is a shooter player. She decided to sit out Defiance until she gets a better look at the PvP. You have to understand that games that need to stand out to get a share of the market aren't going to target a niche community. Defiance being a new IP has to market to the majority with a few concessions to a minority.

[Duskguy]

chraracters have a soft cap of around 5000.. so i dont think the game will be about "max the character, min/max" and then just pad stats.

as said repeatedly. SHADOW WAR is something you queue up for, in the sense that you flag yourself as ready for PvP. the queue is the game finding nearby players who also queue up, or flag themselves for PvP, and then the game generates flags to capture in that area. the PvP is all on the world, overlapping the PvE people, who can see the battle and be in the middle of it but not be killed.

in ADDITION to shadow war, there are instanced PvP battles with preloaded maps.
Trion is trying to cater to those who want a structured map they can find the best places to hide and snipe from as well as those players who want to simply flag themselves and fight on the world they are standing on.

while you queue up for either type of PvP you can continue PvE content while you wait for enough players to fight. i dont understand what you are trying to get at that things shouldn't be colonial style... you mean free for all, you mean a bunch of randoms together?

because while i believe there will be a FFA instance fight, the shadow wars have been showed off as random players/groups getting thrown onto one of two teams randomly and fighting in the area they were in. so while it is an isolated system of objective based combat, it is also thrown in right there in front of anyone who is nearby. and it has been said that open world events such as arcfalls can occur during and inside of the shadow war area, where that area is is based on where those players were when they flagged themselves for it.

[Dead_Phoenix]

more of your "kind"? im sure if there is more of your "kind" as you point it, most will see this game isnt for them and move on. rather then try and change a game to what they want it to be.

and as i said before, i have no problem with opening up new avenues for new people to experienc the game they want. i have got a problem with Trion having to put resources into it, having to go against the games lore, having to rebalance weapons to suit. basically tearing up what they did to accomidate people who wish to change games for their own pleasure.

your opinions are as valid as anyone elses. but please do not act like you speak for the majority. i know alot of console gamers, being a console gamer my self, forums friends etc. and i know they are looking forward to this game and what it is. we have a hell of alot on here as it is. i can see alot of them replying on this very thread.

i am looking forward to the DLC, as much as anyone else. im sure they will open up plenty of new content. they have talked about possible guild battles, but nothing hints remotly at open world. infact they repeatedly say they want this game to be about COOP, not war.

one more question have you played in the beta or alpha? i ask as you seem to be sure the infrustructure, indeed the game will even work with open world pvp?

[Dead_Phoenix]

alot of people keep pointing out shadow war and being qued up. shadow wars will more or less be constant as long as there are people playing it.

i would bet most of the time you can hop in and our of the shadow war much like a tag pvp system

[Cyrox]

So basically you don't want defiance you want world of warcraft+cod and players are almost invulnerable so fights can go so long that you can actually change the outcome if someone attacks you from behind and point blank. And that wouldn't make shooter pvp stupid? As you must have noticed playing your games shooters don't work if people don't die from bullets. I don't know how that xbox scene works but you really can't change games to a totally different one by wanting it. Then you look for another game.

[SeeknDestroy]

colonial era: organized structured queed up prefab battles as opposed to fluid at a moments notice can occur at anytime type of PVP interatction.

Make it so players can join a faction join a clan or simply tag themselves a pvp player and they are the only ones who would be targetable while the PVEers can freely do coops in the same game space without anyone interfering with them.

"Kind" I dont see where i wrote that and if i did wasn't trying to be derogatory i meant PVEers who want no aspect of PVP and are perfectly happy to see "their" game work the way "they" want as if its the only opinion matters.

You say i don't speak for the majority, i say ill let time decide that as the market trends have proven my viewpoint to be the correct on "console" side. PC side its the more the opposite. Is there an audience for this game absolutely. Does it tap into the larget pool console side thats debatable, we can debate it until we are blue in the face we won't know until we know, thats why it's called a free market and the consumers will decide with their wallets. Will this game do well i think so, can it do even better absolutely.

If you want to introduce PVP do it right is all, use the full "potential" of the playground you have created.

Oh, im a PS3er so i have no idea how the xbox scene works either. But i am a consoler and I can tell you, this is the game HTFU doesn't work either.

Dead phoenix you're explanation of shadow wars makes a bit more sense and i see that working well, but again what will keep the pvpers around long term and continue to purchase DLC and make it so Trion can monetize their product with us is in the manner i suggest. Sorry but being able to join a clan/faction, shawdow guild or whatever else designating you as an individual who accepts the risk of PVP at anytime is different from being forced to PVP as many of you think i suggest when i say open world PVP. What i mean if i wasnt being clear is that a player can join a subcommunity of gamers who if encountered during the course of roaming the open world can be attacked and fought in a PVP, while those who choose to not designate themselves as PVP group cannot. They can also still maintain the battle ques as well as the current iteration of shadow wars but thats just two sides.

Also i'll risk the flame and just say it, break the lore who cares, PVE can stick to lore, having persistent player conflicts can exist, break lore and it wouldnt do a darn thing to ruin the game for players who simply choose to never get involved.

It seem more like you just don't like it, it seems more a visceral reaction to badly implemented pvp systems in prior mmo's and a blind gut reaction no not in "MY" game mentality. I have repeatedly offered up a suggestion that allows a way to accomodate both player groups that wouldnt take a lot of coding, resources or anything else.

Ive conceded it's my opinion doesnt mean it's not a valid one or a good one at that, but im sorry i have found all of your rebuttals lacking.

I guess we will just agree to disagree and wait for more of my PVPers to join the good fight. Because we see a grand potential in Defiance that is being limited in its scope when it truly has the foundations to be even greater than what it already looks like it will be.

[Dead_Phoenix]

...
"Kind" I dont see where i wrote that and if i did wasn't trying to be derogatory i meant PVEers who want no aspect of PVP and are perfectly happy to see "their" game work the way "they" want as if its the only opinion matters.

here:

But at this point clearly im outnumbered at this point. I'll wait till more of my "kind" make their way here it won't be long now.

and my reference to it, was your apparent ideals that you speak for a breed of players, who will flood over us, rather then simply look, decide that is not what they want, and move on. trion have made there game, and thus their decision.

and the one thing we will definatly agree on, is time will tell.

the one thing i know, is you wont be seeing fully open world pvp servers any time soon. i would even bet at all. (but the last one is imho ofc), we will see increasements to the pvp elements of the game. they have already hinted at what. just not fully open pvp. they have proudly stated thats whats shadow war is for

[SeeknDestroy]

So basically you don't want defiance you want world of warcraft+cod and players are almost invulnerable so fights can go so long that you can actually change the outcome if someone attacks you from behind and point blank. And that wouldn't make shooter pvp stupid? As you must have noticed playing your games shooters don't work if people don't die from bullets. I don't know how that xbox scene works but you really can't change games to a totally different one by wanting it. Then you look for another game.

Don't know about you but theres a difference b/w twitch shooter and strafe shooter. Strafe shooter pvp allows for player skill beyond gear doesnt it. Perhaps thats the threatening part the idea that a GAWD build can be taken down by a day 1 if they have the appropriate gun game. But perhaps thats a gross over generalization and unfair.

But I DO want DEFIANCE. I also would like to see a bit more out of it because it will retain the "shooters" for a longer period of time.
Like i said this will do in PC, as there is a LARGER core group on that platform that likes this gameplay.

Console side market trends have shown this "as is" will not be "enough" for player retention. I do however hope im wrong.

[SeeknDestroy]

here:



and my reference to it, was your apparent ideals that you speak for a breed of players, who will flood over us, rather then simply look, decide that is not what they want, and move on. trion have made there game, and thus their decision.

and the one thing we will definatly agree on, is time will tell.

the one thing i know, is you wont be seeing fully open world pvp servers any time soon. i would even bet at all. (but the last one is imho ofc), we will see increasements to the pvp elements of the game. they have already hinted at what. just not fully open pvp. they have proudly stated thats whats shadow war is for

You're right its very likely the shooter fans i speak of will likely play and see it and pass. I just know ive got a lot of Dust closed vets, BF3 players, Mag vets, UC, KZ, Socom and a host of other shooter fans riled up for this game, ive been sending them links to live stream of the alpha and doing what i can to help bring in that tight knit community over to this game and i want them to stick because i believe this game has the potential to be the next big epic game, the one that captures a community beyond the sterotypical shelf like of console online games.

[Dead_Phoenix]

You're right its very likely the shooter fans i speak of will likely play and see it and pass. I just know ive got a lot of Dust closed vets, BF3 players, Mag vets, UC, KZ, Socom and a host of other shooter fans riled up for this game, ive been sending them links to live stream of the alpha and doing what i can to help bring in that tight knit community over to this game and i want them to stick because i believe this game has the potential to be the next big epic game, the one that captures a community beyond the sterotypical shelf like of console online games.

always fine words to hear

yea i was in the dust beta since practically the begining. and have alot of close friends in all of those.

i suppose the main selling point of defiance is its constant story driven, in a never ending tale. with tons to do. hopefully they will like it and stay for all aspects. and not expect 1