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  1. #1
    Member SanCarioca's Avatar
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    Here's the gender of the Warmaster

    Today, I was lucky enough to get to virtually meet one of the original Defiance Devs, back in 2013. He was responsible for the Lore of the Game *and* the TV Show.

    The Geek in me had to contain itself as to not overload him with questions, but I did ask him about one lore issue that I never saw a definitive answer for: is the Warmaster a male or a female... or genders do not apply to the Volge at all?

    This is how the conversation went, until it finally put an end to this ages-old question (maybe only for me, I'd wager)!

    San: So, is the Warmaster a Male, Female or Genders do not apply to the Volge?

    Dev: The Volge begin life as male and change to female, if a change occurs

    San: So, am I correct to deduce the Warmaster is a female, since she's different from all the other Volges, implying a change did occur with her?

    Dev: San, the Warmaster used to have another name that I can't recall. The shards that flew off of the body were similar to eggs. Some would explode and release little critters. That all seemed to change.

    San: Also awesome to know, but... I feel like nagging... but again, is the Warmaster a male or a female? Really, it's just a fan question, this has absolutely no importance, but it bugged me for years.

    Dev: female

    San: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHH, THANK YOU! YEARS OF DESPAIR FINALLY SOLVED

  2. #2
    Member Light Energy's Avatar
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    Thanks for sharing this, SanCarioca. How lucky you were to meet one of the original people who worked on both the game and the show. Obviously there was a lot of overlap between the two ... but often things change and evolve over time and somehow the Gulanee in game and the show ended up very different. Perhaps the Gulanee in the game are male and the one in the show was female (Season 2, Episode 6, “This Woman's Work”)?

    So ... I guess the Warmaster is like the Volge equivalent to the Hellbug Matron. She can shoot out skitterlings and summon Hellbug warriors and archers, just as the Warmaster can summon troopers etc.
    And the Volge gender change sounds a bit like how some animals can change gender:
    A school of clownfish is always built into a hierarchy with a female fish at the top. When she dies, the most dominant male changes sex and takes her place.
    And I guess, once again, we can't trust what EGO tells us.



    I would have had so many questions, it's hard to know where I would begin. My first question, at least in my mind, would have been: “How can we be sure this person is really one of the original content designers / writers?”

  3. #3
    Member SanCarioca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light Energy View Post
    Thanks for sharing this, SanCarioca. How lucky you were to meet one of the original people who worked on both the game and the show. Obviously there was a lot of overlap between the two ... but often things change and evolve over time and somehow the Gulanee in game and the show ended up very different. Perhaps the Gulanee in the game are male and the one in the show was female (Season 2, Episode 6, “This Woman's Work”)?
    Realistically, I think these differences were severely attached to the budget of the show... It's as we say in Comic Books: all it takes to create a magnificent space opera is a piece of paper and an artist. That's how Infinity War, the comics, came to be originally. But the movie cost almost $200 million to make, so there's that...

    And the Volge gender change sounds a bit like how some animals can change gender:
    A-ha! Great catch there, my friend. That's exactly why I asked if genders even applied to the Volge race, in the first place.

    And I guess, once again, we can't trust what EGO tells us.
    EGO is lovely, but sometimes, she can make some mistakes. BTW, since English is my second language, I ask: would it be acceptable to interpret that, when she refers to "Him", she's saying that as in relation to "Him, The Warmaster"? As "Warmaster" being an honorific title, not the gender of the character, specifically?

    BTW, I don't remember if the mind our EGO is based upon was male or female... and yet, her digital presence is definitely female.

    I would have had so many questions, it's hard to know where I would begin. My first question, at least in my mind, would have been: “How can we be sure this person is really one of the original content designers / writers?”
    He has been posting Defiance design concepts that never went to fruition, so I think he's legit -- I have the Defiance Art Book, and nothing he posts comes from there. For example, he posted a sketch of the Hulker, that was supposed to be covered in American Football "armor" and that Drill we wear in the back of the Gulanite Miner Outfit was supposed to be an actual weapon, that we could use in the game.

  4. #4
    Member Light Energy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    Realistically, I think these differences were severely attached to the budget of the show... It's as we say in Comic Books: all it takes to create a magnificent space opera is a piece of paper and an artist. That's how Infinity War, the comics, came to be originally. But the movie cost almost $200 million to make, so there's that...
    Well ... that's one aspect for sure. An idea starts off costing nothing ... and then to bring it to life can take an enormous amount of money and hard work.
    But ... when there are design differences between shows and games ... when there is little obvious difference (to me) in how much it would cost to make; my first guess is that it is simply a result of a lack of communication between the two departments or artists or ... yes ... secondly, because things on the show might have been altered due to time restraints and costs.

    I'm fairly sure they could have made the Gulanee in the game look more like the one in the show if they wanted to ... because a lot of the design / artwork had been done. Also, the people doing the CGI for the show must have created 3D assets anyway.


    Credit: Jonathan Standing

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    A-ha! Great catch there, my friend. That's exactly why I asked if genders even applied to the Volge race, in the first place.
    Ah yes ... the creators seemed to like the ambiguity (the Volge always 'wear' armor) ... the same way with the engineered Indogene race (almost androgynous).

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    EGO is lovely, but sometimes, she can make some mistakes.
    Ha, yes ... she certainly likes to tell me the same things many, many times

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    BTW, since English is my second language, I ask: would it be acceptable to interpret that, when she refers to "Him", she's saying that as in relation to "Him, The Warmaster"? As "Warmaster" being an honorific title, not the gender of the character, specifically?
    Well ... my interpretation of what happened is that the Warmaster entity began life as female in the writing / creative process. At some point they change it to be male in the game. They changed the shards and removed the eggs from them. They gave the creature the title "Warmaster" and programmed EGO to call the being 'him'. To me, that implies he must be male:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_(form_of_address)
    I grew up in England (where English originated ) ... and I was addressed as 'master' when I was younger. Master became "Mister" (in speach) which in turn becomes "Mr."
    So to me, the "Warmaster" has to be male ... otherwise they could have called her the "Warmistress" or "Volge Queen" or something like that.

    Also, I want to say I think your level of English is excellent, SanCarioca.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    BTW, I don't remember if the mind our EGO is based upon was male or female... and yet, her digital presence is definitely female.
    Hmmm ... I think they decided to make her female in the game ... hence her appearance and voice. In the show ... from what I recall with Amanda Rosewater's experience with one ... that EGO implant had no persona as such (who knows, maybe Doc Yewll disabled that function).

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    He has been posting Defiance design concepts that never went to fruition, so I think he's legit -- I have the Defiance Art Book, and nothing he posts comes from there. For example, he posted a sketch of the Hulker, that was supposed to be covered in American Football "armor" and that Drill we wear in the back of the Gulanite Miner Outfit was supposed to be an actual weapon, that we could use in the game.
    Ah I see, I thought they were just some random player you happened to meet in game. Yes, they obviously spent a lot of time going through many ideas ... only some of which made it on to the (virtual) screen.


    Credit: Jonathan Standing

  5. #5
    Member SanCarioca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Light Energy View Post
    Well ... my interpretation of what happened is that the Warmaster entity began life as female in the writing / creative process. At some point they change it to be male in the game. They changed the shards and removed the eggs from them. They gave the creature the title "Warmaster" and programmed EGO to call the being 'him'. To me, that implies he must be male
    That's a good theory since we know all the original Devs were fired as soon as the game launched. So, it's completely possible the Dev I've been talking about could have outdated information.


    I grew up in England (where English originated ) ... and I was addressed as 'master' when I was younger. Master became "Mister" (in speach) which in turn becomes "Mr."
    Were you a Martial Artist or scholar then?

    So to me, the "Warmaster" has to be male ... otherwise they could have called her the "Warmistress" or "Volge Queen" or something like that.
    Well, you put the doubt in me again. Years of despair returning.

    Also, I want to say I think your level of English is excellent, SanCarioca.
    It would honor me if you'd call me San, and thank you for your kindness. I try not to cringe other people's reads.

    About EGO:

    Hmmm ... I think they decided to make her female in the game ... hence her appearance
    and voice. In the show ... from what I recall with Amanda Rosewater's experience with one ... that EGO implant had no persona as such (who knows, maybe Doc Yewll disabled that function).
    IIRC, our personal EGO was based on a female indogene scientist, not unrelated to Godash. But I can't vouch for any of this, I'd have to replay Season 3. I hope it comes to 2050, then I'll pay more attention to that.

    I love these kind of conversations.

  6. #6
    Member Valani's Avatar
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    You just had to go downstairs, didn't you?
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteStrike View Post
    Understand that the players aren't your personal police force that must be looking out for hackers 24/7. That is your job.
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    Why do they focus on "lesser known bugs" that are not major concerns! Lag and disconnects On the other hand are the two main problems that everyone wants a fix for.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cygnus View Post
    Because after 4 years of defiance, if you're still here, then it's not that big of a problem. Right?
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    Loot boxes are not pay to win.

  7. #7
    Member Light Energy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    That's a good theory since we know all the original Devs were fired as soon as the game launched. So, it's completely possible the Dev I've been talking about could have outdated information.
    Ah, perhaps. But I think there were so many people involved and these things are quite organic in the development process. It took them 5 years, from 2008 to 2013 ... so many things probably changed in that time.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    Were you a Martial Artist or scholar then?
    Ha no, perhaps just an aspiring artist .

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    Well, you put the doubt in me again. Years of despair returning.
    Oh wow … I didn't realise the Warmaster meant so much to you . According to what you said, he can always change to a she anyway .

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    It would honor me if you'd call me San, and thank you for your kindness. I try not to cringe other people's reads.
    Thank you, that saves me a bit of typing . The cringe levels are very low in your messages … lower than the Warmaster's butt.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    IIRC, our personal EGO was based on a female indogene scientist, not unrelated to Godash. But I can't vouch for any of this, I'd have to replay Season 3.
    Aha, yeah, that sounds familiar. It was a little weird when I played through the storyline … because I was trying to fit it in to what I had already seen a while before. I watched all 3 seasons before I set foot in virtual Defiance. So then it was a case of … “Oh … so now we know more about Rynn.”
    For some reason, I expected to be able to play in the town of Defiance … to be able to enter those white Castithan rooms, to practice knife throwing with Irisa, to visit the Need Want, to meet some Omec …

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    I hope it comes to 2050, then I'll pay more attention to that.
    Yeah, it would help refresh our memories.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanCarioca View Post
    I love these kind of conversations.


    Quote Originally Posted by Valani View Post
    You just had to go downstairs, didn't you?
    Ha
    Once you undo the thing upstairs, most people would be curious as to what is down below .

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