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  1. #1
    Member twowolves80's Avatar
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    Defiance: Universe (A Path Forward)

    Okay, so we can sit around and whine about how nothing is getting done, but when has pointing out the obvious ever worked to solve a problem?

    I'm going to lay out a plan of action that anyone who cares to advance their career can crib off of to present to the BoE during the next quarterly report meeting. This thread is for any ideas thereof that will benefit this. I'll try to be as exhaustively comprehensive as I can.

    1. Re-brand Defiance 2050. Yes, again. Right now, it's barely a blip on anyone's radar, and anyone who goes online can see how much of a ghost town it is. I happen to remember the good ol' days when you would see other players all over the place no matter where you were. How do you bring back and re-build the core fan base becomes an issue. Yes, Gamigo is a company that sells itself as a sort of middleman that structures the company alongside it's line of "hits," as defined by Gamigo. This is not a knock; we can do better.

    Re-brand it and call it Defiance: Universe. Let go of the canon, or add to it in a way that doesn't require massive retconning. Most of the UI is solid; the classes less so. But by re-branding it, you (Gamigo) get to "re-launch" the game with fresh advertising and whatnot, and then, the question becomes, what are you going to include in it?

    2. Pull developers off other projects/hire more. Period. There's no two ways around this. You're going to have to buck the system (I understand it's in Germany where the markets are terrible right now; consider moving to the US, if you ultimately will benefit your company's bottom line) and invest in yourself. Offer shares in the company, take out loans, whatever. If you're going to compete against companies like [censored] and [censored], you're going to have to play big. Fill the landscape with new buildings and explorable areas. Open up more of the islands. Finish off the Von Bach storyline properly and bring back Cass Ducar.

    It absolutely, 100% will pay off. You must believe this. The modding community for games like [censored] and [censored] are huge because of the ability to mod them. You could outdo them by being the first to have an MMO that is moddable. Out of necessity, this would take a bit of risk because you are being asked to trust a bunch of people sitting around tinkering with code all day, but it can be done; the only question is, who will be the first to do it? If you build a better mousetrap, as the expression goes, the world will beat a path to your doorstep. Developers are key, though, and those developers must be willing to have conversations with the modders. This happens quite a bit over on the Nexus, believe it or not, and their pay system for the stuff you buy in their MMO is based off the pay system for their main games. So it's all relative.

    More new content in the form of explorable areas, missions, side missions, radiant missions (especially radiant missions), and more vehicles and earnable stuff in-game like outfits is the way to go until you get the following up and running:

    3. Release a toolkit to mod Defiance 2050. This will require four main things:

    a. An infernally lock-tight EULA in which any users agree to waive everything, including, but not limited to, their souls, their dignity, their right to protest, and forcing them to agree to any number of heinous Spanish Inquisition-style execution methods (where applicable by law) for breaking it;

    b. A beta server dedicated to holding the mods in situ in the hopes of being uploaded in a patch (in terms of new storyline content/new quests/new assets) or uploaded into the store (similar to [censored].net so you can earn in-game bits for people buying your bit trash like outfits and what have you--I've seen some pretty cool stuff come out in other games) pending a review. This server would have several functions; in addition to being a storage area, it would allow players to test out the mods in a closed environment that is sequestered from the main server, it would have AV scanning software on it to check for exploits and malware similar to what is used on the Nexus (and Robin would probably have no problem referring you at Gamigo to a good methodology for this), and it would allow devs to pick and choose from a literal, virtual library of pre-generated goodies they would be free to use at whim thanks to the EULA for the price of a simple thank you in the footnotes of the patch for their contribution (so it can be used in the future if they choose to pursue a career in video game design) and some Gamigo swag which in turn also generates you more free publicity and advertising.

    c. A dev master to occasionally review the logs and purge any offending mods that do not fit within company policy/community guidelines. This dev also takes note of any outstanding mods and acts as a talent scout for Gamigo. Yet another way to extract profit.

    d. The tool kit itself. I'll refer to it as the Terraform Electronic Creation System, or TECS for short (because you gotta have a good acronym, so come up with something better if you can). This TECS would be hard-coded in a proprietary archive file format (like...GGA "Gamigo Games Archive" or something) that would be off-limits as outlined in the EULA. This means, you may use assets from it, but you must give the credit to the company for the asset, and you are not allowed to use the asset anywhere else, or attempt to put it back into the archive in modified form and then attempt to upload it to the main server. Any attempts to upload thusly (or any other way) you would just ban the offender and refer them for criminal prosecution where applicable by law. Not only that, the tool kit could tag the assets loaded into it with a MODIFIED bash tag so the main server would always know when someone tries it. The tool kit would also have zero access to the pay system, so there's no point in even attempting to use it for exploits. This removes incentive to try. And on top of it all, the tool kit would only ever work in conjunction with the beta server, so you would log into a gamigo browser on your desktop, select the tool kit, and it would load you into a small cell in the beta server so you could test out/create a mod. Doesn't have to be bigger than 500 by 500 meters. Have a few different random landscapes to choose from, too. Scripts would have to be allowed, but again, on the beta server, it doesn't matter. Damage is limited to anyone with malicious intent.

    4. Put your game on the Nexus (pretty sure it's there already) and advertise the tool kit there. Talk to the modders, act on the feedback you're given. Bug slaying is a PITA and these modders over there are famous for their meticulousness when combing for bugs. If you really want to get people on the ball, offer bit bouties. Doesn't have to be much. Offer Gamigo swag. Defiance swag. That's free advertising. MxR would be on YouTube talking about it while wearing whatever you sent, and you'd be made.

    5. Fix these forums. Put a forum in specifically for feedback, and then act on it. Start marking the threads as to whether the bug is fixed or not, and lock as need be. You are the all the moderators; I'm just offering a bit of advice from my time witnessing all the idiocy on the Nexus over the years.

    6. Advertise, advertise, advertise. Get SyFy on board. Put the show back on with a new cast, and don't tie it to the game in such obvious fashion. Instead, make small references to the game, use the same vehicles, the same building style for the factions, etc. The more you pack the landscape in the game with, ironically, the more you will have to work with in the tv show should you bring it back.

    7. Bring back the old EGO grid. Part of the appeal of the old Defiance was being able to take a base class and tweak it with a broad array of abilities to fit your play style. You could go more stealthy if you liked, or more tank. Innovate instead by offering, similar to the other MMO [censored] where you can have companions, or Specters that you drop out like a grenade. You started this with the new Medic class, I believe. Why not diversify it further and offer other types to all classes? The assault could drop bulwarks. The medics drop bots that restore your shields. The assassins drop bots that kamikaze the enemy, et cetera.

    If you do those seven things, you will win GoTY awards every year and completely blind-side [censored] after their terrible rollout of [censored], while making so much money hiring devs will no longer ever be an issue again.

    What do you have to lose? Nothing. Literally. This is a solid plan to move forward; logistics are your problem. Get the devs in there and follow this plan, though, and you'll have a fan base that will stay with you for years and years.

    "Death inspires me like a dog inspires a rabbit." --Twenty One Pilots, Heavy, Dirty Soul

    "We each owe a death. There are no exceptions. But oh, God, sometimes the Green Mile seems so long." --Paul Edgecomb

    Who am I? Just a rolling stone, gathering no moss; a fool who knows nothing, only that he's lost. --tw

  2. #2
    Nice grocery list. The only weak spot is that groceries are not free.

    They are going to put exactly 0$ within this game. Everything you wish for cost something. Their business plan is to just keep sailing until the boat sinks. You need to see gamigo as a tobacco company. They're gonna sell their products until they run out of customers, without any improvement to it.

    Your only chance for an improvement to this game would be that gamigo sells the ip to someone else. Therefore your best bet, if you ever want to know whether you're right or wrong about this game making more money, it to buy it and run. So, contact gamigo, tell them to give you a price, then get the money to buy it. You'll be free to do as you please.

  3. #3
    Double post. Even their forum is kinda buggy.

  4. #4
    Member crasher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICantAim View Post
    Nice grocery list. The only weak spot is that groceries are not free.

    They are going to put exactly 0$ within this game. Everything you wish for cost something. Their business plan is to just keep sailing until the boat sinks. You need to see gamigo as a tobacco company. They're gonna sell their products until they run out of customers, without any improvement to it.

    Your only chance for an improvement to this game would be that gamigo sells the ip to someone else. Therefore your best bet, if you ever want to know whether you're right or wrong about this game making more money, it to buy it and run. So, contact gamigo, tell them to give you a price, then get the money to buy it. You'll be free to do as you please.
    A lot of us assume that the only reason DEFI is still open is because the server hasn't caught fire yet, and that it's open at all is because it was already running when they had to take it as a package deal to get the TROVE ip they wanted.
    These are just my opinions.
    I have lots of opinions.
    Some of them, on occasion, people have agreed with.
    I do not trust those people.

    NA/pc.
    2013:
    Mid E-5XXX main, but I played 26+ 'toons from E400 to E5500. (Dormant)
    2050: Lvl 499X main

  5. #5
    Defiance's chickens don't have golden eggs.

  6. #6
    Member twowolves80's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICantAim View Post
    Nice grocery list. The only weak spot is that groceries are not free.

    They are going to put exactly 0$ within this game. Everything you wish for cost something. Their business plan is to just keep sailing until the boat sinks. You need to see gamigo as a tobacco company. They're gonna sell their products until they run out of customers, without any improvement to it.

    Your only chance for an improvement to this game would be that gamigo sells the ip to someone else. Therefore your best bet, if you ever want to know whether you're right or wrong about this game making more money, it to buy it and run. So, contact gamigo, tell them to give you a price, then get the money to buy it. You'll be free to do as you please.
    https://youtu.be/YKQcx1jzn4k?t=206
    "Death inspires me like a dog inspires a rabbit." --Twenty One Pilots, Heavy, Dirty Soul

    "We each owe a death. There are no exceptions. But oh, God, sometimes the Green Mile seems so long." --Paul Edgecomb

    Who am I? Just a rolling stone, gathering no moss; a fool who knows nothing, only that he's lost. --tw

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by twowolves80 View Post
    Okay, so we can sit around and whine about how nothing is getting done, but when has pointing out the obvious ever worked to solve a problem?

    I'm going to lay out a plan of action that anyone who cares to advance their career can crib off of to present to the BoE during the next quarterly report meeting. This thread is for any ideas thereof that will benefit this. I'll try to be as exhaustively comprehensive as I can.

    1. Re-brand Defiance 2050. Yes, again. Right now, it's barely a blip on anyone's radar, and anyone who goes online can see how much of a ghost town it is. I happen to remember the good ol' days when you would see other players all over the place no matter where you were. How do you bring back and re-build the core fan base becomes an issue. Yes, Gamigo is a company that sells itself as a sort of middleman that structures the company alongside it's line of "hits," as defined by Gamigo. This is not a knock; we can do better.

    Re-brand it and call it Defiance: Universe. Let go of the canon, or add to it in a way that doesn't require massive retconning. Most of the UI is solid; the classes less so. But by re-branding it, you (Gamigo) get to "re-launch" the game with fresh advertising and whatnot, and then, the question becomes, what are you going to include in it?

    2. Pull developers off other projects/hire more. Period. There's no two ways around this. You're going to have to buck the system (I understand it's in Germany where the markets are terrible right now; consider moving to the US, if you ultimately will benefit your company's bottom line) and invest in yourself. Offer shares in the company, take out loans, whatever. If you're going to compete against companies like [censored] and [censored], you're going to have to play big. Fill the landscape with new buildings and explorable areas. Open up more of the islands. Finish off the Von Bach storyline properly and bring back Cass Ducar.

    It absolutely, 100% will pay off. You must believe this. The modding community for games like [censored] and [censored] are huge because of the ability to mod them. You could outdo them by being the first to have an MMO that is moddable. Out of necessity, this would take a bit of risk because you are being asked to trust a bunch of people sitting around tinkering with code all day, but it can be done; the only question is, who will be the first to do it? If you build a better mousetrap, as the expression goes, the world will beat a path to your doorstep. Developers are key, though, and those developers must be willing to have conversations with the modders. This happens quite a bit over on the Nexus, believe it or not, and their pay system for the stuff you buy in their MMO is based off the pay system for their main games. So it's all relative.

    More new content in the form of explorable areas, missions, side missions, radiant missions (especially radiant missions), and more vehicles and earnable stuff in-game like outfits is the way to go until you get the following up and running:

    3. Release a toolkit to mod Defiance 2050. This will require four main things:

    a. An infernally lock-tight EULA in which any users agree to waive everything, including, but not limited to, their souls, their dignity, their right to protest, and forcing them to agree to any number of heinous Spanish Inquisition-style execution methods (where applicable by law) for breaking it;

    b. A beta server dedicated to holding the mods in situ in the hopes of being uploaded in a patch (in terms of new storyline content/new quests/new assets) or uploaded into the store (similar to [censored].net so you can earn in-game bits for people buying your bit trash like outfits and what have you--I've seen some pretty cool stuff come out in other games) pending a review. This server would have several functions; in addition to being a storage area, it would allow players to test out the mods in a closed environment that is sequestered from the main server, it would have AV scanning software on it to check for exploits and malware similar to what is used on the Nexus (and Robin would probably have no problem referring you at Gamigo to a good methodology for this), and it would allow devs to pick and choose from a literal, virtual library of pre-generated goodies they would be free to use at whim thanks to the EULA for the price of a simple thank you in the footnotes of the patch for their contribution (so it can be used in the future if they choose to pursue a career in video game design) and some Gamigo swag which in turn also generates you more free publicity and advertising.

    c. A dev master to occasionally review the logs and purge any offending mods that do not fit within company policy/community guidelines. This dev also takes note of any outstanding mods and acts as a talent scout for Gamigo. Yet another way to extract profit.

    d. The tool kit itself. I'll refer to it as the Terraform Electronic Creation System, or TECS for short (because you gotta have a good acronym, so come up with something better if you can). This TECS would be hard-coded in a proprietary archive file format (like...GGA "Gamigo Games Archive" or something) that would be off-limits as outlined in the EULA. This means, you may use assets from it, but you must give the credit to the company for the asset, and you are not allowed to use the asset anywhere else, or attempt to put it back into the archive in modified form and then attempt to upload it to the main server. Any attempts to upload thusly (or any other way) you would just ban the offender and refer them for criminal prosecution where applicable by law. Not only that, the tool kit could tag the assets loaded into it with a MODIFIED bash tag so the main server would always know when someone tries it. The tool kit would also have zero access to the pay system, so there's no point in even attempting to use it for exploits. This removes incentive to try. And on top of it all, the tool kit would only ever work in conjunction with the beta server, so you would log into a gamigo browser on your desktop, select the tool kit, and it would load you into a small cell in the beta server so you could test out/create a mod. Doesn't have to be bigger than 500 by 500 meters. Have a few different random landscapes to choose from, too. Scripts would have to be allowed, but again, on the beta server, it doesn't matter. Damage is limited to anyone with malicious intent.

    4. Put your game on the Nexus (pretty sure it's there already) and advertise the tool kit there. Talk to the modders, act on the feedback you're given. Bug slaying is a PITA and these modders over there are famous for their meticulousness when combing for bugs. If you really want to get people on the ball, offer bit bouties. Doesn't have to be much. Offer Gamigo swag. Defiance swag. That's free advertising. MxR would be on YouTube talking about it while wearing whatever you sent, and you'd be made.

    5. Fix these forums. Put a forum in specifically for feedback, and then act on it. Start marking the threads as to whether the bug is fixed or not, and lock as need be. You are the all the moderators; I'm just offering a bit of advice from my time witnessing all the idiocy on the Nexus over the years.

    6. Advertise, advertise, advertise. Get SyFy on board. Put the show back on with a new cast, and don't tie it to the game in such obvious fashion. Instead, make small references to the game, use the same vehicles, the same building style for the factions, etc. The more you pack the landscape in the game with, ironically, the more you will have to work with in the tv show should you bring it back.

    7. Bring back the old EGO grid. Part of the appeal of the old Defiance was being able to take a base class and tweak it with a broad array of abilities to fit your play style. You could go more stealthy if you liked, or more tank. Innovate instead by offering, similar to the other MMO [censored] where you can have companions, or Specters that you drop out like a grenade. You started this with the new Medic class, I believe. Why not diversify it further and offer other types to all classes? The assault could drop bulwarks. The medics drop bots that restore your shields. The assassins drop bots that kamikaze the enemy, et cetera.

    If you do those seven things, you will win GoTY awards every year and completely blind-side [censored] after their terrible rollout of [censored], while making so much money hiring devs will no longer ever be an issue again.

    What do you have to lose? Nothing. Literally. This is a solid plan to move forward; logistics are your problem. Get the devs in there and follow this plan, though, and you'll have a fan base that will stay with you for years and years.

    These are all solid ideas

  8. #8
    Member twowolves80's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j3crow View Post
    These are all solid ideas

    I figured it was better to try to come up with solutions than simply say, "That won't work," over and over in infinite variations. IDGAF about why it won't work; I'm more interested in how we, as in we players AND the yokels at Gamigo, can make a go of it.

    Feel free to add to/elaborate on any of my suggestions. The more we can refine them into an actionable plan, the more likely it is that Gamigo will take it seriously, especially if we do all the legwork and research. Then, they only have to present it to the BoE, explain why it's a good idea to have bank trucks delivering cash to your door every day in profits, and wait for the fireworks.
    "Death inspires me like a dog inspires a rabbit." --Twenty One Pilots, Heavy, Dirty Soul

    "We each owe a death. There are no exceptions. But oh, God, sometimes the Green Mile seems so long." --Paul Edgecomb

    Who am I? Just a rolling stone, gathering no moss; a fool who knows nothing, only that he's lost. --tw

  9. #9
    Member crasher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twowolves80 View Post
    I figured it was better to try to come up with solutions than simply say, "That won't work," over and over in infinite variations. IDGAF about why it won't work; I'm more interested in how we, as in we players AND the yokels at Gamigo, can make a go of it.

    Feel free to add to/elaborate on any of my suggestions. The more we can refine them into an actionable plan, the more likely it is that Gamigo will take it seriously, especially if we do all the legwork and research. Then, they only have to present it to the BoE, explain why it's a good idea to have bank trucks delivering cash to your door every day in profits, and wait for the fireworks.
    It wont work until Gamigo decides it is in their own best interests to take a chance and invest money in a dev team to create the tool kit AND be willing to release the IP into the wild to ALLOW the public to create content that will run on THEIR servers which will then become THEIR liability if malicious software is introduced onto their servers and disseminated to the PUBLIC that could compromise users security and financial/personal data.
    Gamigo is in the business of RUNNING games for people to use, they BUY content, they don't CREATE content and aren't equipped to VET publicly created software.

    Any of that could change should they decide to alter their policy.
    Convince them.
    These are just my opinions.
    I have lots of opinions.
    Some of them, on occasion, people have agreed with.
    I do not trust those people.

    NA/pc.
    2013:
    Mid E-5XXX main, but I played 26+ 'toons from E400 to E5500. (Dormant)
    2050: Lvl 499X main

  10. #10
    Member twowolves80's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crasher View Post
    It wont work until Gamigo decides it is in their own best interests to take a chance and invest money in a dev team to create the tool kit AND be willing to release the IP into the wild to ALLOW the public to create content that will run on THEIR servers which will then become THEIR liability if malicious software is introduced onto their servers and disseminated to the PUBLIC that could compromise users security and financial/personal data.
    Gamigo is in the business of RUNNING games for people to use, they BUY content, they don't CREATE content and aren't equipped to VET publicly created software.

    Any of that could change should they decide to alter their policy.
    Convince them.

    Yes, but it wouldn't really be releasing any content directly "into the wild," as you put it, because it could only EVER be uploaded to the beta server. The toolkit as envisioned wouldn't even have the functionality to interact with the main server. That beta server would be loaded with the same anti-virus software, and the same exploit-scanning software, that Nexusmods has used for years with almost zero problems. So, that helps alleviate some of the concern Gamigo may have.

    Plus, any content created by the public is, immediately upon creation, considered property of Gamigo. So it's their assets, their servers, their financial gain. Gamigo wouldn't even have to create content to make this work. They could rely entirely upon the content generated by the players on the TECS. Vetting would be done by volunteers and software, same as it is done on [censored].net and Nexusmods. So, Gamigo wouldn't have as big an uphill climb as you might first think.

    And, if Gamigo insists upon keeping its current model, it can simply "buy" the IPs from modders with small amounts of bits, Defiance swag, and other incentives that cost Gamigo's bottom line exactly $0, but generate hundreds of thousands in free advertising. Or, Gamigo can simply form a company of developers separate from itself, and then turn around and "buy" it and keep it as a subsidiary. The policy doesn't even have to really change much, so we're not asking for a sea change here, simply small changes that will reap huge rewards for both Gamigo and the player community.
    "Death inspires me like a dog inspires a rabbit." --Twenty One Pilots, Heavy, Dirty Soul

    "We each owe a death. There are no exceptions. But oh, God, sometimes the Green Mile seems so long." --Paul Edgecomb

    Who am I? Just a rolling stone, gathering no moss; a fool who knows nothing, only that he's lost. --tw

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