What do you guys think of weapons?

[Youngwings]

I personally Like that once a weapon is maxed, you cant use it level anymore... make me try new weapons. As for the SMG, LMG and AR having the same ammo type... i think that sucks. And "Yellow" Weapons having the same stats is inaccurate. They may have the same damage, and the same reload... but the color determines the extra stats. "Yellow" has none, Blue has 1, Purple has 2, and Orange has 3. For instance, i have 2 VBI SMGs, one Yellow, has no extras, and the other is Orange, has 1.10x Rate of Fire, 10% Ego Recharge on Kill, and +15% Grenade Recharge on Full Reload.

[AgentMytho]

First I played to ego 850 and I am on the last main mission in the game, and I have been using the same 186 shotgun and 236 assault rifle the whole game. Which means my highest weapon level in the game is 2. So it doesn't completely screw you to not have a weapon level 20, although it will probably hurt you in PVP.

But once I realized this I did go out and bought a couple of cheap AR's and spent about 3 hours maxing out their experience (casual play not grinding kills) to get my AR skill to 6.

On the other hand my secondary weapon, a sawed off shotgun, is so slow to use and so situational, that despite trying to use it as much as possible I only earned about 1/4 of the experience bar on the weapon (although I think i got up to weapon level 3).

So basically I think the system is flawed, since it is much more difficult to upgarde some weapons, and kind of a cheesy way to force palyers to swap weapons of the same type. On the otherhand if you choose not to participate it is't the end of the world.

[xXChromeGhostXx]

I think they seriously need to stop nerfing the physical players and give us bump ups jesus christ, we're facing 10-30 enemies with skilles equal to ours but yet they nail me from across the map with SMG's and do full damage with them BS i'm ten feet away and y damage drops so bad it's stupid. We need better shields.. ohhh 1030 wit 40 sec charge and 3 delay yeah okay, best I found is a Rhino3 with 1703 30% but like a 9. delay. it's BS bump our stats on shields and nerf the ****ing enemies. I mean I just finished the mission where have to activate all the Bulwarks and fight off the Dark matter. And that was ridiculous c'mon this is something that needs be addressed quickly. that or nerf the enemies down one gee.
Especially in Co-Op i'm EGO 726, but joining multiplayer matches in co-op with people 500-under they can't do **** to the enemies and im left doing the work it's BS.

[Napalm Sunrise]

sorry if a thread like this has been created before but I'm talking to a friend about all the weapon mechanics and i wanted to see what everyone else though, such as.

• Not getting skill EXP after you max your guns EXP to full?
• SMG, LMG and assault rifles having the same ammo pools?
• yellow guns doing more DMG then oranges?

I've noticed a lot of threads complaining about guns and i usually stick to the answer "the devs wanted to keep the game balanced" but there comes a point when its kind of ridiculous.. I have an orange SMG that does less damage then a yellow? and the guns i do enjoy using i never get to use except for in PVP because they dont get me skill exp... I dont want this to turn into another one of those "oh lets bash on this person, they hate the game" i love the game and have played it none stop since release! XD

I'm beginning to believe that the stats are so secondary they should have just scrapped the color system altogether. It's causing too much of a fuss for people because we were conditioned to believe the color tier system as law. With a horizontal progression system it runs directly counter to our instinctual understanding of what is valuable vs. what is not. You mentioned a perfect example. Additionally, the weapons seems to be contextually impacted much more than games with tiered gear systems. Like you can't just muscle an SMG in Defiance into a sniping role on demand due to recoil, ammo limitations, shared ammo pool etc. Borderlands 1 if you nabbed a Hellfire with a scope you had a flaming, full automatic, medium long to long range assault weapon with up to an 82 round magazine and massive DOT along with DPS additionally by the time you had these insane legendaries in BL1 you your character class could actively regen ammo be that through a combat skill or through a character mod. In this game you're lucky to regen a PERCENTAGE of ammo under certain circumstances limited in scope to the active perks you have equipped.

I liked the weapon system at first. It made me think I could finally just settle down with some gun I loved like Jane had Vera in Firefly and just update that baby. But with a max level weapon NOT gaining any weapon experience for the category it's like the system is contradicting it's own principles, for what purpose? I mean if it's just gonna be another AR I swap to for AR experience what is there to gain in player skill? variation, okay that's divisible by two for AR's. Burst Fire and and Full Auto but maybe full auto is what I like, so why hold me back if my gun already does full auto?

Personally after having thought about it more, I think the system is flawed by a lot. RL's generally do the same damage as a single shot sniper rifle?! Combat and Pump Shotgun damage tables are so wildly varied that just getting a shotgun doesn't mean it's gonna be a reasonable option off the bat you actually have to assess its' stopping power and effectiveness per shell. I mean the first FRC berserker shotgun I found did like 28x8 or something and I am guessing the huge tradeoff was the large magazine and high rate of fire. But what good is it if my FRC Scattershot pump does double that damage and takes two shots to kill vs. 4-6 on the berserker? IDK, it's little things like that which just make the game feel actually more UNBALANCED than balanced at least for the PVE parts. Especially when the Elite versions of anything become hell on wheels to kill before they kill you especially when they attack in mobs.

[Fiben Bolger]

I think the system is brilliant. What I think is really unhealthy is the gear grind that has come to define MMO gaming. It wasn't always that way.

No one should feel a sense of accomplishment because they've acquired a "legendary" weapon in a game. A raise at work? Yes. A better job? Yes. Making your spouse smile? Yes. Getting an "A" in school? Yes. Learning to play piano? Yes. Owning a virtual weapon in a virtual world? No.

I play for fun. I am not such a hamster on a wheel, racing but getting nowhere (owning a new legendary lmg is getting nowhere), that I can't simply appreciate the fun of playing a game. I cannot understand people who demand this stuff. Crack junkies make more sense. At least crack is an actual drug that gets you high, not a bunch of 1s and 0s on a hard drive.

It is great that advancement in this game comes not from gear, but from player skill. For me, this game combines a persistent, open world, fun, an alter ego who is allowed to shoot people in the face...and no gear grind. It is the perfect MMO that I have been waiting for for a very long time.

[Amber Fae]

I'm beginning to believe that the stats are so secondary they should have just scrapped the color system altogether. It's causing too much of a fuss for people because we were conditioned to believe the color tier system as law. With a horizontal progression system it runs directly counter to our instinctual understanding of what is valuable vs. what is not. You mentioned a perfect example. Additionally, the weapons seems to be contextually impacted much more than games with tiered gear systems. Like you can't just muscle an SMG in Defiance into a sniping role on demand due to recoil, ammo limitations, shared ammo pool etc. Borderlands 1 if you nabbed a Hellfire with a scope you had a flaming, full automatic, medium long to long range assault weapon with up to an 82 round magazine and massive DOT along with DPS additionally by the time you had these insane legendaries in BL1 you your character class could actively regen ammo be that through a combat skill or through a character mod. In this game you're lucky to regen a PERCENTAGE of ammo under certain circumstances limited in scope to the active perks you have equipped.

I liked the weapon system at first. It made me think I could finally just settle down with some gun I loved like Jane had Vera in Firefly and just update that baby. But with a max level weapon NOT gaining any weapon experience for the category it's like the system is contradicting it's own principles, for what purpose? I mean if it's just gonna be another AR I swap to for AR experience what is there to gain in player skill? variation, okay that's divisible by two for AR's. Burst Fire and and Full Auto but maybe full auto is what I like, so why hold me back if my gun already does full auto?

Personally after having thought about it more, I think the system is flawed by a lot. RL's generally do the same damage as a single shot sniper rifle?! Combat and Pump Shotgun damage tables are so wildly varied that just getting a shotgun doesn't mean it's gonna be a reasonable option off the bat you actually have to assess its' stopping power and effectiveness per shell. I mean the first FRC berserker shotgun I found did like 28x8 or something and I am guessing the huge tradeoff was the large magazine and high rate of fire. But what good is it if my FRC Scattershot pump does double that damage and takes two shots to kill vs. 4-6 on the berserker? IDK, it's little things like that which just make the game feel actually more UNBALANCED than balanced at least for the PVE parts. Especially when the Elite versions of anything become hell on wheels to kill before they kill you especially when they attack in mobs.

Thank you for taking the time to type that out, I appreciate the thought and time that went into it. and ya I'm lvl 1,233 at the moment.. i would be higher but for the past 3-4 days iv just been screwing around because grinding is soooo dull until the patch on the 15th when i can redo story missions. I had a sniper rifle up until last night that was level 20 that blew my lvl 1000 bolt action snipers out of the water. and it was a white.. lol.

[Amber Fae]

I think they seriously need to stop nerfing the physical players and give us bump ups jesus christ, we're facing 10-30 enemies with skilles equal to ours but yet they nail me from across the map with SMG's and do full damage with them BS i'm ten feet away and y damage drops so bad it's stupid. We need better shields.. ohhh 1030 wit 40 sec charge and 3 delay yeah okay, best I found is a Rhino3 with 1703 30% but like a 9. delay. it's BS bump our stats on shields and nerf the ****ing enemies. I mean I just finished the mission where have to activate all the Bulwarks and fight off the Dark matter. And that was ridiculous c'mon this is something that needs be addressed quickly. that or nerf the enemies down one gee.
Especially in Co-Op i'm EGO 726, but joining multiplayer matches in co-op with people 500-under they can't do **** to the enemies and im left doing the work it's BS.

I only find problems with shields when im in things like "moonshine shacks" but i can understand were your coming from to a point.

[Amber Fae]

I really like the weapon system. It doesn't bother me that all machineguns (LMG, SMB and assault rifles) have the same ammo pool. I mean, how often do you run low on ammo anyway? As for yellows doing more damage than oranges etc, I'm sure that's just a few patches away. And as for not getting EXP once your gun levels up, that's pretty neat. It forces you to choose if you want to keep your currently awesome gun and not get any more general weapon experience, or if you want to switch to a somewhat worse gun, but in return get more general weapon experience. I love difficult choices like this.

Its not a really "difficult choice" its more annoying then anything. someone said something along the lines of "we're supposed to be looking forword to the better guns, not looking back to bad guns" something like that which i agree with.

[PseudoCool]

First off.. I'm calling BS on the poster who said he has to do all the work in Co-Ops because of the Ego level difference. I just did a co-op this morning with a level 1128, and I had more kills and damage than he did, and I'm only at 370 right now. So horsepucky.. get some better co-op teamies next time

And I've said it before, and I'll probably say it a hundred more times.. LMG's and AR's SHOULD have the same ammo pools, but SMG's SHOULD NOT be included. When the dev's did this, they didn't listen to the players in Alpha/Beta, and it effectively nerfed all the SMG's right back to the stone age. Who wants a weapon that's max is 122pts of damage when the exact same bullet in an LMG gives you 404 damage? Even the nano effects do NOT make up for that type of difference.

I think the amount of content, for a game with massive amounts of upcoming content from being tied in with a tv show, is about right, and I am glad to see the new patch will have the ability to re-run the previous missions. That's the thing that people aren't getting.. weekly or bi-weekly updates based on the TV show tie-in for in-game activities. The Dev's haven't given us a proper or even estimated time line for that yet, but there's no way to do a tie in between the two without some pretty hefty content updates once the show goes live.

The weapons system.. oh man.. the leveling is a bit odd to get used to. The weapons don't do more damage, but have more secondary stats, which actually, when you get the right weapon, it's rather fun to work with. Getting that weapon however, can be quite the challenge. Getting the mods for that weapon to really fly, that's even harder.

I don't like that the weapon doesn't continue to increase the class xp after it's filled up, but it DOES keep you moving onto new weapons and whatnot. Which after a bit is nice, because you just retrieve the mods and scrap the weapon.. put the mods into another one and keep going (yes, I've done this with 3 LMG's so far). However.. it's a bit of a time sink, and I'd rather something smoother and more time efficient.

Overall.. I give the game a 8.5 out of 10.. the chat system being the HUGE detractor for me (and not mentioned so I'm not off topic from the OP).

[Amber Fae]

First off.. I'm calling BS on the poster who said he has to do all the work in Co-Ops because of the Ego level difference. I just did a co-op this morning with a level 1128, and I had more kills and damage than he did, and I'm only at 370 right now. So horsepucky.. get some better co-op teamies next time

I dont fully understand all that part of your post sorry XD and i gree with the AR and LMG pools but it would just be nice to have the option. and i agree ill sit here and wait for the new content. I mainly just made this thread to really see what you guys thought of it.. since iv heard a lot of "blah blah blah *terribly worded argument* blah blah stupid game" though i know a lot of you guys are better then that XD