Lack of progression will push people away.

[Jeff Kaos]

The kind of progression OP seems to be talking about, especially if it's tied up with getting better weapons and gear, would just turn Defiance into another gear grinding mmo. Grinding for better gear so you can grind for even better gear so you can grind for even better, better gear is the worst part of most mmo's. I'd rather have my skill as a player determine my success on the battlefield not my gear. Especially in a shooter. Would it be better to find über purple guns my character can hold onto for his entire life? Maybe, but I'm fine with things the way they are.

[Calinks]

I like this game alot.

At the same time I feel they messed up by not making loot and level progression a bigger deal. Those things can keep you playing until the earth ends. If you know that there are far better guns and gear out there, that you can achieve higher levels, that's enough motivation to do anything in a game. I am still enjoying the story and PVP but I can already see the time coming soon where my interest will drop due to lack of progression.

I really think they should have kept the PVP stuff on a damage curve but let us grow in single player. We should be able to get OP weapons and the like if we put in the time in to do so. That hunt for the bigger loot, cool unlocks, deeper customization is what will keep people going.

OF course there will be the die hard fans who will happy with the way thing are now but I can't help but feel like there is a major opportunity being missed here by limiting things in this way. As it stands it is not very exciting to hunt for new weapons and gear. The rewards I get from arkfalls and dropped items get sole 70 percent of the time without a second thought. I have a ton of in game cash but little reason to spend it.

The more time I put into the game the more like it feels like I am getting diminishing returns. I am def looking forward to the new content but unless it brings in new weapons and such I don't know if it will be enough to hold people long term. The addiction factor is just not high enough right now and that is most easily remedied with progressive loot and leveling.

[Old97]

This game is Schizophrenic. It's a shooter that has delusions of being an MMO, and it almost pulls it off anyway.

I'm only at EGO 621 now, but with my perks and weapons skill bonuses, plus some better weapons completely modded out, I'm doing about 25% more damage than when I started. That's not too bad.

What is kinda bad is that at EGO 5000, I might be lucky to be doing 35% more damage than when I started. That's the rub.

Perhaps we have been spoiled by the likes of Borderlands, but I do understand that this is a shooter first, with some MMO attributes tacked on. Nevertheless, the MMO elements are lacking, in my opinion. I pick up tons and tons of loot from fallen enemies, but about 99% of it ends up in the recycle matrix. I am just not finding anything better than I have now. This is contrary to what most MMOs are based on. However, it's about par for most all shooters.

Think of Black Ops or Halo...did you get much stronger and have uber-weapons as you progressed along? Nope. Those are shooters, so the gameplay is all about shooting. It's not about leveling up. You might get some better weapons as you do the various missions, but nothing too spectacular. Those shooting games are about skill sets and tactics. No so much about the power of any particular weapon.

The PVP in this game is just sad. Actually, it's kind of silly. I tried it, and then just stopped. I don't miss it at all.

Co-op is better, and can be fun at times, but I'm not a huge fan of that either.

I hate racing games with a passion. I don't like racing in a shooter...but I do like racing around and jumping over stuff. Strange...

So the jury is still out on the success of the concept--shooter/MMO. Most reviews have been 'meh' rather than enthusiastic.

Eurogamer had an interesting review---worth reading, IMO. Basically, they had fun, but couldn't quite shake an empty feeling about the content. Of course, this was written while some resolved issues weren't resolved yet by Trion. So use a grain of salt.

I hope that Trion can get the concept to work right. I like this game and think that it has potential.

However, Destiny is now on the horizon, along with a new generation of consoles...

[jnt]

The kind of progression OP seems to be talking about, especially if it's tied up with getting better weapons and gear, would just turn Defiance into another gear grinding mmo. Grinding for better gear so you can grind for even better gear so you can grind for even better, better gear is the worst part of most mmo's. I'd rather have my skill as a player determine my success on the battlefield not my gear. Especially in a shooter. Would it be better to find über purple guns my character can hold onto for his entire life? Maybe, but I'm fine with things the way they are.

Do you play Defiance? You can already do that. The weapon is just never that uber.

Very vocal members of the player base do not want their skill to be a limiting factor. Look at all the Nim complaining.

There is no real power curve in this game. Once I can aim at a head and dodge incoming fire I'm done getting better. Defiance has 1 attack key, 1 power, and then the grenade. There is no real depth there. Most of my perk slots don't really do anything either.

[Rasczak]

No treadmill for gear/weapon progression is exactly why I love this game. It was exactly why I loved CoH for several years.

I am so sick and tired of the traditional (read: needs to be retired) gear treadmill of EQ/WoW/Rift/DCUO and many others. That rates up there with tab-target/hotkey combat, which was originally conceived to compensate for the lag that early MMOs suffered from dial-up connections. Both game design systems need to be retired.

[Dazz]

It seems that any better you get in terms of ego is a wash because the mobs get harder too. Go back and kill some of the mutants in the opening missions. They aren't appreciably easier than they were the first time through, although your personal skill may be better and make you more effective.

[Lyokira]

What happened to playing games for fun? People don't play most non-MMO multiplayer games because of a sense of progression of character abilities.

[jnt]

What happened to playing games for fun? People don't play most non-MMO multiplayer games because of a sense of progression of character abilities.

Getting stronger to fight harder and harder challenges is fun for a lot of people.

Why are you talking about non-mmos? Defiance is an MMO and some form of progression is a hallmark of the genre.

[War5torm]

Getting stronger to fight harder and harder challenges is fun for a lot of people.

Why are you talking about non-mmos? Defiance is an MMO and some form of progression is a hallmark of the genre.

Exactly!

You cannot have one of the main features of your game be loot... Only to have such pathetic loot. I don't know of any other game with loot that has only like 20 different weapons lol

[Booshy]

I got my first orange weapon finally and it wasn't even better than the green one I had - talk about a downer. It sounds good on paper to say you play the game not for the loot, but for the "fun of it??" I suppose, but I'm not even about to say that's me. If there is no carrot or reward to look forward to in the actions I'm taking, interest goes out the window. And my interest in Defiance has plummeted since release that's for sure, although it's not entirely to do with the loot.