Thoughts about removed episode missions

[Cyripax NeoPrime]

what would you guys think of having an Episode Mission Menu. Where newcomers to.the game can choose which episode missions will be available on thier map such as Episode1, episode 2, etc.... This way no one has to miss out on any of the story just because they werent there from the beginning. You could make them available as solo play only after the air date , that way they would not clash with the live world co-op of the mmo. Or you can make them available as offline download experiences where the rewards are removed just so new ppl can play them and the ppl that did play them on time still get thier incentives for staying current and keeping up. or as others suggested have them all available mid season? At the least relese the cutscenes to watch in game so no one misses any of the awesome story.

Because for a game thats main Selling point is that it coincides with a tv show and vice versa, in my opinion the episode missions are far more important and relevant than any of the storys main missions or side mission(and those will be replayable) . . .the biggest thing they can do to turn ppl away from this game is taking away parts of the MAIN viewing audiences storyline or the mostly relevant parts of the storyline to the lore of what defiane is and will be to the player base/audience tht is in majority aware of the scope of wht trion Is trying to accomplish here or what the hardcore fans hope they will deliver. then they may as well just be left with the ppl who pick up the game, play the main story and side quests and trade it in for thier next big game before it loses it value. Im just sayin dont punish newcomers. Completely removing chunks of storyline is awful. I could see if this was like other mmos holiday events that really dont effect the story of the world. But this info is vital to the way ppl invest in theyre game and in the world of Defiance!

Think about it.

[fayth]

you guys are too late. nolan has left san fran and is now in the city of defiance

if you wanna meet him. wait til they give us a way to go to defiance.


im guessing the game and the tv show will have the same timeline, which means if one npc died in the tv show. he might be dead in the game as well (if he/ she's in both)

no more episode mission just means you're too late. they moved on.

[whoiscraig]

you guys are too late. nolan has left san fran and is now in the city of defiance

if you wanna meet him. wait til they give us a way to go to defiance.

Or just start a new character and meet him in the first cut scene

[Cyripax NeoPrime]

you guys are too late. nolan has left san fran and is now in the city of defiance

if you wanna meet him. wait til they give us a way to go to defiance.


im guessing the game and the tv show will have the same timeline, which means if one npc died in the tv show. he might be dead in the game as well (if he/ she's in both)

no more episode mission just means you're too late. they moved on.

By that logic, evryones too late to do the story missions and side missions too. Cos you know what, theyve already been played, case closed. Too late. Sorry. So theres no point for those to be replayable either. By ANYone. I played em already so johnny newcomer cant. Seriously theres ppl out there that if they knew about large chunks of the actual relevant story bieng taken out of the game so they cany experience the parts of the story that are actually important to the world of defiance, wouldnt even bother buying it and playing it now.

Story and side missions may be the majority of this game over episode missions. But they dont mean much in the grand scheme next to episodic content with the intertwined world trions attempting to weave here. Please read my previous post because it says it all. This new concept that trions attempting should be done right or it might fail. I find it hard to beleive they bend to the ppl who want guns nerfed, but wont give thi, what seems to be a mjor issue a way to live on without having to wait for a half a year till between seasons. Most of the ppl that will come later and decide if theyre really going to invest in this will want the whole story experience. We cant just have the mentallity that things should only cater to those of us who were here from the beginning and had all the time needed to do everything when it was given. This int some holiday content crap from w.o.w., its large chunks of the main story that directly effect the selling point of this game and tv show(bieng two worlds that feed off each other) why should newcomers care about investing i.to the story, if they cant really invest into the whole experience?

Im sorry, but time sensitive content should never have a direct impact on the core of the story. And I know thats exactly what the point of this new concept is. But at least have an on demand rerun menu in game so newcomers can watch those parts of the story so they can feel invested and feel it was money and time well spent . They dont have to get the rewards. Not everyone is going to surf around youtube looking for episode missions to watch. Thats just another terrible solution. No one should have an objection to having a solution to this. Especially if the reward arent given outpast the episode air dates. Just cos we were all here from the jump gives us a sense of entitlement to be az-holes? NO! Who raised you that way? The ppl thinking like that are all saying "hey trion, dont plan on having any new customers! What you got now is all you deserve" I dont understand the fierce objection to this, its not going to hurt you. Yall got your outfits and guns just like I do. But I dont mind. In fact ive invested into everything about this game and went all out. Ultimate edition, season pass, cash shop inventory stacks, im spending money and supporting trion. Why shouldnt they invest in what the fans want? Or what future potential customers will want?

[Starcore]

I really dont care, i missed out on the first set. But sometimes u miss out on things. I just want to have fun, i dont think by not having the first set of missions done is going to hold me back so far, that playing the game becomes pointless.

I just like to shotgun things in the face!

[EdgeTW]

I'm really not sure why anyone would object to episode content remaining around longer or even forever. Once you complete the mission it's no longer available to you. So why would anyone complain about what sorts of missions other players still have access to?

When you finish the main storyline, other players are still playing it. You kill the robot guarding the Golden Gate bridge, yet for other people it remains intact. It will be killed a million times without your knowledge.

So.. why care if someone can still participate in (example) the initial Nolan and Irisa adventures we had at launch? Because of the way phasing works, you can't see those NPCs anymore once you complete the mission. What does it matter if others still can, and can still do the missions long after you've completed them? How is that unlike any other content in the game?

Some of the people on the forum opposing these very reasonable requests are coming across as control freaks. They insist people play the game the way they want to play it, at the pace they want to set.. they need to understand this is not their personal single-player game. They're in an MMO and playing with hundreds of thousands of other players, and every one of them has the same expectations of having fun as they do. They need to focus more on their own gameplay experience, which is in no way impacted when someone else is playing through episode content they've already completed, and stop sticking their noses where it doesn't belong.

If someone wants to finish the episodic content between weekly episodes, then just do that. Nobody is stopping anyone from rushing through everything. Just stop trying to dictate the pace for everyone else.

[Lantheus]

I agree with Ceridwyn, the week to react to a Episode mission is to short. There are a lot of content that helps you experience the show and back story that is in these episode mission that can be longer then short week. To lose that experience because of RL items really sucks, I work and have to travel that takes me away from the house more then a week at a time. (Also I have purchased the season pass for the game.)

I missed the first Episode mission, but played it in BETA. I was going to do the mission but it was not available due to main mission which locked out other missions, which to me is a bug and should allow cross over. Which in the scope of the game created a barrier to finish. I think that many of the EMission should be left up longer to allow the individual time to do the mission get the back story and be able to enjoy the game.

To me the festivals events should have a time period, but mission that will enhance the Episode should be kept. Not only for the prolong game experience but the long term show experience.

[Lantheus]

I think it would be great to have an episode guide menu, or run the Episode Mission in order and in the end tie it to the TV Episode so you can go back and watch. On the Episode mission you run it with the rare loot, then remove the rare loot and make a different loot available, then you are told to watch "Pilot Episode" to see the story tie in. The Episode mission should be left there in an order chain.

[Kommissar Kaede]

Some of the people on the forum opposing these very reasonable requests are coming across as control freaks. They insist people play the game the way they want to play it, at the pace they want to set.. they need to understand this is not their personal single-player game. They're in an MMO and playing with hundreds of thousands of other players, and every one of them has the same expectations of having fun as they do. They need to focus more on their own gameplay experience, which is in no way impacted when someone else is playing through episode content they've already completed, and stop sticking their noses where it doesn't belong.

First, let me say, I understand what you want to do, but there are a few underlying reasons why I agree with the removal of content. If you would set aside your objections and attacks as you read, that would be greatly appreciated.

I think its important to ask first, why is Defiance an MMO? Seriously, why? Much of the game can be completed solo (especially if the encounters are balanced as such). The community interface is already pretty poor, enough to make it feel single-player. Cash-shops have been done with single-player games before (although not popular I guess, Dead Space 2 is an example). Limited co-op/multiplayer maps are already a part of the game.

Obviously security/cheat prevention/obfuscated DRM is a possible reason, but an always-online game can do that as well. So why didn't they just make a single-player game with episodic content releases, and just let you play each packaged set of content for each episode?

About the only idea that comes to my mind is that they wanted to make a world. They wanted a place where, while you are completing some random roadside emergency, another player can drive up alongside you and help out, or keep on driving. They wanted ark-falls to compel people to drive across the map and join in when they can. They wanted to create a sense that something is happening. And to some extent, without even bothering with considering the show, they have achieved this.

Now, next to this idea of making a world, is a desire to tie the game in with a now in-progress TV show. Whether it be marketing, or just a cool idea, this is a stated goal of the game. This is where we get the idea of episodic content from.

Deeper in this idea is that as the show moves on, the game world will change accordingly. Even further is that this occurs as the show is airing, or that, the show itself is a "living thing" alongside the game world. Both changing as a result of the other (and outside the actions of any single player).

It would not be a living world if things only changed as a result of only a players actions. Outside forces have to be considered as well. Otherwise, once again, why is this an MMO and not a single-player game?

Now, to address the desire of always having episodic content available, I think it is meaningful to recognize it may not always be a "mission." As we're seeing with the pilgrims, it may just be new emergencies. It may be new dynamic content. It may be highly inappropriate for said dynamic content to be present all the time (say an invasion force comes in one week and must be fought off by the players). Said episodic content could be quite meaningful to the tie-in (unlike how many consider the pilgrim emergencies right now). Even with phasing, there is not much of a good explanation to leave that content out there, just to make it accessible to all the players. And emergencies need to be spawned on the server end, not on the local client end.

My point is that a "living world" is a far superior form of content than any mere mission can ever provide. A living world provides a sense of community, a shared "I was there" feeling. yes, some will be left out, and turn some away, but an equal many will be drawn further in, wanting to be a part of the next big thing that happens.

Ultimately, this debate is pointless, there have been a few recent statements by devs stating a possible returning of said content. And this fine. This actually means that they realize that they cannot deliver on a truly "living world" experience, and as such, there is no point to withhold the content.

To me this doesn't mean the "other side" won, but rather that we've all lost.

TL;DR;
Hard to really say if you opted not to read it. I am trying to lay out the logic behind wanting to remove the episodic content as the new week comes (or rather when its appropriate to be removed), and show that it is not rooted in selfishness.

[Markise]

First, let me say, I understand what you want to do, but there are a few underlying reasons why I agree with the removal of content. If you would set aside your objections and attacks as you read, that would be greatly appreciated.

I think its important to ask first, why is Defiance an MMO? Seriously, why? Much of the game can be completed solo (especially if the encounters are balanced as such). The community interface is already pretty poor, enough to make it feel single-player. Cash-shops have been done with single-player games before (although not popular I guess, Dead Space 2 is an example). Limited co-op/multiplayer maps are already a part of the game.

Obviously security/cheat prevention/obfuscated DRM is a possible reason, but an always-online game can do that as well. So why didn't they just make a single-player game with episodic content releases, and just let you play each packaged set of content for each episode?

About the only idea that comes to my mind is that they wanted to make a world. They wanted a place where, while you are completing some random roadside emergency, another player can drive up alongside you and help out, or keep on driving. They wanted ark-falls to compel people to drive across the map and join in when they can. They wanted to create a sense that something is happening. And to some extent, without even bothering with considering the show, they have achieved this.

Now, next to this idea of making a world, is a desire to tie the game in with a now in-progress TV show. Whether it be marketing, or just a cool idea, this is a stated goal of the game. This is where we get the idea of episodic content from.

Deeper in this idea is that as the show moves on, the game world will change accordingly. Even further is that this occurs as the show is airing, or that, the show itself is a "living thing" alongside the game world. Both changing as a result of the other (and outside the actions of any single player).

It would not be a living world if things only changed as a result of only a players actions. Outside forces have to be considered as well. Otherwise, once again, why is this an MMO and not a single-player game?

Now, to address the desire of always having episodic content available, I think it is meaningful to recognize it may not always be a "mission." As we're seeing with the pilgrims, it may just be new emergencies. It may be new dynamic content. It may be highly inappropriate for said dynamic content to be present all the time (say an invasion force comes in one week and must be fought off by the players). Said episodic content could be quite meaningful to the tie-in (unlike how many consider the pilgrim emergencies right now). Even with phasing, there is not much of a good explanation to leave that content out there, just to make it accessible to all the players. And emergencies need to be spawned on the server end, not on the local client end.

My point is that a "living world" is a far superior form of content than any mere mission can ever provide. A living world provides a sense of community, a shared "I was there" feeling. yes, some will be left out, and turn some away, but an equal many will be drawn further in, wanting to be a part of the next big thing that happens.

Ultimately, this debate is pointless, there have been a few recent statements by devs stating a possible returning of said content. And this fine. This actually means that they realize that they cannot deliver on a truly "living world" experience, and as such, there is no point to withhold the content.

To me this doesn't mean the "other side" won, but rather that we've all lost.

TL;DR;
Hard to really say if you opted not to read it. I am trying to lay out the logic behind wanting to remove the episodic content as the new week comes (or rather when its appropriate to be removed), and show that it is not rooted in selfishness.

This is the best response from anyone I've seen as to why episodic missions should stay.