Still wow-clone mind.Originally Posted by jnt
Defiance has no endgame, because you enter and play for fun and when you have no more fun you logout. There are lot of things to do, not only the main mission, but if you are not having fun and you need an endgame where you pointless grind for gear tier 1-2-1000 in instances to be able to complete the next instance, Defiance is the wrong game
The biggest problem in computers, and in MMOs: PEBKAC
I solo the 4man coops, with no perks, and noob weapon, i didnt recieve anything for it. Ive dont it with a full party and still got the same as if i solo'd, Again weres the reward?
Wait, grinding levels, but arent you grinding ego? Samething, but in your mind it feel different huh?
Reward? Is a game or a work? Do you prefer the carrot-on-a-stick theme park ?
The biggest problem in computers, and in MMOs: PEBKAC
No dip****. I play games for challenge, co op tactics, and occasionally because a game may just be insanely gorgeous or related to IPs I adore.
Defiance was easy, co op was lame, and the graphics are on the nice side of passable. Defiance was on the lackluster side of rewarding for the first two.
stitch
I assume you meant rewards for skill based game play. The reward doesn't have to be an item, it can be satisfaction from the completion or a high rank on a leader board, just like it is with a lobby based game. Even if it was an item though, as the OP said, most games are pretty pointless overall. The reward of an item gets pretty pointless in Borderlands as well.
Really, it comes down to WHY we play games to being with. If we play a game for story completion, we can usually resolve the current main story set in a day or two, and wait for new content and DLC. If we play it to develop a character and feel good about making a character who can now crush everything from last week in a single blow, there's much repetition, and content made obsolete, leaving very little content once we've peaked, again, until new content is made. If we play it for personal satisfaction for leader boards and bragging rights, it's likely the same event over and over with different people. If we play it for loot, what do we do after we get "the best" loot?
Strong story focus, means limited replay value, and generally a short play time (Bioshock series). Focus on character/item progression? Generally an illusion, since the enemies will also scale in difficulty, until they eventually plateau, meaning any replayability would lose appeal and lock you into an end-zone(WoW, D3). Focus on leaderboards, you deal with the same levels over and over, with different characters, and a massive difference between noobs and l33ts (tf2, dota2, l4d)
Really, at the end, it's all the same, and a matter of balancing all of these things in an enjoyable package. Is it possible?
Your Challenger won't drive? You're probably in the passenger seat.
Can't sell/delete an item? Check all of your loadouts, it's likely still equipped.
Auction house? Why? It'll just render bits purchased lock boxes pointless, and weapons are mostly equal anyway.
Gear/enemy progression? No thanks, it'll only render 90% of the content trivial when you reach the highest zone.
Everything you do has a reward or you wouldn't bother. Games and work both have rewards. Accomplishment, excitement, rent, whatever.
stitch
The reward for entertainment is to be entertained.
Edited to avoid massive quotes rather then avoiding anything you said.
Sense of accomplishment is a great reward that comes through challenges. I felt that way after Nim. I know Defiance could do it. The rest of the game, at least for me, is so easy as to deprive me of any sense of accomplishment at all. Probably the root of my issue there.
stitch
Ok let's go at it with semantics. No. Entertainment isn't a reward for itself, it is reward for other things. You can find tasks or experiences entertaining. Not all movies are entertaining to all people. Your entertainment center at home is not a promise of entertainment.
If the actions you take in the game are not things you find entertaining and there is nothing forcing you to participate then you don't bother.
stitch
You've misread what I said. I said the game rewards the skill of the player, instead of rewarding the the amount of time/effort you've put into grinding/farming.
This means that a person who has just started the game, but has been playing shooters for years, will be able to play with, or against, a person with 5000 EGO, and pure orange gear, and be able to compete.
In a game like WoW where you are expected to farm levels, and grind XP, a level 1 player, cannot even come close to making an impact against a person playing for 5 years with top end gear. The reason for this? They make money from keeping you grinding up levels. If it takes you a year to grind up to get great gear, to be in the top end, they've pocketed a year of subscription fees :P
Your Challenger won't drive? You're probably in the passenger seat.
Can't sell/delete an item? Check all of your loadouts, it's likely still equipped.
Auction house? Why? It'll just render bits purchased lock boxes pointless, and weapons are mostly equal anyway.
Gear/enemy progression? No thanks, it'll only render 90% of the content trivial when you reach the highest zone.
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